Dr.Griffin is a NeoCon disinformation artist?!

The blog entry that used to be here has now been superseded by an upgraded, expanded version fully printed here: http://www.911blogger.com/node/8522

Dr. Griffin is the anti-christ!!

Why is this shit even posted here?! David Ray Griffin is the gentlest man alive. He exudes goodness with every word he speaks. Only the ballsiest of 9/11 truth opponents would try to attack Griffin's character.

Why is it posted?

It is posted because I communicated with dz, reprehensor, somebigguy, and "george washington" when the allegations first surfaced, asking to be put in touch with Dr. Griffin.

It is posted because the allegations were posted (elsewhere), without proper response (especially from Dr. Griffin himself).

In looking into this, I found other similar references or allegations which attempt to call Dr. Griffin's background, integrity, logic, etc. into question. I thought it right and proper that Dr. Griffin have a chance to respond himself. I thought that the allegations were serious and deserved scrutiny.

I did my own homework to a greater extent, though I had listened to his podcasts, watched his video presentations, and read some of his articles. (I've been posting on 9/11 issues for well over two yearsat CGCS.)

I did indeed do my own review, which is posted in those links, and Dr. Griffin, with the help of others, was in touch with me promptly (what other bigwig in this debate responds to the e-mails of a stranger so promptly and forthrightly?). His response has been forwarded by e-mail to dz, reprehensor, and "george washington" for verification purposes, and it too is posted inside those links.

Lastly, it is posted here because I told those guys I would do so if I got a response from Dr. Griffin. I did, with his permission to post (also forwarded as above).

We are in the middle of a great war for our minds.

Allegations like these have been made in many places at many times against many people seeking clarity.

Someone once said something about vigilance being the price of liberty.

I disliked the "Tabloid" style subject title...

It could have been phrased many different ways, the one you have chosen is probably the worst possible.

Best wishes

Yes.... apologies...

Apologies... I was up all night, and the muse didn't drop by. Any suggestions? Can it be changed? Don't know. Anyway, gonna get some slepp now.

After reading much of 'PP's thread

I am certainly 'unimpressed' - to put it mildly. HIs was clearly a 'hit' piece on Griffin. With a fair number of 'little' pp's weighing in. PP was even slimier than something you might expect from a 'Monbiot' or 'Cockburn'...... and certainly as disingenuous. I recently rejoined CGCS (perhaps an error) and now vaguely remember why I left it after my membership lapsed the first year they required dues. Actually, some of the stuff was ok, as I remember in my fog of memory, But there were a fair number of truly idiotic folks like PP.

"There are none so hoplessly enslaved as those who falsely believe they are free." (Goethe)

Good post

And an excellent rebuttal.

Dumbest thread of the year.

Dumbest thread of the year. Griffin shouldn't even bother responding to these clowns.

The Eleventh Day of Every Month

Come on...

Aren't we adults? We can take it.

This is a very elaborate piece of disinfo. It has to be dealt with immediately and in the open.

And it has been done.

I was curious

Because I always strive to practice what I preach, and having in the past assigned to DRG and Kevin Ryan the title of "most credible people in 9/11 truth", I read the allegations and Griffin's response. I take it that first off, people are targeting Griffin because his work is first rate. Not only is his work first rate but Griffin himself seems to be a very honest person who does not shy away from admitting mistakes as with his repetition of a misunderstanding about airfones. With Griffin, you can be sure that he will not try to conceal his errors, which is what a real intellectual is all about. Not covering for himself, but acknowledging mistakes openly and correcting them. Very simple. Everyone need not agree with the man's religion or personal philosophy but that has no bearing on his work on 9/11, which stands on its own merits. Indeed, he would seem to be a remarkable and exemplary christian from whom many religious people around the world could learn much.

That said, it's interesting to see how some people react when anyone raises this type of question. There is nothing wrong with wanting to know more about DRG and any potential agenda that might color his views. This is perfectly natural and we should encourage people to discuss anyone and everyone's background, not only to suss out possible disinfo but also to understand one another, know where we agree and disagree, and generally come to understand more about the world generally. Let history decide who the heroes were, if any. Let's not fall into such obvious traps as so many do, following without questioning--isn't that what got us in this mess?


Real Truther a.k.a. Verdadero Verdadero

WTCdemolition.com - Harvard Task Force


Indeed, RT

This is not the time to blinker ourselves from criticism or examination. Pure metal stays that way, no matter how hot the crucible gets. Since we're the ones turning up the heat, our own dross becomes exposed.
Not a bad thing, imho.


Thanks, Mssr. Jouet.

I think RT has it right: we need to look at dissention, all forms of discussion, and even disinformation, and deal with it clearly and well. Thanks for posting this interchange.

As for the title... it got people's attention, at least.


The thread at CGCS in which the allegations against Dr. Griffin were made has been deleted by the moderators and administrators at CGCS.

The author has now made private and public claims that "it was satire".

An apology has been posted at CGCS by the author of the allegations. He contacted me asking me to transmit his apology to Dr. Griffin, which I have done, but my response to the author was simply that, if I could do the work to figure out how to contact Dr. Griffin directly, he could too.

The author of the allegations has asked me to delete Dr. Griffin's response in my blog at CGCS as well as here. Yet his own allegations remained in place for several days and had over 1,500 views and, although I have not verified it yet, I am told that some of his allegations have been mirrored at an anti-9/11 web site.

gosh, it's almost as if

we pulled our own Rovesque ploy of putting out bogus info for the anti-truthers to cite before pulling the rug out by "confessing" it was bogus. hee hee. I KNOW truthers wouldn't do such a thing, but hey, maybe there are some evil disinfo types on our side--what can ya do? kind of like screw loose change calling on kossacks to fight truthers. Imean, if I were some kind of secret agent, I might actually make a fake anti-truth site and make it all really offensive, then go around calling on all kinds of sensitive liberals to attack truthers. then those liberals would all be like "gosh what pricks! the truthers MUST be right! i'm going to be a truther!" if we could only encourage the folks at www.saneworks.us to go on an anti-truther rampage all over the internet. what we should NOT do is pose as supporters of www.saneworks.us and go all over the internet dissing truthers. that would be wrong! :)

so check this out and tell me what is more frightening--neocon disinfo or neocon info:



Real Truther a.k.a. Verdadero Verdadero

WTCdemolition.com - Harvard Task Force


Update II

The moderators and administrators at CGCS have deleted my blog entry there, thus invalidating the links internally and externally and, of course, this means they have deleted Dr. Griffin's response.

PP's apology remains in place, but http://screwloosechange.blogspot.com/ continues to discuss the allegations and the response.