A little 9/11 Truth trivia for ya...

Feds Go All Out to Kill Spy Suit

"When the government told a court Friday that it wanted a class-action lawsuit regarding the National Security Agency's eavesdropping on Americans dismissed, its lawyers wielded one of the most powerful legal tools available to the executive branch -- the state secrets privilege."

When has the Administration used the "State Secrets Privilege" before?

Whistleblower Sibel Edmonds - state secrets privilege used to gag her?

You need to ask Cheney where the passangers are. They may have been "pulled."

My fellow Citizens for 9/11 Truth,

We had another breakthrough day for the movement. 9/11 truth was covered by both USA Today and CNN in one 24 hour period. What this shows is how much the movement has grown. It also indicates that people in high places are trembling at what we say. So now they send their media lynch-mobs to do hit pieces against our cause.

The truth movement has grown because so many courageous Americans put their reputations on the line. We have stood up for something that has been labeled Un-American, by our government, media and society as a whole. We have been called Conspiracy Theorist, Conspiracy Nuts, Nut Jobs, Con-Artists along with many other undesirable labels. But through it all we have endured.

And now a significant part of our country knows the truth of 9/11. That means the Main Stream Media; along with the powers that be, can no longer afford to ignore our efforts. The Media are threatened by this movement because we are interfering with their ability to dictate reality to the American public. These corporate media powerhouses have shown themselves complicit in the cover-up of the crime of the century. And having no shame of their criminal activities, these liars continue to distort the news.

Since they no longer can publicly ignore us, the elite are attempting to smear the 9/11 Truth Movement instead. They want to marginalize our efforts to the tabloid news, hoping that the public wonÂ’t take the facts of 9/11 seriously. They do this by focusing solely on the peripheral details of 9/11 that are widely debated within the movement over the internet. For example; pods being under the aircrafts that hit the trade centers. Issues such as these are difficult to prove. But at the same time; the media choose to ignore the more obvious inconsistencies such as WTC 7. But this desperate attempt at distorting the truth will not work for long.

America already knows that itÂ’s being lied to by the government and mass media. Because of issues like Iraq, Weapons of Mass Destructions, warrantless wire tapping, and the mistreating of prisoners at Abu Graeb, along with so many other misdeeds; America no longer trust itÂ’s public officials. And current polls indicate that Americans are concerned about the direction the country is heading. They are also fed-up of the policies of the current administration. Even worse is the congress who has been unresponsive to the demands of its citizens of taking this present administration to task over its policies. The citizens of this country feel that the government is not serving their interests.

The America citizens have (to use a biblical term) itching ears, meaning they are ready to hear the truth. In light of all of this, we have no better opportunity to get the truth out to an accepting public. The ground is now more fertile than its ever going to be. So it is my encouragement to the truth movement, to be even more vigilant in standing up for the truth. Lets not be discouraged by the negative publicity, because those are coming whether we deserve them or not. But lets continue to be committed to the grassroots efforts that has gotten us to this point.

Yes, using mass media can get our message out to the public much faster. But, as we saw the other day, their desire is not the same as ours. So we should not look to them to help our cause. Yet, take whatever exposure we get and use it to our advantage. Lets continue talking about the facts of 9/11 to friends and strangers alike. Keep handing out pamphletÂ’s, and DVDÂ’s, and showing screenings. Challenge people who believe the official version with the actual facts.

If we keep this up, WE CANNOT LOSE!!! And eventually those who committed this heinous crime will be brought to justice. Keep up the good work!!

To my knowledge, she is "ready to talk"...

Ask questions. Demand answers.
America's government shouldn't be hiding information about 9/11
http://www.star.niu.edu/articles/?id=23821

The State Secrets Privilege should be invalid when it is utilized to conceal high treason.

"And it helps that I spotted the fake TV airplane on "day one"."

Please stop.

GOD DAMN IT...

It is NOT our "Theories" that will break this wide open. It is the MASSIVE amount of facts that we have collected.

FACTS

1. Bush DID NOT want to investigate 9/11.
2. Bush tried to limit the scope of the Congressional Inquiry.
3. The Congressional Inquiry was headed by two individuals who met with a financier of 9/11 on 9/11 in Washington D.C.
4. The Congressional Inquiry redacted 28 pages in their final report.
5. The family members had to FIGHT against Washington D.C. in order to get them to create the so-called "9/11 Commission".
6. The 9/11 Commission was not created as the families wanted, and was instead filled with people who shouldn't have been ANYWHERE near that investigation.
7. The 9/11 Commission didn't bother to answer the list of questions submitted to them by the same family members who fought for its' creation.
8. The 9/11 Commission's final report was NOT complete by ANY stretch of the imagination.

and so on and so on and so on and so on...

The freakin' list goes ON AND ON

It is the facts that will get them.

NOT the theories.

Jon, how does one turn off italics & bolding? (I know how to turn it on, but not off.)

THEORIES

1. A missile hit the Pentagon.
2. The WTC was brought down by Controlled Demolition.
3. The planes were flown by remote control.
4. The Wargames were used to interfere with any possible response by our military.
5. CGI was used on the videos of the planes hitting the towers.
6. They used holograms instead of real planes.

and so on and so on and so on...

You have to use HTML...

Jon,

yes, 5 and 6 are theories, but i hate to even consider them that.. we've got some real good theories, and some real bat-shit nutty ones.. and unfortunately certain people push the latter type first onto people who might otherwise have become interested in the subject.

All of them are theories. ALL OF THEM

It's the GARGANTUAN collection of facts that brings us to the ultimate theory.

It wasn't who we were told that pulled it off, but elements within our Government.

I'm sorry if I offend anyone, but I've been doing this long enough to know a few things.

(Been away for a while. Change of ISP)

The Shadow Government:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/cenk-uygur/the-shadow-government_b_20110.html

Latest Penn and teller Bullshit brings up the aftermath of the disasterious efforts to rebuild something on ground zero. Nothing new to us in the movement, but it was interesting nonetheless, even though P & T still promote the official Black pope attacked us for our freedoms BS.

Sorry dude, I don't agree:

2. The WTC was brought down by Controlled Demolition.

Controlled Demolition of World Trade Center Is Now a Fact, Not a Theory:
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=viewArticle&code=20051021...

Mary doesn't seem to want to correct her story (emails bottom to top):

Hi Ben,
I know that Scholars for 9/11 Truth are involved with how the twin
towers collapsed. Period. I meant that if their supposition is true,
that there was more to the story than the official line, then it
dovetails with questions others have raised about the day. For the
people who believe the jet did not crash into the Pentagon, what
happened to those passengers?
Mary Pat

_____Original Message_____
From: Ben Stearman
Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2006 10:48 AM
To: mhyland@pressconnects.com
Subject: Re: Big screen too small for 9/11 story

Mary,

You wrote:
"Some argue that it's not only too soon to Hollywoodize the events of
that day, it's too soon to accept the official line. Some find that 93's passengers' "let's roll" was too easily adopted as the battle cry for
the war on terror. Scholars for 9/11 Truth say there is evidence
suggesting the twin towers were brought down by controlled explosions
and that the official line is a hoax. *(Maybe they could answer a
nagging question -- if the passenger jet did not crash into the
Pentagon, where are its passengers?)*"

Scholars for 9/11 Truth never suggested that a plane /didn't/ crash into the Pentagon, yet you imply that they have. Please correct your story.

Ben

I know the argument for Controlled Demolition is VERY STRONG, and you bet your ass I want it investigated properly without bias, however, I still believe the idea of Controlled Demolition is a theory.

Even Professor Jones says it's a hypothesis.

a lot of those theories are promoted by the traitors to confuse the masses - it's called disinformation and there's a lot of it out there... and it's only going to get worse.

Absolutely focus on the "provables" and organize the rest of it as back-up ammo.

We can prove it was a demolition for #1, #2, #6 and #7.

And quite frankly - that's all we need to prove.

If we can grow some balls and just do that, the domino's will fall.

FOCUS

Jon,
Your list of 'Facts' could all be explained by a government trying to cover up its own incompetance or negligence. I don't believe it directly points to any government involvement in 911.
As we know this administration and the media are quite happy , at the appropriate time, to claim ignorance and incompetatnce to avoid any further inquiry into intentional criminality.
Just look at the Iraq war!!!!!!!!!

What other facts would you suggest that would avoid this potential problem.
(once again, with all humility...)

Jon, the weight of the evidence effectively proves controlled demolition. And demolition blows the official lie sky high.

Bring it on!!!

"Jon,
Your list of 'Facts' could all be explained by a government trying to cover up its own incompetance or negligence. I don't believe it directly points to any government involvement in 911.

As we know this administration and the media are quite happy , at the appropriate time, to claim ignorance and incompetatnce to avoid any further inquiry into intentional criminality.
Just look at the Iraq war!!!!!!!!!

What other facts would you suggest that would avoid this potential problem.
(once again, with all humility...)"

#3 and #7 point to "inside job".

Why did leaders of our Government meet with a financier of 9/11?

Why weren't questions answered that may have lead to complicity regarding our Government?

It's the cumulative list of facts that can ONLY lead in one direction.

#1, to me, points DIRECTLY to inside job.

It wasn't a group of individuals within Government who didn't want to investigate 9/11. It was a VERY specific group who didn't want to. A VERY VERY VERY specific group. The Bush Administration.

Hate the birds. :(
thats ok, nobodys perfect...(joke).... you are still the #1 Coincident Theory (Official Story) Debunker out there

I think Philly sports teams are cursed. Go Flyers. :(

should be 911facts with an 's' on the end.. not singular.

if you guys wanna organize a group to work on it and need anything let me know.. i could swing the money for a year registration and hosting if need be.

Thanks.

I would not put myself on that kind of pedastal.

I don't know about the passengers of 77 it's a good question if it was not a 757 that hit the pentogon, and I have no doubt after serching the evidence that the trade center was controlled demolition, and most of all I KNOW for a FACT that 93 was being tailed by 2 f-16's or some type of military aircraft, You see I live in Akron Ohio 30 miles south of Cleveland.
I remember that day like it was yesterday, I saw 93 heading east with throtles wide open and roreing like a bat out of hell ( no pun intended ) and I also seen with my own eyes and heard with My own ears 2 fighter jets hot on it's tail and screaming like a bat out of hell.
I know of several others who saw what I saw too. now in all fairness Shankville is 200 or so mile east of Akron so I did not see it shot down, but one thing is a fact it was being chased by 2 fighters. ( thats a fact )

Good work Jon. As is obvious to anyone who reads my posts, I'm a strong advocate of sticking to the facts. The odds of any one of us being able to come up with a theory that is any more credible than the official story are slim.

The thing is, we have the luxury of not needing to know what happened. We know that some fishy stuff went on, and we have proof of that. We can't open ourselves up to criticism by propogating ridiculous theories.

911facts.net it is.

Any suggestions can be mailed to
911HijackerDotCom@gmail.com

I'm also interested in putting together a corresponding video package (I'm not a no-planer, I'm uncertain about CD, but I definitely believe in prior knowledge and a coverup, particularly using this catastrophe for political, global, and military advantage)

Send me whatever information you feel should be included. I will fact check as well as check for rebuttals, etc (I think the site needs COUNTER ARGUMENTS as well, and then COUNTERS to the COUNTER ARGUMENTS)

carn--"Good work Jon. As is obvious to anyone who reads my posts, I'm a strong advocate of sticking to the facts."

Then why do you so often bash Loose Change 2? You seem more critical of that key video than of the Official 9/11 Report. Sort of makes you look like a slick disinfo agent when you do that. You know that the Gov't is very worried about LC2. Why help the Gov'y in trying to discredit LC2?

DHS
You'll be hearing from me. I just saved your E-mail addy.

btw
what's up with the name for your e-mail addy?

Dennis,

your account is very interesting.

Could you do me a favor and answer the following questions as exactly as possible?

1) Which time was it?

2) Which altitude was UA 93 (and the fighters) ?

3) Was UA 93 climbing, going down, or keeping the altitude?

3) Which direction was UA 93 heading (east, southeast...) ?

Thanks a lot,

Woody

"Then why do you so often bash Loose Change 2? You seem more critical of that key video than of the Official 9/11 Report. Sort of makes you look like a slick disinfo agent when you do that. You know that the Gov't is very worried about LC2. Why help the Gov'y in trying to discredit LC2?"

Have you watched it? Where are the facts? All I see is undocumented speculation and non-expert opinion.

And no, I really don't think the government is worried about Loose Change. Perhaps they should be, insomuch as it invites people to investigate things, but on its face, it is a liability. Oh and please feel free to call me a disinfo agent, Mr. McCarthy. I thought we were over that.

btw
what's up with the name for your e-mail addy?
Mike Jr. | 05.02.06 - 3:23 pm | #

911Hijacker.com is my website also...

I've registered 911facts.net

right now it is just forwarding to 911blogger.com hope you guys don't mind.

DHS,

oh noes, don't do that! ;)

http://www.crisispapers.org/features/corres.htm

I hope everyone can take a step back and realize what we're trying to accomplish. The goal of this movement is not to distort facts and do anything we can to try to make the Bush administration look guilty. The goal of this movement is to discover truth.

While some of you may think that the end justifies the means, I do not. If we have to stoop to using flimsy arguments, non-expert opinion, distortion of facts, and mindless speculation in order to present our case, how are we different than the Bush administration and its various media lapdogs? Because we think we're right? They think they're right too!

The way we will find success is by figuring out how to create a sharp relief between us and those parties on either side of us, namely the right-wing that runs the country, and the nutjobs that most people think of when they hear the phrase "conspiracy theory."

We obviously do a good job of differentiating ourselves from the ring-wing. What we do a terrible job of is differentiating ourselves from the tinfoil hat wearing alien invasion and black helicopters crowd.

Before you continue with your attacks against me, tell me this: What have I done wrong? If pointing out dishonesty and distortion is not allowed in the movement, then what is the movement?

I've been asked what my favorite movie/book on the topic is. This is difficult for me. I've read several books and have watched most every movie on the topic I can find. While most do at least a decent job of presenting information that increases my desire to study, almost every one of them also presents speculation and theory as well.

I must say that Stephen Jones is a possible exception, as I love almost everything he has said and written, and he usually refuses to take part in speculation. He tends to stick to a pretty limited subject of discussion, that which he knows most about, and leaves the inevitable conjecture to others. He hasn't really produced any books/movies though so I don't know if he counts. I guess I'll call him my favorite lecturer/article writer.

Anyway, I hope that people can understand where I'm coming from and respect me for it. If loving Loose Change and its style of psuedo-journalism is requisite for membership in our little community, then I guess I'll move on. I just hope we can all realize what that says about the movement itself.

Then why do you so often bash Loose Change 2? You seem more critical of that key video than of the Official 9/11 Report. Sort of makes you look like a slick disinfo agent when you do that. You know that the Gov't is very worried about LC2. Why help the Gov'y in trying to discredit LC2?
Anonymous | 05.02.06 - 3:14 pm | #
good point. he keeps going and going.......

youve said it oh so many times before though carn. over and over. we get it. we in "the movement" disagree ALL the time if you didnt notice. but you keep going on and on and on.

bashing loose change 2? no problem, it happens all the time from outside and inside the movement.bashing loose change on almost every single thread every day, many times unprovoked? seems like a little much to me.

Answer me this Chris. What's more important: Truth or Loose Change. You're so enamoured with this "key" video, that you feel compelled to defend it at every turn. Why is it so hard to understand that someone may agree with the movement but disagree with manipulation of fact? If this movement is based on Loose Change, then I'll go find my own movement.

I will also ask this, Chris: Why can you not be civil? Why can you not argue the facts? Are you that blinded by Loose Change that you can't even be rational in its defense? Why do you treat me like a child in pointing out something that I obviously already know (how we disagree all the time)?

oh that was me. Not sure why my name got erased.

Also, you'll notice that I said nothing about Loose Change until you brought it up. I don't have any particular disdain for it, any more than all the other videos/books that present speculation as fact and distort truth in order to strengthen weak arguments.

truth, carn, and Loose Change has opened more eyes to FINDING the truth than any other single 9/11 movie/website.your endless bashing of it is puzzling.like i said, to point out its flaws is one thing, to stay on thread after thread bashing it is just puzzling to me.i only defend it at every turn because you bash it at every turn.i never had to defend it before you got here.except from typival Bush slaves and people like shill King. makes a guy think about what your motives are.

"Loose Change has opened more eyes to FINDING the truth than any other single 9/11 movie/website"

I'm aware of this and you know it.

"your endless bashing of it is puzzling"

Ok give me examples where I've bashed it when it was not already the topic of debate. Feel free to exclude any topic in which you preemptively defended it because you assumed (wrongly) that I was going to "bash" it.

"i only defend it at every turn because you bash it at every turn"

Wrong, and if you were being intellectually honest, you'd know that. Again, you brought it up this time and most times previously.

"makes a guy think about what your motives are."

Ok you're right. I'm on the US government payroll. All my pro-truth talk has been a cover so that I can occasionally bash an obviously flimsy film. You win Chris. You're a bleepity bleep bleep, but you win.

Admin: chill out pplEdited By Siteowner

there is an old saying here in tennessee.. well, i know its in texas, its probably here in tennesse.. it says: 'the only way to win an arguement on the internet is to stop responding'.

or something.

dz lol nice bushism to start that line

Yizzo--

I read most of the Crisis Papers piece, and was reminded that I'm much more annoyed by hearing potential allies defend the official conspiracy theory than I am by hearing it defended by the usual flag hags and war whores. It's as demoralizing as hearing a Democrat bash Bush and then say, "If only Kerry was President...."

I don't understand how the left can continue to buy into the government's mythology about 9/11 and still turn around and act surprised that they can't get any traction when it comes to repealing the Patriot Act or ending our invasions and occupations in the Middle East. Worse than that, they don't even discuss the history of our relations with that region or the grievances people from that region have against us. They insist on portraying everything done by Bush and his cabal as incompetent bungling, instead of as failed but deliberate attempts to smash other countries and assume control of them.

And, just as when I argue with moderate liberals and other Democrats on other websites, I'm left more convinced than ever that people will insist on believing bullshit until the whole shithouse goes up in flames.

It's damn depressing.

carn--"I hope everyone can take a step back and realize what we're trying to accomplish. The goal of this movement is not to distort facts and do anything we can to try to make the Bush administration look guilty. The goal of this movement is to discover truth."

But Bush & Co. are responsible! I want them held accountable now, not 100 years later.

--"While some of you may think that the end justifies the means, I do not. If we have to stoop to using flimsy arguments, non-expert opinion, distortion of facts, and mindless speculation in order to present our case, how are we different than the Bush administration and its various media lapdogs? Because we think we're right? They think they're right too!"

You really, really sound like a disinfo agent to me with this nonsense!

your right timbermonkey......:(

i argue on most urban forums for younger people so most of the "young dems" agree with LC2E and other videos...its young conservatives who i have the most problems with. and the problem i have with young conserv's is that THEY feel the most pain from this admin (High Gas, Threat of A Draft, More Scruitny (pre martial law)in everyday social life,) and they still justify it :-O i think people are influenced by their parents/role model beliefs more than i thought

You really, really sound like a disinfo agent to me with this nonsense!

first and foremost any and everybody that criticize us should not automatically be called a disinfo agent. that is very dangerous territory that you are stepping into and borderline childish

second he has a very valid point.....whenever you go to trial you dont bring the most speculative or weakest arguments to try to convict someone, you have to bring sound hard core evidence... That is why OJ got off, no sound hard core evidence

One type of computer software which might help in the compilation of facts, links, graphics, videos,etc is a "concept map", another digital tool available for free to learning communities.

See“LEO: A Learning Environment Organizer to Support Computer-Mediated Instruction”, John W. Coffey and Alberto J. Canas, Journal for Educational Technology Systems 31(3), pp. 275-290 (2003).

http://cmap.ihmc.us/Publications/ResearchPapers/LEO-A%20Learning%20Envir...

As a “map”, it allows the individual learner or learning team to forecast where it is going, chart its progress, and forge an individualized learning path. It combines “… text, graphics, audio, video, links to Web pages, etc., that are associated with concepts.” It is “… essentially a meta-cognitive tool” and “… has significant utility to support just in time learning for performance support.”

“CmapTools is a software suite that is in ongoing development at the Institute for Human and Machine Cognition (IHMC), The University of West Florida. This tool is built as a distributed knowledge modeling system that enables learning and collaboration over the Internet…. [It] has been used to acquire knowledge for expert systems, for institutional memory preservation, performance support, and potentially, as content for instruction in a course.”

For further information, see
http://www.ihmc.us/ and http://cmap.ihmc.us/.

I believe you can still download the software for free. It is PC-compatible and is designed to be shared among many users like a wiki. In the long run, a server is required.

Yizzo, you think there aren't disinfo agents out there? Were you born yesterday?

He doesn't have a point about anything. LC2 is the best tool we have for spreading the truth.

Wake up!

"While some of you may think that the end justifies the means, I do not. If we have to stoop to using flimsy arguments, non-expert opinion, distortion of facts, and mindless speculation in order to present our case, how are we different than the Bush administration and its various media lapdogs? Because we think we're right? They think they're right too!"

HOW DOES THE ABOVE DOUBLE-TALK APPLY TO LC2???

Maybe you haven't noticed, but there is an obvious campaign out there to discredit LC2 & the other truth videos.

Don't aide the gov't by promoting in this deceit also.

Do you hear Thomas Kean saying that the 9/11 report is rife with errors, omissions, & lies???