Well look what a 9/11 commission member admits:
"There are ample reasons to suspect that there may be some alternative to what we outlined in our version," Kerrey said. The commission had limited time and limited resources to pursue its investigation, and its access to key documents and witnesses was fettered by the administration. "I didn't read a single PDB," Kerrey said, referring to the president's daily intelligence briefing reports. "We didn't have access to Khalid Shaikh Mohammed," the mastermind of the plot. "We accepted a compromise, submitting our questions to him through the CIA. Now, that's not the best way to go about getting your questions answered."

Unbelievable. There needs to be a NEW investigation that can "go there".

A quick poll:
How many on here believe remote control was used on the real flights, a plane swap was made, or doble angets on the real flights were psycho yet well trained enough to crash them into the towers?

Oh yeah, and what do you guys make of the North American Union thing?

That is so not true by boeing!! They might be part of the conspiracy!!! Remember the Nasa test where they made several approaches and takeoffs, and later crashing the plane to test a new kind of fuel that would not ignite upon impact... Guys that was several decades ago, with an older plane!!! Now, Do you know how much GPS guided flying an automated systems have evolved since then!!

I want you to remember that the Zogby poll is the thing that has forced "them" to address the issue and try to debunk it.
The Zogby poll is your most significan't accomplishment. Wonder how much that cost you and how you got it done. At some point in the near future, when your pretty sure it will be a positive result if you can show a gain that would be significant. I guess that's a no brainer.

>fly to a destination and land >automatically

Doesn't that sound like the 757 at the Pentagon?

just found the state department has a "conspiracy debunker"-site:

http://usinfo.state.gov/media/Archive/2005/Jun/28-581634.html

Quote:
"Boeing commercial aircraft can not be remotely controlled"
(- maybe it was Boeing military aircraft? maybe it was an Air Force suicide pilot?)

"passengers on both flights that attacked the World Trade Center made phone calls, reporting that their aircraft had been hijacked"
(- where's the proof they were real? is there no such thing as LYING in your world, Condi???)

DC rumor was that Barb and Ted were REALLY ON THE OUTS!! They were estranged. I think Teddy offed Barb and put her on that plane, knowing she would end up in the ocean and her book would then go BESTSELLER. He would avoid a divorce settlement and have her royalties to book !!!

I know, T.S. I even though that PsyOps could have created a scenario, (real or fake) of Barbara having cheated on old Ted, and then Ted wouldn't feel so bad about her being iced. http://geocities.com/mossadlibrary/Olson1.gif

"Most recently, Osama bin Laden stated, in an audiotape released on May 23, 2006, "I was responsible for entrusting the 19 brothers - Allah have mercy upon them - with those raids ...." Bin Laden added, "the participants in September 11th were two groups: pilots and support teams for each pilot in order to control the aircraft."

"The first direct indication of al Qaeda involvement came in a videotape of bin Laden talking to a group of supporters in November 2001, which was obtained by U.S. forces in Afghanistan in late November and released on December 13, 2001. The videotape was clearly intended for internal al Qaeda use and bin Laden appeared fully aware that the tape was being made. Independent scholars verified that the translation released by the U.S. government is accurate."

AND THIS IS AN OFFICIAL U.S.GOVERNMENT WEB SITE!!!!!!

Is this the fake video of Osama where he is making notes while writing with his right hand?
All previous intelligence proved in the past that Osama is LEFT - HANDED!

The Today Show had a segment about YouTube.com this morning, which I thought was unusual till they announced that NBC (GE) has "partnered" with the website. Just for fun I did a search for "loose change" and the top return was "Loose Change-rebuttal". Draw you own conclusions, but I suggest either boycotting the site or flooding it with searches of 9-11 related subjects.

Mme Olson aside, the Boeing comment on the US gov website is interesting.

It could be basically interpreted two ways:

1) That remote control of aircraft is indeed possible and this quote is simply a lie to cover it up, since there are multiple instances where passenger jets were remote controlled for testing. If there were apparently "boxcutters" preplaced on the aircraft (according to MSM and official reports), why would it be so hard to believe that someone could have had access to the cockpit and navigation systems ahead of time.

2) That the hijackers acted as stand-in pilots, activating some sort of remote control guidance system that simply piloted the plane into a pre-determined trajectory. On that note, it always amazed me that "they" would have taken such a risk allowing inexperienced pilots to fly planes into buildings. They had to have a VERY VERY small margin of error, in order to have cover to carry out the controlled demolition afterwards.

To someone unfamiliar with this information, it's easy to see why it can be written off as conjecture or "lunatic ramblings." However, once you've spent a lot of time investigating this stuff, the arguments and hypotheses, at least at a basic level, seem pretty obvious.

Nimrod | 06.28.06 - 10:53 am | #
Yes, I prefer ttp://www.zippyvideos.com/ to YouTube. One can even submit videos anonymously to zippy.

Monsieur, I believe there is strong circumstantial evidence that the planes which hit their targets on 9/11 were drones, as per Operation Northwoods 40 years ago.

Anyone else "mad as hell"?

God I hope some day these criminals are exposed and made accountable.

pockybot... what's your source on Bob Kerrey?

Good for you, however, I wouldn't believe that unless I had something better than circumstantial evidence, or could at least be provided the links to the evidence you're talking about.

"Drones" has a lot of meanings. There are drones in the sense of the Global Hawk. As far as supposing that it was not 767s that hit the WTC, that to me seems to have absolutely no credible evidence (at least that I have seen with my own eyes). You'd have to make a good case.

"Drones" could also refer to replacement aircraft - 767s that were ostensibly from a different location. While I'd give more credence to that hypothesis, I'd need to see some strong evidence to make it plausible.

If there were apparently "boxcutters" preplaced on the aircraft (according to MSM and official reports), why would it be so hard to believe that someone could have had access to the cockpit and navigation systems ahead of time.

IMO, I think the commercial airplanes were "swapped" with precision equipped & guided drones.

I have always leaned toward a plane swap. There was ample opportunity for this.

Also, the WTC explosions, in my opinion, seemed too dramatic for a regular, untampered, commercial airliner. I would expect to see some of the plane debris fall from the side of building versus being swallowed up whole in a huge orange fireball.

"Drones" could also refer to replacement aircraft - 767s that were ostensibly from a different location. While I'd give more credence to that hypothesis, I'd need to see some strong evidence to make it plausible.

Do you find it more plausible that the 19 flunkies killed the pilots w/boxcutters & flew the planes hundreds of miles into their targets???

About the magic cell phone calls: Has there ever been a phone bill made public that shows any of these calls?
There could be some evidence in that, like inconsistent times, missing record of the calls etc.

The following I believe is powerful information to give to newbies:

The Unbelievably Profound Conflicts of Interest of the “9/11 Commission”
9/11 Commission Conflicts of Interest
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0307/S00148.htm
The "Independent" Commission
The existence of an "independent" Commission requires that its members are free of "conflict of interest". Namely that:
1. The Commission is free of encroachments emanating from the Executive or from the various agencies of government, under investigation.
2. Commissioners as well as members of staff do not have personal (or other) ties to senior Bush officials or senior officers in key government agencies, which are being investigated by the Commission;
3. Members of the Commission have no links of any kind, business or otherwise, to the alleged perpetrators or "financiers" of 9/11, including the bin Laden family.
A review of the Commission's membership suggests that these three conditions are not met. In fact, the Commission is marred by conflicts of interest. It operates in a cozy bi-partisan inter-agency environment, where the various crony factions within the Administration, the U.S. Congress, etc. are present.
Commission members were carefully handpicked. Not only were the White House and the National Security Council "represented" (unofficially of course), key government agencies including the CIA and Homeland Security also had their "seats" on the Commission.
Several members of the Commission served in the Reagan and Bush Senior administrations. Many Commissioners had were known to be involved in scandals themselves, and thereby compromised by their own guilt in other affairs. Many of the Commissioners had links to the Iran Contra officials of the Reagan administration. Needless to say, several of those Iran Contra officials now hold high office in the current Bush administration.
The conflicts of interest among the Commissioners was so profound so as to be almost unbelievable. After reviewing the conflicts of interest below, it will be clear how ludicrous it would be for anyone to consider this Commission to be “independent.” It appears that the members were especially selected to be people who would have strong incentives to make sure that a lot of areas pertinent to 9/11 would not be investigated.
Philip D. Zelikow - Executive Director – The Key Executive Position
Philip D. Zelikow held the key executive position on the Commission and had the most power over what the Commission actually did. Zelikow was responsible for the day to day operations of the 9/11 Commission, including the recruitment of staff and the coordination of research. He directed each staff member working for the Commission. Zelikow determined what areas would be investigated and what areas would not be investigated, what evidence would and would not be looked at, and which people would and would not be called to give testimony before the Commission.
Zelikow had unbelievably close personal and ideological ties to the White House and its top officials. Zelikow was and is closely linked to Bush's inner cabinet.
Conflicts of interest:
Zelikow was member of the Bush-Cheney transition team.
Zelikow was and is also part of the president's intelligence team. Two days before the beginning of the war on Afghanistan, Zelikow was appointed to the G.W. BushÂ’s President's Foreign Intelligence Advisory Board (PFIAB), chaired by General (ret.) Brent Scowcroft on October 5th, 2001, one day before the beginning of the bombing of Afghanistan. The PFIAB has the mandate to "provide advice to the President concerning the quality and adequacy of intelligence collection, of analysis and estimates, of counterintelligence, and of other intelligence activities".
He has a close professional relationship with Condoleezza Rice, with whom he had collaborated for 10 years prior to his appointment on the Commission. He is co-author of a book written with Condoleezza Rice. . There are indications that Condoleeza Rice had withheld crucial information linking senior Bush Administration officials to the former head of Pakistan's military intelligence, General Mahmoud Ahmad. According to the FBI, in a September 2001 report, ISI Chief General Mahmoud allegedly played a role in transferring money to the 9/11 terrorists.
Zelikow's ideological and personal closeness to the Bush administration is shown by one more fact. The primary author of the Bush administration's National Security Strategy statement of 2002, in which the new doctrine of preemptive warfare was articulated, was none other than Philip Zelikow, reports James Mann in Rise of the Vulcans. According to Mann, after Rice saw a first draft, which had been written by Richard Haass in the State Department, she, wanting "something bolder," brought in Zelikow to completely rewrite it. The result was a very bellicose document that used 9/11 to justify the administration's so-called war on terror. Max Boot described it as a "quintessentially neo-conservative document."
We can understand, therefore, why the Commission, under Zelikow's leadership, would have ignored all evidence that would point to wrongdoing in the White House. An unnamed source on the Commission staff told author Peter Lance, “Zelikow is calling the shots. He's skewing the investigation and running it his own way.” (Peter Lance, Cover Up, p. 140). From all accounts it appears Zelikow and his staff had plenty of opportunities to cover up, ignore, de-emphasize or steer clear of information that would be embarrassing or incriminating to the White House.
Chairman Thomas Kean – Chairman of the Commission
Conflicts of interest: Both the Commission Chairman Thomas Kean as well as the Legal Counsel Daniel Marcus to individuals closely linked to the bin Laden family. Kean had business ties with the "alleged financiers" of 9/11, according to the lawsuit launched by the families of the victims of the 9/11 attacks. Khalid bin Mahfouz and M. Hussein Al Amoudi are identified in the families of the victims lawsuit. Both individuals have been tagged in the lawsuit as the alleged "financiers" of Al Qaeda. Kean was also director of oil giant Amerada Hess (note that oil company profits have been at a record high since the post 9/11 wars), co-chairman of Homeland Security Project, and member of the Commission on Foreign Relations, which plays a behind the scenes role in the formulation of US foreign policy and intelligence operations.
Daniel Marcus - General Counsel
Conflict of Interest: Daniel MarcusÂ’ law firm provided legal counsel to one of the alleged financiers of 9/11: Prince Mohammed al Faisal. Faisal was identified as one of the top three alleged "financiers" of the 9/11 attacks listed in a 1 trillion dollar lawsuit. Confirmed by CBS "Those listed include Prince Mohammed al-Faisal, former intelligence chief Prince Turki al-Faisal, Saudi Defense Minister Prince Sultan, Khalid bin Salim bin Mahfouz of the National Commercial Bank and the Faisal Islamic Bank. "
The CIA also had its "Seat" on the Commission - Jamie S. Gorelick - Commissioner
Another prominent member of this "Independent" Commission was Jamie S. Gorelick. This was the CIA’s “Seat” on the Commission.
Conflicts of interest: Current and former partner of a law firm representing Prince Mohammed al Faisal against the August 2002 lawsuit by victimsÂ’ families against several Saudi princes and banks. Serves on the CIA's National Security Advisory Panel as well as the President's Review of Intelligence. .Also a Member of the Council of Foreign Relations, which plays a behind the scenes role in the formulation of US foreign policy and intelligence operations. Gorelick has a close personal relationship to CIA Director George Tenet. CIA Director George Tenet is one of the architects of the "war on terrorism". Jamie S. Gorelick serves on the CIA's National Security Advisory Panel as well as the President's Review of Intelligence. Clearly this was a CIA appointment to the Commission. Gorelick position on the Commission helped make sure that the CIAÂ’s undercover operations in support of international terrorism would never be investigated (see Michel Chossudovsky, Who is Osama bin Laden, 12 September 2001).
Lee H. Hamilton - Vice Chair
Conflicts of interest:
Hamilton has been connected to a number of key agencies. "He serves on an advisory board to the Association of the United States Army, the President's Homeland Security Advisory Council, the Secretary of Defense's National Security Study Group and the CIA Economic Intelligence Advisory Panel"
As member of the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence, and chairman of the Select Committee to Investigate Covert Arms Transactions with Iran, he was instrumental the indictment of Reagan National Security adviser John Pointdexter as well as Colonel Oliver North and Richard Secord, who were the designated fall guys. On this other hand, his committee failed to investigate the roles of other Reagan officials. Neither President Reagan nor Vice President Bush were investigated, nor Colin Powell and Richard Armitage, who are now part of the current Bush II Administration.
Lee H. Hamilton brought to the Commission the "damage control" procedures followed during the Iran Contra investigation, which broadly served to uphold the practices of US foreign policy.
Hamilton is also a Member of the Council on Foreign Relations, which plays a behind the scenes role in the formulation of US foreign policy and intelligence operations. He was also the former chairman of the House Foreign Affairs Committee and House Select Intelligence Committee.
Richard Ben-Veniste - Commissioner
Partner in the law firm which represented the insurance beneficiaries of the court-ordered multi-million dollar payout for the World Trade Center destruction.
Richard Ben-VenisteÂ’s law firm also played a k

Richard Ben-Veniste - Commissioner
Partner in the law firm which represented the insurance beneficiaries of the court-ordered multi-million dollar payout for the World Trade Center destruction.
Richard Ben-Veniste’s law firm also played a key role in the Enron scandal. According to the NY Post, his law firm is “among the biggest bankruptcy firms in the world - famously received a $3 million retainer from Enron when the energy company filed in 2001. When all is said and done the law firm expects to squeeze more than $200 million out of the bankrupt energy company in fees that are secured by a court.” (http://www.nypost.com/wealth/63212.htm .)
Fred F. Fielding - Commissioner
Conflict of interest: A former White House Counsel during the Reagan administration at the time of the Iran Contra scandal, closely connected through personal ties to several members of the current Bush team. He was also counsel during the Bush-Cheney presidential transition. Fielding is a former White House Counsel during the Reagan administration at the time of the Iran Contra scandal, closely connected through personal ties to several members of the current Bush team. He was also counsel during the Bush-Cheney presidential transition. He also worked for John Dean as White House counsel to Nixon – “Deep Throat” of Watergate fame, avoided prison time.
Slade Gorton – Commissioner
Conflict of interest: Served two years on the Senate Intelligence Committee. Close personal friendship with Republican Congressional leader Trent Lott.
John F. Lehman - Commissioner
Conflict of interest: Lehman is a former Secretary of the Navy under the Reagan administration, with close personal ties to members of the current Bush administration. J.F. Lehman & Company is a firm specialising in leveraged buyouts. Lehman is a member of Council on Foreign relations (CFR), which plays a behind the scenes role in the formulation of US foreign policy and intelligence operations. He has close personal ties to Henry Kissinger, who recruited him during the Nixon administration.
Timothy J. Roemer - Commissioner
Conflict of interest: As a former member of the Task Force of the Intelligence Committee's Task Force on Homeland Security and Terrorism and the Joint Inquiry of the Senate and House, Roemer is a go-between the Commission, Homeland Security and the members of the intelligence committees of the House and Senate. He has ties to Rep. Porter Goss and Senator Bob Graham, who headed the join inquiry. Graham and Goss have suspicious links to former Pakistani (ISI) Intelligence Chief General Mahmoud Ahmad. Pakistan's ISI is known to support Islamic terrorism in liaison with the CIA.
James R. Thompson - Commissioner
Conflict of interest: Chairman of large law firm whose clients have included American Airlines, Boeing, and a number of WTC tenants. His law firm specializes in "defending corporations and individuals accused of wrongdoing."
Bob Kerrey - Commissioner
Conflict of interest: Vice-chair of the Senate Committee on Intelligence. A New York Times article reported that at least 13 civilians were killed in 1969 in a Vietnamese village by a Navy SEAL team led by Bob Kerrey, making him a personally compromised individual.
John F. Lehman - Commissioner
Conflict of interest: Former Secretary of the Navy under the Reagan administration, with close personal ties to members of the current Bush administration. A member of Council on Foreign relations (CFR). Has close personal ties to Henry Kissinger. Had been disgraced in a number of scandals, including Tailhook, making him a personally compromised individual.
Representation" on the Commission:
Pentagon John F. Lehman. CIA Jamie S. Gorelick. Homeland Security, Timothy J. Roemer. White House and NSC, Fred F. Fielding and Philip Zelikow. Senate and House Intelligence Committees, Timothy J. Roemer. Council on Foreign Relations, Thomas Kean, Lee H. Hamilton, Jamie S. Gorelick, John F. Lehman. Henry Kissinger: John F. Lehman.
Other Comments:
Given the makeup of the Commission, it should be no surprise that it did not investigate the Pentagon, the White House, the CIA, or any other top levels of government.
The Commission's hidden agenda is cover-up and "damage control". Its objective is not to inform but to distract public opinion, from the real issues by churning out piles of irrelevant intelligence.

Â…Â…Â…Â…Â…
CBS Evening News, March 5, 2003, “Conflicts Of Interest On Sept. 11 Panel?” http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/03/05/eveningnews/main542868.shtml
“questions about airline security are critical to the investigation. But, now comes a serious allegation: that the Sept. 11 commission is stacked with members tied directly to the airline industry.

"Here we've got the most important event in America in the past 50 years, the most horrible thing that's happened to Americans, and yet we pick a bunch of people who are connected to the very people who are at the center of the question of who's at fault," says Terry Brunner, a former federal prosecutor who now runs the Aviation Integrity Project in Chicago. "It's ridiculous."

Brunner checked out the commissioners and discovered that out of 10, at least six represent the very companies they're now investigating.

He says they are: "Fred Fielding, Spirit Airlines, United Airlines; Slade Gordon represents Delta Airlines; Sen. Max Cleland – $300,000 from the airline industry; Jim Thompson represents American Airlines; Richard BenVinesta represents Boeing and United Airlines; and Rep. Tim Roemer - Boeing and Lockheed Martin."
Â…"They're all up to here, with either being connected to the airlines or to the manufacturer of the airplane," says Brunner.

One of the commissioners, former Illinois Gov. Jim Thompson, once represented United and still counsels American - the very airlines involved in the Sept. 11 attack.

Kerrey was dismissive of the conspiracy theories as well. Asked about the possibility of a controlled demolition at the World Trade Center, he scoffed, "There's no evidence for that." But he also noted that, quite apart from what Avery and others in the "truth movement" have proposed, many legitimate mysteries still surround the events of that day. "There are ample reasons to suspect that there may be some alternative to what we outlined in our version," Kerrey said. The commission had limited time and limited resources to pursue its investigation, and its access to key documents and witnesses was fettered by the administration. "I didn't read a single PDB," Kerrey said, referring to the president's daily intelligence briefing reports. "We didn't have access to Khalid Shaikh Mohammed," the mastermind of the plot.

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/june2006/280606deniers.htm

http://usinfo.state.gov/media/Archive/2005/Jan/24-318760.html

^^^"Did the U.S. "Create" Osama bin Laden?" -- debunking page.

Alex Jones and others, often state that Osama was a CIA asset as fact; is this really provably true??

"Drones" could also refer to replacement aircraft - 767s that were ostensibly from a different location. While I'd give more credence to that hypothesis, I'd need to see some strong evidence to make it plausible.

Do you find it more plausible that the 19 flunkies killed the pilots w/boxcutters & flew the planes hundreds of miles into their targets???

Believe me, we're practically on the same page about this. I think both possibilities exist.

Where I cannot yet make an informed decision, is deciding between "plane swapping" per se, and having the hijackers (presuming there were at least 1 or 2 on board) activating some sort of remote guidance system on the standard commercial airliner.

Of course, it goes without saying that the official story is a load of hooey.

Anyone know any good sites that debunk the http://www.lolloosechange.co.nr and www.911myths.com? like step by step debunking?

ID, on a previous thread you were bashing Fetzer. Now your linking to gov'y sites. Hmmmmm....

Hey just a quick question is Who Killed John o' Neill a LIHOP Movie?

Atta & his budds weren't jihadists. If anything, IMO, they were patsy drug trafficers in training.

Interesting debunk of In Plane Site.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7160274150347523777

"There needs to be a complete reboot of the 911 truth movement. We must only distribute verifiable FACTS. NO MORE speculation."

Can't be done. Speculation leads to new theories that may be the truth. It's necessary to speculate and share that speculation to weed out the lies.

«Oh yeah, and what do you guys make of the North American Union thing?»

Well, was the German-Austrian Union (or anschluss) of the 1930s necessarily a good thing for world piece?

I don't think so.

It is not a good use of time to speculate on what happened. As much as we all want to know the details on how the whole thing was pulled off, this will help our cause.

Key talking points to debunk the "official" story is all that are needed to blow the lid off this thing. Anything more will only add to create confusion.

Anyone know the latest on the thermate findings of Dr. Jones? I read somewhere that two other universitites that did testing found the same stuff. Can anyone confirm?

It was "In Plane Sites" pod theory that got me interested in 9/11 truth. The "no 757" at the pentagon has gotten many many people to start digging deeper.
Those two are only speculations aren't they?

wouldn't have mentioned controlled demolition before Steve Jones either.
douglas Lain | Homepage | 06.28.06 - 2:18 pm | #

Do you need someone to tell you that buildings don't erupt, explode, & implode in your face by themselves? WTC-7 not a clue to you?
Anonymous | 06.28.06 - 2:54 pm | #
HAHA, seriously though.

I think I gave money to the wrong place by contributing to 911truth. Damn I may have to join GCN because now evidently Aelx Jones is doing the best job.
Check out signs of the times alernative news website, recent interview with Lisa Guliani about the alternative media.
Sure would like some feedback on that interview and forum thread
Wingtv couterinellpro??? I gotta know who to support, hard to tell.
Hey computer guys out there ----
Signs of the times was able to block me altogethr from their webiste becuasse of that thread I started. How is it that they could block me from the website??? probably pretty easy but I've never seen it before. and not just the forum, are these guys counterintelpro or what.
ps. I think that's a very flakey website and philosophy there, channeling and all that, need some feedback on this. However I do not think wingtv is couterinellpro maybe we can have a thread on counterintellpro???
The relevance is who you gonna support, I work hard for the money!

Anonymous: I was in denial for a long time and didn't look at the evidence for controlled demolition until after Jones' paper.

dont support WingTV. they are flamethrowing assholes that devote entire broadcasts and stories on bashing various people in the 9/11 truth movement.they are immature and petty as hell,at best, and comprimised at worst.

One thing on the WTC 7 demolition- invoked above- that has also always troubled me, yet I haven't heard mentioned anywhere, is that it seems really strange to me that Larry Silverstein would have the authority to destroy CIA, NSA, Secret Service and SEC offices- and all the assets of those organizations.

Doesn't it seem like if you are the leaseholder and the most powerful intelligence agencies in the world are tenants of your building that you would need express government approval to destroy their facilities? We're talking billions of dollars in equipment and Lord knows how much sensitive intelligence data being wiped out instantly. Without the approval of at least the government agencies, it seems very likely that destruction of this kind would constitute a felony of the highest order, right?

Is this wrong? I've not heard this mentioned before (though perhaps it's old news)- but it has always struck me as a particularly difficult thing to explain, absent some specific prior authorization by the agencies affected- or someone in power above them who could approve it.

yeah douglas, your buddy Chomsky is still in full on denial about 9/11 though.not just controlled demolition. i noticed you had a brief correspondence with him on your site. maybe you could stop the hero worship for a minute and ask him why hes such a coward? thats the problem, all his followers respect him too much to ask HIM some tough questions.Chomsky purpose is to keep people going in circles. hes the reliable lefty steam valve.9/11 was simply "blowback" huh Chomsky? blow it out your ass gatekeeper.......

look at this on CNN:
Israeli warplanes flew over the home of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad as Israeli forces sent troops into Gaza to save a kidnapped soldier. Syria says it chased Israeli warplanes out of its airspace after what it called a "hostile and provocative act," Syrian state television reported.

now tell me that someone could do that to us and we wouldnt retaliate? shiat.. and this is how israel will provoke war with iran, and how we will be drug into it.

time to cover your ass everybody.

Einstein:
I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones.

and its sad, because i used to fall for his shit. i still think hes a great thinker and i agree with him on so much, but soon after 9/11 when i had a full political awakening, i quickly realized Chomskys purpose.

>truth. The "no 757" at the pentagon >has gotten many many people to start >digging deeper.
>Those two are only speculations >aren't they?
>Itsaputon | 06.28.06 - 3:39 pm | #

True. To get people to aboard, it's important to make them curious what happened. And one thing that got many people curious is the lack of evidence of a 757 at the Pentagon - saying hey' i didn't know that!

It's just not the thing you would tell a major media station as "proof", only to be ridiculed later if it isn't true. But that difference must be understood and as long as we're not talking mainstream, it shouldn't be banned. To the contrary, you're NOT going to win any new doubsters of the official story by telling them of the NORAD stand-down e.g.

pockybot, simply unbelievable.

Where did you find that gem?

"There are ample reasons to suspect that there may be some alternative to what we outlined in our version," Kerrey said. The commission had limited time and limited resources to pursue its investigation, and its access to key documents and witnesses was fettered by the administration. "I didn't read a single PDB," Kerrey said, referring to the president's daily intelligence briefing reports. "We didn't have access to Khalid Shaikh Mohammed," the mastermind of the plot. "We accepted a compromise, submitting our questions to him through the CIA. Now, that's not the best way to go about getting your questions answered."

The sad truth seems to be, 9/11 was carried out devastatingly successful for Bushco.. Yes, we're now trying to get them, but 5 years and almost noone in Washington dares to challenge Bush on it, that's a big success.

Bush's empire should have tumbled long ago in 2002 when Thierry Meyssans' book 'Pentagate' was published and there was no evidence to contradict it provided by the government. But instead, he even got 4 more years.

The above mentioned sitemeter statistics for this site rock!

You can see log in for individual users on this site as well.

"Look ma, even mil. contractors!"

raytheon.com
Lexington, Massachusetts
2:46:54 pm 1 20:52

The question remains is it one of the shill people or perhaps lurking whistleblower wannabie?

In case you are the latter, don't do it. You like your stupid wify, obese kids and 3 SUVs in front of McMansion don't you? Don't loose your American dream just for some silly whistleblowing, budy! Support our war time leaders!

How widely known is the report that the WTC was in an advanced state of deterioration due to an electrolytic reaction between the aluminum and the steel?

One more reason for conspiring in the largest insurance fraud in history.

Greg: Why won't the NORAD stand down story win converts?

Russians are rebuilding their naval port in Syrian waters. US&Israel not amused..

If Syrians buy new flying hw from Russia - Israeli strategic advantage in the region would be much lower.. (I doubt Syrian pilots even with the latest hw would be on par with Israelis)

So flights like that you described would render to be a deadly game in the future for Isreali girls and boys, they just today knocked down by airstrike a couple of bridges and power grid for the entire Gaza..

Chris: The interview with Chomsky you looked at was from 1994. Although I will admit that I still admire the guy, even if I'm more aware of his falliblity than ever.

Chomsky has said that the LIHOP position is possible, by the way, but he doesn't care to pursue it.

What is troubling to me about Chomsky's position is that he failed to be concerned about two stolen elections. I can almost grant him not investigating the premise of 911 as an inside job, but everybody knew that the 2000 election was fraudlent and Chomsky just dismissed the fact as irrelevant.

I don't think this indicates that Chomsky isn't what he appears to be, but rather demonstrates that he's got ideological blinders. Bush just wasn't significantly worse than Gore in his eyes, and I would've tended to agree with him about other republicans. As an anti-capitalist I don't like either parties, but Bush was much worse than Gore. Much worse, and the theft of the election demonstrated that fact right away.

dz... what happened in April?

>Greg: Why won't the NORAD stand down >story win converts?
>douglas lain | Homepage | 06.28.06 - >4:30 pm | #

Because it's too weak of a smoking gun. Especially if someone does not have inside knowledge of NORAD like Mr Bowman etc. People believe the 'incompetence' excuse of the Bush administration. But the Pentagon not having any wreckage like in all the previous crashes: TWA 800, Egyptair etc. - that doesn't take much to understand.

P.S.:
new key word i've found: Bushladen !
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=bushladen

Greg: In the context of the Pentagon the fact there were no jets intercepting seems convincing to me. Plus, if it were incometence wouldn't somebody have been reprimanded or fired? Instead they use their incompetence to get more funding and more power?

I know I'm preaching to the choir and I do understand your point about the NORAD info not being enough to convert most people. And I agree I guess.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/security/library/congress/2005_h/050513-bu...

“I’m a pilot. I don’t need a gun or a knife. I’ve got an airplane
filled with 60,000 pounds of jet fuel. Essentially, I‘m flying a missile.”

Capt.Burlingame, in testimony on FAA matters re: arming pilots...

http://www.arlingtoncemetery.net/cfburling3.htm

http://www.commongroundcommonsense.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=49914&...

> the context of the Pentagon the >fact there were no jets intercepting >seems convincing to me. douglas lain >| Homepage | 06.28.06 - 4:47 pm | #

Bushco. has gotten away with the missing Pentagon defense because no one ever of the 9/11 commission told what was supposed to happen if a plane heads to it. They made it seem as if everything rested on Bush's order to shoot it down, and he was too incompetent, reading My Pet Goat instead.

This is one key problem with convincing people: they don't have the backround to understand why something is a smoking gun. The "collapse by fire" is an example or the missing plane parts: you have to teach them first that buildings have never before collapsed from fire, and that planes don't 'vaporize'.
In case of the Pentagon, it should be highlighted that before 9/11 they claimed "no bird can fly over it without being photographed", and then the missile defense of it - so where was all that on 9/11?...

For all those tortured over the likes of Jerry Springer's reluctance to come on board 9/11, a little reading material:

http://www.leftgatekeepers.com/articles/conspiracyphobia.htm

dz... what happened in April?
Jon Gold | | Email | Homepage | 06.28.06 - 4:39 pm | #

i'm going to guess it was the showbiz tonight thing? we were lucky enough to have the sheen clips emailed to us ASAP, so everyone was linking to us for them..

check the archives for that month, but that is my guess off the top of my nogin.

In case of the Pentagon, it should be highlighted that before 9/11 they claimed "no bird can fly over it without being photographed", and then the missile defense of it - so where was all that on 9/11?...
Greg
=================================
Just FYI - the big shill defense now is that "there are no SAM missile defenses of the Pentagon, there never were."

I truly don't know myself, but this is what they're saying on the blogs now. The whole "missile defense" story was a hoax.

Alex said: "There needs to be a complete reboot of the 911 truth movement. We must only distribute verifiable FACTS. NO MORE speculation."

To which Itsaputon replied: "Can't be done. Speculation leads to new theories that may be the truth. It's necessary to speculate and share that speculation to weed out the lies."

Itsaputon, Of course it can be done, if we have the will. I didn't say not to speculate among those within the movement. I said don't distribute half truths and pure speculation with newbies. It muddies the issue, and waters down the impact of the truth. The facts we have at hand are more than powerful enough to impress, if not convince, the intelligent listener.

Speculations are like rivulets up in the mountains, collecting the dew and rain off a few trees. Perhaps there is enough moisture there in the harsh sunlight of the daytime to sustain and build a small collection over time and thus add to the small stream downhill. Facts are the larger streams that have carved themselves into the soil and rock; they have been examined, backed up, vetted, verified, and reviewed by many such that soon they may enter the river of knowledge. The 9/11 movement will become, based on the continued DIALOGUE of many, a large river that will sweep before it the detritus, the small levees, and even larger dams that obstruct its flow.

The leadership of the movement, whomever they are, need to have a summit meeting, a pow-wow, to construct a sophisticated computer software (? concept mapping) approach, to agree on pooling and seeking financial support, and to construct, assemble and use a media-based effort to disseminate information to the people. Such a meeting will require that all submissions be vetted thoroughly, all egos get checked at the door, and all credit, kudos, recognition, etc. be withheld until the mission is accomplished.

Rigorous Intuition lobs one at Farhad Manjoo:

http://rigint.blogspot.com/2006/06/if-i-only-had-plane.html

Mssr. Jouet, I hear and appreciate what you're saying. However, this is a grassroots movement. Every one of us are leaders, our level of accomplishment determined by our individual abilities and determination. I for one am not looking for or waiting for supposed leaders to do anything. Our power as a movement lies in our coherency, and coherency can only be established and maintained through adherence to the established facts when distributing information to the uninformed. I maintain: there must be ZERO tolerance for speculation outside of inner-movement discussion.

"DETROIT, Michigan (AP) -- A U.S. Marine and one-time recruiter who appeared in Michael Moore's acclaimed documentary "Fahrenheit 9/11" has died in a roadside bombing in Iraq." http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/06/28/soldier.fahrenheit.ap/index.html

I wish lard-ass Moore would do something re: 9/11 truth!!! We could've ended this Afghanistan & Iraqi bullshit long ago if he had!

there must be ZERO tolerance for speculation outside of inner-movement discussion.
Alex | 06.28.06 - 5:39 pm | #

I agree. But if someone does speculate outside of inner-movement discussion, for example, on the radio, what can we do about it?

Tono Stano, I don't get your post where you mention Raytheon.Are you refering to me? I first heard about the Raytheon passengers in the foot notes of David Ray Griffins' book "A New pearl Harbor" I certainly won't bring it up again. If DRG thinks it needs bringing up again,I'll let him do it.

The answer is self-evident. You call and make the point that it sounds speculative.

Anyway, the point is, you and I ain't the ones with the big wooden gavel! And, if there were a trial you can bet that Keane's second-cousin would be the 'Judge.' Do we look to November? Have you heard anybody screaming: "NO MORE DIEBOLD!" ?

...I think we need to circulate a "People's Manifesto." I think it needs to accurately reflect global sentiment. By it's mere existance, the message contained MUST offer a blue-print for a more just, -post 'NWO' point of true reconciliation.

Otherwise, what WILL happen the minute there is another big false-flag?

What will YOU do, if you turn on your TV some day to learn that "the Global Economy Has Just Collapsed!" ?

Oh,yeah,I don't go around wild-eyed to people saying "Remote Control Planes".Having a discussion with already-informed people is what I thought I was doing.I'm not even (and never planned on) saying any thing about it on the 911 truth flyer I've been mentally composing,for obvious reasons .It's too iffy.(It's taking me months,so it's cool that some one linked some already made truth flyers on this thread.Maybe I can just use those.) But,yeah speculation amongst the informed,facts and nothing but facts, to the newbies.I'm supprised that this should even need pointing out.

bill, you & Chumpsky are both frauds.

Speaking of frauds:

What do you think of Wing-TV's efforts in the 911 truth movement

http://wingtv-poll.cjb.net/

new second hit footage!

which clip is the most dramatic?

one two three

Everyone can thank didiklomberg @ youtube for CGI planes two and three. As for CGI plane one, credit goes out to the M$M!

Please stop spreading this obvious disinfo. WTF is wrong with you?

Apparently the results are in WINGTV is not a positive element in the movement and I would agree but, anonymous is a coward for not being available for a direct reponse. When the call comes I'll be there but who's gonna make the call tell me that?

new second hit footage!

which clip is the most dramatic?

one two three

Everyone can thank didiklomberg @ youtube for CGI planes two and three. As for CGI plane one, credit goes out to the M$M!
shep | 06.29.06 - 4:33 pm | #
nice. this proves how easily the bullshit no-planers can manipulate videos and fool the gullible.

Anonymous isn't a coward per se, just doesn't want STING TV to report him to the feds for posting a link to that poll LOL!

I guess that's somewhat understandable about anonymous. It is time for us to come together INCLUDING WINGTV they evidently have done some couragous protesting which is more than I have done. BUT their ruthless attack dog efforts on John Stadmiller of RBN amoung others needlessly make them look like counterintellpro but I don't think they are. I would stand hand in hand with them.
I just heard Jim Fitzer's interview with Judy Wood and at the end the passion in his voice gives me chills and inspires me to no end.
The stakes have never been higher and even though I am scared shitless to know what this treasonous Govt. will do when they are backed into a corner we cannot let that stop us. Morgan Reynolds told me personally that there is no other course we can possibly follow. I agree but I wasn't so sure at first. It is hard for the common man to wrap his mind around this. Let's get them in a court of law if we have to do it ourselves. Our congrsscritters are cowards but where is the 911 party. Without a third party it is the status quo. Capialism is a failure.
Where is the so called Cindy Sheehan anti war crowd? They are gutless to put politics ahead of this. They could end the war if only they and every other side issue crowd would only put 911 truth as a top priority. I am grateful for this forum, alone, isolated, wanting to get into the fight but there is no organized opposition. Here in a city of 3 million I cannot find anyone to join with except the comprimised anti war crowd and they will not touch 911. I will have to push it.

Where is the so called Cindy Sheehan anti war crowd? They are gutless to put politics ahead of this. They could end the war if only they and every other side issue crowd would only put 911 truth as a top priority.

I totally agree!