Wall Street Journal: Ramzi and Khalid's Spanish Vacation

(Yet another reason to file the 9/11 Commission Report in the "General Fiction" section. -r.)

The Spanish Connection
What the 9/11 Commission didn't consider.

Thursday, February 22, 2007

The 9/11 Commission relied on information derived from two captured al Qaeda perpetrators for much of its picture of the conspiracy leading up to the attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. The interrogations of these men--Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, or "KSM," ... and Ramzi Binalshibh, who acted as KSM's liaison with ... Mohamed Atta--were performed by the CIA at secret locations.

KSM claimed that he left almost all the tactical details to Atta, and therefore could not say where Atta went, or whom he visited, in the final months of the plot. Binalshibh claimed he was Atta's only contact with al Qaeda during this period and that, other than himself, Atta never met with anyone on his trips abroad in 2001...

...Why did Atta and Binalshibh make these trips? The 9/11 Commission turned to the CIA, which reported that Binalshibh (captured in 2002) said in his interrogation that neither he nor Atta had contacted anyone else in Spain. Thus the commission stated, "According to Binalshibh, they did not meet with anyone else while in Spain."

The problem here is that Atta and Binalshibh made independent trips to Spain. Atta went to Madrid in January when Binalshibh was in Germany; Binalshibh went to Madrid in September when Atta was in America. And when Atta arrived in Madrid on July 8, Binalshibh was in Hamburg. They were never in Madrid at the same time. ...

Presumably, they made separate trips because they had separate business, but the critical fact is this: Binalshibh was not in a position to know whom Atta did (or didn't) contact in Madrid or during his final three days in Spain. ...

...Yet to come to its conclusion on this most fundamental issue, the commission was prohibited from seeing any of the detainees whose accounts it relied on. Nor was it allowed even to question the CIA interrogators to determine the way that information was obtained. The commission's joint chairmen themselves later acknowledged that they "had no way of evaluating the credibility of detainee information." So when Judge Garzon comes up with evidence that runs counter to detainees' claims, cracks begin to emerge in the entire picture. ...

Unedited version here;

Isn't Mr. Epstein missing the obvious here? "...cracks begin to emerge in the entire picture" By George, you've almost got it, Jay! Send your opinion to the Wall Street "Opinion Journal" at the main links above. -r.

- Thanks, Lozenge.

if its the Wall Street

if its the Wall Street Journal you can expect this "investigation" to go nowhere.


epstein is writing a book about the 9/11 commission.

obviously, don't expect any truther revelations in it; but it may have some useful tidbits.

I gave them a list of things the commission ignored.

I started with Daniel Pearl's alleged killer, Omar Saeed Sheikh, on the hopes that someone there is on our side.

I did not mention this:

“However, despite instructions to the contrary, a few Pakistan Rangers entered the flat, where they found Shaikh Mohammed and another man, allegedly with their hands up. The Rangers nevertheless opened fire on the pair.… Later, the Pakistani press carried pictures of a message scrawled in blood on the wall of the flat, proclaiming the Muslim refrain of Kalma, in Arabic: ‘There is no God except Allah, Mohammed is his messenger’ ). An official who was present in the flat at the time of the shooting has told Asia Times Online that the message was written by Shaikh Mohammed with his own blood as his life drained from him.” His wife and two children, captured in the raid, confirmed his identity. [Asia Times, 10/30/02] An Australian newspaper repeated the idea he was killed, and added, “Some reports went so far as to suggest his wife and son had identified his body and buried him under the watchful eye of the FBI.” [Daily Telegraph, 3/4/03]


70 Disturbing Facts About 9/11

John Doraemi publishes Crimes of the State Blog

johndoraemi --at-- yahoo.com.

Chemtrails on air TONIGHT

Best Evidence Chemical Contrails
Discovery Channel 9PM and 1AM



why are people voting this post down?

I don't get it.

it has nothing to do

with this forum

Actually, it does

when you learn more about who did 9/11, you find out that the powers that run the world have their dirty hands into lots of dirty things, like controlling our money through the fed, chem trails, etc.

I voted it down, not

I voted it down, not everything is a conspiracy and if this page continues to be open to all sorts of OT posts, soon we'll have the UFO crowd here as well.

As always, open minded and sceptical.

Iran Iran Iran

Scott Ritter, former weapons inspector and author of Target Iran: The Truth About the White House’s Plans for Regime Change, says it is a deception that the U.S. government is concerned about Iran’s nuclear program or that they mean to use diplomacy to put an end to it, but instead is determined to have regime change in that country regardless. He also discusses some of the likely consequences if America does attack.

MP3 here. (60:45)

The president has a blank check to do whatever he wants. Ritter is not a 9/11 truther but generally he comes with good solid information.

I responded...

Dear Mr. Epstein!

Al-Hazmi and Al-Mihar were Saudi intelligence, don't you know that?


Please also note the article by german journalist Oliver Schröm:


And this link:


And put this all in context. Then you know nearly the truth.


Good article

Epstein is definitely barking up one of the right trees. I've read quite a bit of his stuff and, while he sometimes goes off on one, he is at least thinking with his head, which the rest of the MSM don't.

what is the real question here?

I think it is--how much of any of this should be seriously discussed, and how much can be thrown out as being sourced only by CIA claims of what its interrogation of KSM yielded?

Should we bother trying to figure out who met whom where or when, when we can't be sure that any of these men went anywhere, period?

Doesn't the fact that the CIA seems to have spun KSM's testimony out of whole cloth (i.e. made it up to suit the OCT) a priori mean that nothing it refers to can be considered to be important info relating to 9/11?


Real Truther a.k.a. Verdadero Verdadero

WTCdemolition.com - Harvard Task Force


Patch Work

Do you have a hole to fill in your story?..... just fill it with a little KSM....

It's almost better than a flat out lie.
Ignorance is NOT Bliss

I think Epstein was approaching that fact

from his own angle on 9/11, which doesn't presume any US govt complicity. At least he mentions the fact that the Commission had no contact with principal detainees (the difference between Epstein and us is that Epstein doesn't draw the logical conclusion: we can't trust anything sourced to KSM's confession).

The importance of Epstein's article -- and I do think it is important -- is that he is at least approaching the concern we have had for over two years. He is saying, If the Spanish investigation is true, then the CIA's story may be (must be?) false. That is, there must be more conspirators than the CIA has led us to believe.

The obvious problem is that Epstein is implying, and I'm sure his readership believes, that the missing conspirators are Iran, Hezbollah, and the laundry list of evildoers the president so desperately wants us to focus on.

Something like that.

The 9/11 Commission wasn't even allowed to question the CIA on interrogation techniques, never mind questioning Tweedledee and Tweedledum.

Somebody f*cked up their debriefing, that's what I think.

Can you imagine how well things would have gone with the Warren Commission putting Lee Harvery Oswald on the witness stand?

"I work for the CIA, FBI and DEA, yes that's right your honor, I'M A PATSY! A PATSY, I TELL YA!"

Movie Preview

Have you seen the new movie coming out with Marky Mark Wallberg where he is commissioned to give sniper support for the President..... then the President is assassinated and he realizes that he's being set up?

Looks good!
Ignorance is NOT Bliss

Epstein casually alludes to

what is in bold letters and boxed off for emphasis around page 145 (don't have the report in front of me, but it's around that page). The commission declares their efforts to verify the veracity of alleged detainee confessions were "challenged" by the fact that they couldn't interview anybody about the stories they were told.

When this thing goes to "trial", to prolong the War on Terror propaganda, it's going to be a military tribunal. The msm will report it as though "justice is served," but it's going to be a complete farce (if, in fact, KSM is actually in custody, and if he makes it to trial alive).

I wonder how long

the mainstream-lying media could spin the Binalshib / Mohamed story with no trials?

Are the people really that dumb not to understand that Mr. Epstein is at least in one point: That these guys were needed to fill all holes in the oct, like we knew at least since the Chaim Kupferberg artivles?