The typical response is extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof, but it's the story of 19 hijackers which needs extraordinary proof of which there is very little.
By framing the debate that the OV is not extraordinary the people who support the OV are putting all of the onus on those who dispute the OV when the reality is that the OV is an extraordinary claim.
We need to turn it around and make them defend the extraordinary claim of 19 hijackers eluding the entire air defense system.

Glenn, the perpetrators made some mistakes. What do you expect from arrogant maniacs? As Rummy might say, they did the best they could with what they had available. Also, it wasn't our entire gov't behind the operation. They couldn't think of nor close every single loophole.

Your post seems designed to invent doubt where there really is none. They demolished WTC1 & 2 before your eyes, and WTC7 as well, whether you admit it or not, so get used to the idea!

There's anumber of so called 9/11 truth sites that I find highly suspicious and disengenuous.

You see, while I do believe Flight 77 hit the pentagon, I dont call any site promoting this "disinfo". It's the intention of the site. If a site is saying no planes hit any building, it was all fake, the passengers are still alive or were secretly taken away, and any other nonsense like "the Jews being behind it", I start to question what their real motive is. See I dont agree with a lot of Loose Change, but their heart is in the right place. Thats the BIG DIFFERENCE between them, and say WingTV whose main goal is to attack the 9/11 truth movement, or IamtheWitness and that Huschmind site that blames everything on "evil Jews".

The Dutch have been really supportive of the effort.

I'm starting to think we might be outsourcing patriotism to the Dutch :)
Hey, if they're doing a better job at carrying the movement than most Americans, then so be it.
They're all up in the movement, everywhere I look, there's a good ol' Dutch person assisting in the efforts. Thankfully :)

seriously, i see more Dutch people than any other group except americans.if i remember correctly, it was the Dutch that made that amazing documentary on The Carlyle Group.

I'm Dutch myself. Been awaken to the truth of 9/11 for about 2 years now.

Was Election 2004 Stolen?

The one from Kennedy...

Controversial Documentary "America: From Freedom To Fascism" Gets Standing Ovation At Cannes Film Fest...
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2006/06/01/controversial-documentary_n_220...

why? these conspirators didnt have a crystal ball.you dont plan a conspiracy of that magnitude to fail. and thats exactly what does away with this conspiracy.they aparently planned to fail.

these devious planners apparently didnt think it was smart enough to ram the right kind of planes(or even a plane if you believe the missle theory) into the buildings.

they didnt plant WMD in Iraq, or use Iraqi pilots when they knew damn well the invasion of Iraq is the next phase.

theyn allowed their pilots to visit prostitutes thereby blowing their own coverstory.

in short,there was no conspiracy because the evidence paints any wouild be conspirator as as stupid as some local blood or crip member.

as I have said before, the war on terror in no way pivots on the towers falling.some idot before said they could just fix it.what kind of retarded response is that? pearl harbor is fixed now also.

you dont just ram planes into buildings in america and get away with it. whether they fell or not.

the conspiracy planners would have known that full well.instead they go into this ridicuous over complicated scheme of brainwashing and crashign wrong planes into buildings.

its stuff like this the whole conspiracy falls on.

I myself will nto be surprised if Iran is attacked before the november 06 elections. "Hey, dont vote the repubs out of congress yet, were in a war!"
Afghanistan----Iraq---Iran...straight out of the PNAC blueprint.

Btw, ANYONE going to the American Symposium in LA? So would like to go to that. Alex Jones freaking rules.

I vote that we remove the team8plus.org url from the 911 related websites, Nico Haupt is a lunatic. Also 911blimp.net

itsaputon,

I just utilized your point in my comment, copied below. (It seems that they don't even want to believe in election fraud.)

"RFK Jr does not do what you say he does"

Oh, he does. Have you read the entire article, or even parts of it?

The systematic deviations e.g. between the exit polls and the final results are just not possible. One of my examples was:

"The statistical odds against such a variance are just shy of one in 3 billion."

The variance is a fact. Are you saying that you believe that the Bush side just happened to be so lucky that they stumbled upon this 1 in 3,000,000 chance? What is it that makes you so strong in your belief?

And have you yourself read any of Griffin's books? Or Jones's article? Or the WTC 7 analysis by the Finnish doctor of engineering?

A few days ago an old lady posted about her conversation with a military person, a captain ("reservinkapteeni"). She asked him what, as a military man, he thought about 9/11. He responded right away that it was an inside job. In his opinion the air defense of a superpower could not have been so poor that hijacked planes could have kept flying freely for so long. (He gave other arguments too.)

I also think that extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence. The claim that 19 hijackers managed to

hijack four airplanes without any of the pilots even giving a hijacking alert;

fly those plains near several air force bases for a total of 1 hour 50 minutes without any kind of interception;

in particular, fly one of the planes for 40 minutes from the Ohio border to Washington and then crash into probably the best defended building in the world (yet happening to crash into the only narrow reinforced section of its walls);

cause three steel-framed skyscrapers to collapse in seconds to the ground, one of them in a different block from the others (while the closely neighbouring buildings suffered only minor damage);

and even select a day during which there were several large war games and antiterrorism exercises underway. Congresswoman Cynthia McKinney (a true American hero for me), but no other politician, grilled the Defense Minister about these exercises:

"Mr. Chairman, I have a question"
http://www.fromthewilderness.com/...

So, the demand of extraordinary proof is really on the side of the proponents of the extraordinary official story.

What proof have we been given? A hijacker's passport that miraculously survived an inferno that destroyed the black boxes of two airplanes? A list of hijackers that has for years been known to be incorrect? Pentagon footage which shows nothing (as if the Pentagon, for God's sake, didn't have better-quality cameras that would have captured whatever hit the building)? A bin Laden "confession video" showing a guy that even a child would see is not bin Laden (who twice denied involvement after the attacks)?

Compare the different images of bin Laden here:

http://911research.wtc7.net/...

Alternatively, bin Laden must have undergone a nose operation more extensive than anything Michael Jackson ever did (and learned to write in his other hand).

Extraordinarily bad proof, I'd say. But I'm open to better proof. I wish they'd provide it.

I'll be away during the weekend, so I'd *really* appreciate any support you guys can give me on the forum. Here's the address again:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/6/2/81113/16175

Please be active if you can. Thanks.

The petition needs to be online on various 9-11 truth websites! Bush and Blair and cohorts need to be tried at Hague for treason, war crimes and crimes against humanity! And others as well,the whole Goddamn pure evil PNAC group,etc.! Please have Dutch send petition so we can get out ASAP to help them out! And spread it widely and quickly! Please, get ahold of that petition and spread widely!

Vesa, your work is excellent! We must all post there.

I vote that we remove the team8plus.org url from the 911 related websites, Nico Haupt is a lunatic. Also 911blimp.net
Andy White | Homepage | 06.02.06 - 1:58 am | #
i second that.

I'll 3rd that!

..plus infinity!

Hi all, this is Antagonizer from Zapruder_Inc.

We are glad you like our little "chip in" in getting the truth out. Although we focus mainly on US-based politics and geopolitical issues (like corporatism and neocons) we also want to confront (Dutch) people with the involvement of the Dutch government and the docile corporate media we have here. We seem this peace-loving little country, but out government is in like Flynn.

We tend to have a slightly different approach from most 9/11-truth websites; we want to reach as big an audience as possible. Like it or not, the bigger part of the 9/11 movement is quite an incrowd (in the positive sense of the word) and we don't have to inform those people, as they are very well capable of doing so themselves. No, we want to reach the large chunk of people which stand at the bottom of the pyramid, having seminal doubts but not knowing where to begin. We want to break it down to them piecemeal: carefully explaining to them the mechanics of geopolitics and corporatism, which bring upon us this global fascist regime. We noticed when you start blasting off exposing the horrible truth that people tend to shun away and ultimately become scared off.

So therefore we decided to take on a more popularistic/lighter approach, getting in as big a public as possible to read, listen and look. So sometimes you will also see some lighter subjects, getting those people in to also read the other stuff and because we do have a general, broader interest. Who said you couldn't be fun and serious at the same time? We don't take ourselves too seriously as persons, but we are DEAD serious about this subject and the people that support it. That is why we adapt also a more activist attitude, organizing conferences, handing in petitions to the government, getting ourselves noticed and attacking the corporate media lackeys where ever we can. So it's not only writing about it, but also going out there and confront those f*ckers! Still, we purposely keep our 'brash' image, as it give us more leeway to do our thing.

I hope we can make a nice addition to all those other great initiatives -like yourself!- and we should always support each other, as we all share a common goal.

Cheers,

Antagonizer.