Jones Report - Michael Moore: "I support... a new investigation of this, before we get too far away from it."

Discusses Explosions in Buildings, Demands '100 Angles' of Pentagon Video, and Calls for a New Investigation-- "They Haven't Even Told Us Half the Truth."

Local Mirror:

Aaron Dykes / Jones Report | June 19, 2007

Academy Award winner Michael Moore answered questions on 9/11 truth during a sneak peak of his new documentary, SiCKO, in New York . Our reporters were initially avoided by Moore, but he subsequently decided to approach We Are reporters for a discussion.

Moore brought up his lingering questions on 9/11, which are a clear departure from the 'government negligence' picture he painted in his film Fahrenheit 9/11, released some three years ago.

Moore told reporters, "I've had a number of firefighters tell me over the years and since Fahrenheit 9/11 that they heard these explosions-- that they believe there's MUCH more to the story than we've been told. I don't think the official investigations have told us the complete truth-- they haven't even told us half the truth."


Update: Covered on dailykos - digg link

Great Stuff, Sort Of

Pretty powerful response from Moore. Though very suspicious. He seems focused on the Pentagon and the video cameras available. While I agree with him that there are plenty of pentagon cameras which could show us exactly whatever it was that hit the Pentagon, it seems slightly like a set up for an upcoming release of Pentagon videos which very well could show a plane hitting the Pentagon resulting in taking the wind out the sails of the Truth Movement. Regardless, he didn't seem interested in other powerful aspects of 911 such as NORAD's failure to respond, or Pentagon anti-missile batteries failing to respond, WTC 7, Able Danger, Flight 93 and the five mile trail of scattered debris, molten metal at the WTC, the August 6th PDB, etc... Part of me is hoping Moore is sincere in a call for an authentic and independent investigation. But part of me thinks he's fearful of 911 Truthers and our internet presence. Is he a Truther? or is he securing solid box office reciepts? Let's hope for the best without collapsing our long list of questions into one question about Pentagon video footage.

Show "Do not trust Moore!" by Alek Hidell


Measure MM by every word and action, -not by his middle class background (is 9/11 truth class struggle ??), acquaintances of friends, etc.!!!

I have read MM's books and watched his films.

They are excellent to a great extend.

i believe MM is a truther, but handles the topic more carefully by avoiding "the kiss of death" of the subject to some extent. This way he manages to stay mainstream. In the same time he does raise very critical issues (Fahrenheit 9/11 was a highly critical/alternative view of 9/11 film!!!).

MM manages to be (left)mainstream, while raising very critical questions.
I think that serves our movement!!!

Yes, take it easy.

I genuinely like Michael Moore. I like his documentaries. I would love to have him as a friend and share a few beers.

That's the reason I'm so perplexed, of his strange attitude towards 911 truth.

My 2 cent on Moore and his movies...

I have seen an advanced screening of SiCKO. All I can say is, I thought Loose Change: Final Cut would be the most revolutionary movie of the year. That honor may very well be snatched away by SiCKO! Shocking, frightening, heartbreaking and maddening are only a few words that describe scene after scene of this top notch piece of documentary filmmaking. If this movie doesn't rouse us Americans from our drug and alcohol induced slumber... nothing will. Michael Moore is brilliant!

As for Fahrenheit 911, yes, I was disappointed. But I think Moore is smart enough to realize that too much truth can be a dangerous thing too. Not saying I agree... but I understand.

I totally agree with you, Chris Rose. I somehow saw the entire

"Sicko" on Google Video late last night, & it was amazing!!! We are prisoners of the healthcare system in the U.S., and they are milking the poor & working-class out of every last penny--based on lies, lies, lies!!! Furthermore, our maltreatment of 9/11 First Responders is absolutely sickening!!!

You do?

I don't understand. I agree that SICKO is chocking. But, this is an American issue. Because the rest of us Euros and the Canucks have a univeral insurance system based on tax. Surely this is the only civilized solution? No fukkin question about it.

If you are suggesting that MM is honorable, but being tactic? This is a strange tactic. Because that the 911 was an inside job is so obvious that a child can see it by now. And there is now a critical mass in the American population.

I mean Michael Moore is now in a position to become the ultimate hero. He seems to chose not to be...Why is that? Cowardice? Or what?

"The Ultimate Hero"

You mean like MLK, JFK or RFK? Let's not be naive about how this country deals with it's "ultimate hero's". Again, I'm not saying I agree with Michael Moore's reluctance to take on the title and responsiblities of being an "ultimate hero"... but I certainly understand. "Ultimate Hero's" tend to pay the "ultimate price".

Whether he is "ultimate" or not, MM is certainly a "hero" in my book!
"Cogito ergo sum"

this is America, not Europe

"But, this is an American issue. Because the rest of us Euros and the Canucks have a univeral insurance system based on tax. Surely this is the only civilized solution? No fukkin question about it."

Oh there is a BIG question about it. I could not more strongly disagree with your assessment. Free market FTW -- and when I say free, I mean inter alia free to openly discuss the evils of big pharma including their suppression of natural remedies and their propagandizing the masses *and* doctors, and then act accordingly. Freedom is dangerous, but real Americans want it anyway. Individual choice good; collectivism bad.

This being a 9/11 site, I'm not going to debate this particular issue further. I just wanted to state for the record that there is more than one perspective on this issue among those of us here.

Want to figure out 9/11? Ponder the 9/11 "Mineta Stone"

I haven't seen Sicko yet, but...

Your comments on it wory me. Highly emotional, huh? BE CAREFUL!! Don't you understand that that is EXACTLY how they shut down your rational thinking? I saw F911 Bowling For Columbine and Rodger and Me... The guy is a propagandist. He's the liberal Karl Rove, you can be sure of it. His films are about 40% useful information, 30% completely distorted/misleading BULLSHIT, 30% emotional pupeteering. DEFINITELY TAKE HIM WITH A GRAIN OF SALT!!


In Bowling, he tries to conflate the term "Africanized" honeybees with the white man's "Negrophobia". I believe he tries to say that the bees don't come from Africa, but from South America. TOTAL FUCKING BULLSHIT!!!!! The aggressive strain DID in fact arise from a cross-breeding of an African species with a western species, and they first GOT LOOSE in South America. He's basically trying to say that these bees are called "Africanized" because whitey thinks they're agressive like "them n**gers". Fucking retarded. They come from Africa, PERIOD. There's no racism involved.

He also tries to say that it is completely safe for a white person to go walking around in the middle of "the hood" anytime they want. He uses South Central LA as an example. He's trying to say it is just racist paranoia that makes whitey think "the hood" is unsafe. Uggghhh. First of all, he's walking around in the middle of the day with a camera crew. So there's a couple caveats to his claim already. Second, the part of South Central that he' s in looks to have been at least somewhat "gentrified" since the riots. Look, I don't have a racist bone in my body, but I'm not going to deny the reality that there are some places in the US where you don't want to end up alone if you are white. And I'm sure that still applies in reverse in some areas too.
I've spent a LOT of time in New Orleans over the years (Pre-Katrina) and I can tell you from experience there are areas there where you are simply not safe if you are white. Also, I play around with music from time to time. Recently I was hanging out with some rap artists/producers in Miami. These guys are as "thug" as they come, really "Dirty South", "Gangsta Rap" type guys. I just love all kinds of music, and was taking the opportunity to learn more about music production, and I got along with a few of these guys really well. Anyway, I was going down to their music studio in one of the rougher areas of Miami from like 9:00 pm to about 1:00 am. NO FUCKING WAY I WOULD HAVE BEEN DOWN THERE ALONE!!! (That is, without an "insider" to escort me.) And I wouldn't go down there with a group of my friends from the chess club, or the debate club, or the yacht club either. And I'm no push-over. I'm a pretty good sized guy, and I carry myself like you don't want to bother me. Still... I went down to this studio about 10 - 12 times over the course of about 2 - 3 months and there was at least one "close call" involving firearms. So yes, there are some areas in the US that you won't be safe in depending on your skin-color. This is just a fact of fucking life, and Michael Moore tries to deny that reality and distort the issue to manipulate people into supporting a political agenda.

Another thing he does in the movie is try to compare the crime rate of Detroit with that of Sarnia, Ontario. LOL!!! That's like comparing New York to fucking Mayburry or something!!



You tell me what's wrong with that comparison.

"Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without." - Buddha
"What you do will be insignificant, but it is very important that you do it." - Gandhi
"The Sun never shined on a cause of greater worth." - Thomas Paine

His comments are getting good support on Daily Kos !!!

They have an opinion poll...

Link to vote :


Also better DIGG Link :


Many thanks and best wishes


I think Michael went through a transformation with making Sicko. He is eating better and taking better care of himself. He spent time with the first responders. He has said the firemen told him about the bombs. I think he has bonded with them and hopefully will stand up for them.

If an upcoming release shows a plane hitting the Pentagon,

how can that plane be AA-77 with a 125' wingspan disappearing into a 16' hole?

Here are some more questions to ponder regarding the Pentagon:

· Hani Hanjour could not have flown back 250 miles from Ohio to find & hit the Pentagon, (let alone the small, renovated wedge).

· Hanjour could not have made incredible maneuvers in a Boeing 757& fly 2 feet above the ground.

· A Boeing 757 can NOT make/disappear through a 16-foot initial impact hole. The airliner has a 125-foot wingspan & two huge steel/titanium engines that "disappeared" as did the 250 seats & the luggage.

· There is no way they could ID a planeload of people that slammed the Pentagon @ 530 mph, while the plane itself was supposedly obliterated. The fictitious DNA results were fabricated to bolster the official lie.

· 80 videos of whatever hit or blew-up the Pentagon are being withheld by the gov't for no reason. (The only videos released look like an A3 SkyWarrior!)

none of those are questions,

none of those are questions, those are assertive speculation.

///////////////////// - $1 DVDs shipped - email for info

Great work

We Are Change strikes again. These people is assoication with Alex Jones have done groundbreaking work. It's interesting to watch them evolve. They get better each time.

Do not depend on Michael Moore

Herblay FRANCE ,

Apart the fact that MIchael Moore will not be the one to expose the murderers of 911 except if there is money at stake , he is helping us along.
He shows us that his political bias does not let him see that there are some good people in the Repulblican party. Courage Ron PAUL , the world needs men like you. The 911 truth should not be a Democrate/Republican problem.
This video is important because now we know where we stand with Michael Moore. Keep up the good work and continue to put on the videos on the internet.
Thanks John

SiCKO http://files.fileXXXXXX


(remove X's)


rename to avi

///////////////////// - $1 DVDs shipped - email for info

This is the entire "SICKO"

This is the entire "SICKO" movie

In case no one noticed.....

///////////////////// - $1 DVDs shipped - email for info

What is America scared of? Being happy? Being well?..

As I watch Australia go the way of America, the way of me, personal debt, increasing medical costs, fear and a spectacular stock market; I wonder why the fuck we want what you have. Then I think of what our television tells me it's like in America; well I'm told it's the land of dreams where everybody is beautiful and has a big house and a nice car, B/S, B/S, B/S.

I blame the media and its corporate masters for all your ills, but then I remember it was your politicians that gave them the power so they could line their own pockets!

America has become the land of slaves and the mind fucked, I pray you can turn it around before we all follow along with the American dream of dog eat dog and fuck the poor and sick.

Michael Moore might not be the 9/11 hero we pray for but he has done a great service to the rest of the world by telling us how bad it is in the land of the free!

Please win the info war or the world is going back to the dark ages.

Regards John

WE GOT TO TAKE THE POWER BACK!... rage against the machine!!

SICKO missed the mark

The problem with the US health care cannot be solved with a socialized medical system. Creating yet another incredibly large government agency (perhaps it would be the largest) is not the solution. The solution would be simply to remove the health care industry executives from writing policies in DC which enable run away costs and profits in an industry which should be leaning more towards non-profit. If that problem were resolved we all could afford decent health care and continue the American way, which is different from every country in the world. Here, the government is supposed to stay out of your private life, unlike some of the countries Michael Moore visited in his film (sorry if my American pride and patriotic ideology is troubling to you). If Michael Moore wants an idea for his next documentary why doesn't he tackle the biggest problem in the US: Media. If the citizens in the US were ever to get the straight story about all things important, we are more than capable of figuring out solutions on our own without the assistance of the government. So, Mike, with all due respect, why don't you ask Bill Clinton why he signed the Telecommunications act in 1996 which paved the way for five corporations with multinational interests to monopolize the media and dictate what information Americans can and cannot learn about. After all, if Americans were more informed about the Medical Insurance and Pharmaceutical Industries take over of US domestic health care policy in the first place we would have been able to prevent such SICKO heartbreak from occurring. Your film's heart is in the right place but the thinking is a bit skewed. America first!

Very nice action.

That 911 was an inside job is by now clear.

MM can almost be seen as an insider when it comes to information about 911. He must be aware of all the essential facts about 911. He is also very brave. Still he chose to avoid it and deny it. How is this possible? I can't get it into my thick skull.

Well, one clue is that the rest of the lefty /liberals are behaving in the same fashion. Do they have a controller who tells them that "no no don't look into this"? This is hard to believe... but, when you run out of probable explanations...

They have several controllers

Lefty gatekeepers: Keith Olbermann, Bill Maher, Jon Stewart, Colbert, Chomsky, Kos, David Corn, Andrew Cockburn, Greg Palast, Amy Goodman, Al Franken, Monbiot, Taibbi, and on and on and on...

All these people are either CIA or controlled by CIA producers/directors/editors. The range of acceptable discourse is centrally controlled from the top down. Really a brilliant mind control mechanism when you look at it. Smug liberals look down on right wingers who are brainwashed by Fox news, but are completely blind to their own brainwashing.

It could be true.

"Smug liberals look down on right wingers who are brainwashed by Fox news, but are completely blind to their own brainwashing."

I agree 100% to this. I have been aware of this for some time.

"All these people are either CIA or controlled by CIA producers/directors/editors. The range of acceptable discourse is centrally controlled from the top down. Really a brilliant mind control mechanism when you look at it."

As I said in my previous post, this is hard to believe. If this is a fact, it must have been going on for decades. And as you say: It would be the perfect mind control mechanism. We already know about "Operation Mockingbird" and that they behaved in a similar mode regarding the JFK investigation etc. But, that the whole of the liberal left "opposition" is controlled is still a bit hard to swallow.

But, It sure is worthy a serious consideration... investigation...

i know liberals that are......

just as controlled (self censored) as MM and AG and they have nothing to lose or gain other than their smug self dillusion that they are more humane than conservatives. Such an ego is much harder to break down because one must reconsider that "I am a humanist so there is no way I can be wrong" such as MM's comment about not considering Ron Paul because he is a republican.

MM, AG and the rest of them have two barriers to overcome, internal and external sensorship. Perhaps that is why the patriot movment/Ron Paul supporters consist mostly of conservatives/libertarians and those who would rather not vote or have an opinion.


It has been going on for decades.

Listen to this video:

9/11 Truthers need to keep doing deep political research beyond just the topic of 9/11. WW1, WW2, the Cold War, Communism, Capitalism... Many, many lies.

"Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without." - Buddha
"What you do will be insignificant, but it is very important that you do it." - Gandhi
"The Sun never shined on a cause of greater worth." - Thomas Paine

I agree, don't trust Moore,

I agree, don't trust Moore, but otherwise this is fantastic. People can't leave their houses anymore without being confronted!! Big thanks to and, they have set this movement on fire!

i think he fears us and is

i think he fears us and is throwing us a bone to make us back off a bit. being Michael Moore he no doubt hears from truthers constantly and is likely sick of it. sure, maybe hes sincere about wanting to know what happened at the Pentagon etc., but if the man REALLY wanted to help he could. its been 5 years, where has he been? i found this qoute interesting:"And I intend, in my own way, to find some answers," Moore added. really Mike, again, where have you been? why are you saying this now and what specifically do you plan on doing about the 9/11 fraud? its always good when someone prominent questions 9/11 in any way, it brings more attention to the fact that the offical story is being questioned, but Moore hasnt shown me anything but lip service, just like the rest. in your own way Mike? i'll believe it when i see it, all Fahrenheit 9/11 did was help reinforce the incompetence myth, so really i think hes done more harm than good in some ways. its time to be a REAL investigative reporter Mike, its time to investigate 9/11. stop talking and take some fucking action already if this is how you really feel. and to the people saying Moore coming out for 9/11 truth would "harm the movement", did Rosie(shes arguably more hated than Moore in rightwing circles and in the mainstream) "harm" us? or did she bring 9/11 truth to the attention of millions who might not have otherwise heard that the official story is being heavily questioned? im all for Moore finding his spine in relation to 9/11, i just personally dont believe it and wont until i see some action.

"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Former Director, CIA

Michael Moore's future projects?

This is a good debate and topic in this thread. Especially the CIA controlled media, and to what extent, if so. Other than that. We have to realize that Michael Moore has been devoted to the HealthCare system in this country for the last years or so and devoted to his film SiCKO. Let's give him a chance that he might now devote his time to some 9/11 research now that SiCKO is complete and due out. I agree to be cautious and double check everything, but let's hope and encourage Michael to now delve into the 9/11 Truth topic. It can only help us.

I also like that Solon? quote I heard recently about citizens not shying away from controversy in a functioning society or something. Great quote for the truth movement.

Single payer universal coverage in my lifetime?

If MM's work can bring about single payer health care system in this country, I'm more than willing to cut the man some slack.

He's going after some very powerful entrenched corporations with a FILM! I would encourage everyone to spend some hard earned cash and see the flick. It debuts June 29. From what I've heard, this film might wake the people up to power and greed of these corporations.

Our health care system is seriously FUCKED and yet another example of profits before people. After all aren't the runaway corporations which control the government the REAL problem we are dealing with? see the film and then demand single-payer (very important term) universal health care!

I want to lead a long life with good health and health care to fight the battles we all need to be fighting and with you by my side..

and i honestly didnt realize

and i honestly didnt realize that Moore was so fucking naive. clearly locked in the 2 party charade, he couldnt bring himself to even think about voting for a republican, as if party labels mean much of anything at this point. and when he said "maybe a new administration can come in......." come in and do what Mike? this guy really thinks that a Hillary or an Obama is gonna re-open 9/11? hes either a liar or the single most naive "political genius" in history. what a hack thing to say. wait for a new administration, HA!

"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Former Director, CIA

Moore is NOT naive

Moore is a brilliant propagandist. He isn't even a real liberal, he just plays one in the movies. He does his job very well. He has the same job as Bill O'Reilly, fanning the flames of the culture wars. It is all about divide and conquer. The elites want what's left of the US middle class divided and fighting amongst themselves. Moore is a master salesman, he is selling the idea that the Dems and Reps are actually different, and that voting matters. Keep the sheeple in the matrix as long as possible, that is the game.

chris, sorry to tell you but

i would never in my life vote republican, ever!!!

i dont crae what ron paul says.. im not even sure what he said that gives everyone a boner either...

you know i like you chris so dont think im trying to fight with you, just telling you how i fell...

i can respect that, i think

i can respect that, i think people here overstate Paul as well(and are all too willing to compromise for him), though he is the best candidate right now. but would you not vote for him because of how you feel about him or specifically because he is a republican? if its the latter than im sorry, but you're no better than any partisan hack that you probably criticize.

"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Former Director, CIA

call me what you want..

i would rather not vote at all then vote for a repub... not for pres at least.. ive had enough of these douche bags...

but trust me, i dont like any of the dems either... i think we are just fucked who ever wins..

Both parties are

Both parties are corrupt.
And I agree, there isn't a viable candidate to give a vote to at this time. But what party has gotten us into this mess????Oh yeah, the Republicans and I definitely wouldn't blindly give my vote for a Republican. Can someone please inform me what exactly Ron Paul has even said about 911?

However, here are some gems:

Voted NO on expanding research to more embryonic stem cell lines. (Jan 2007)
Voted NO on allowing human embryonic stem cell research. (May 2005)
Voted YES on funding for health providers who don't provide abortion info. (Sep 2002)
Voted YES on banning gay adoptions in DC. (Jul 1999)

Voted YES on building a fence along the Mexican border. (Sep 2006) A Fence????Please.
Voted YES on reporting illegal aliens who receive hospital treatment. (May 2004)

lefty VS righty,.

I sure don't see why you guys on the right are so behind Ron Paul,. he is claiming to be a libratarian,. and yet is against imagration,. so freedom for US and our us-ness? forget the poor huddled masses. Ron would scrap most every social program serviving in america, what would this leave the poor jobless masses who still own no land and have no hope of servival? sounds like corporate fudalism is his/your goal? no collective control,. only private interests. Some resources are not 'property' when corporations are in control of everything,. people are turned into wage slaves if they are lucky enouph to be given work,. in south america the corporations got contol of the water utility and literally where taxing people for gathering rainwater! they claimed to oun it! There needs to be some balance of free market and collective i.e. COMMUNITY control over collective shared resources,. I agree that the 'governments' we have known all our lives are corrupt and sick,. In fact im basicly an anarchist,. you know volintary cooperation and mutual aid,.
"liberals are despised and always lose" really?
"some good people in the Repulblican party" is that so? where are they ???
you guys keep talking about 'not a left or right issue' and 911 really is not,. and then you start pushing rightwing ideology.
the only candidates that have a chance to CHANGE anything will not come form ether of the two wings of the corporate control structure.
"MIHOP 911 Prosecution" should be the ONLY item on the platform of an independant, and then we can really put down the collective vs private ounership debate.

for those that continue to claim people won't work without private ownership watch this excelent doc. good copy bad copy


I agree totally. Couldn't believe they brought him up. Did they run out of 9-11 questions ?
Paul seems like a decent fellow and he has the Mid East policies of an adult. But - saw Paul on Stewart and Colbert and the subjects brought up were getting rid of the Post Office, Medicare and Unicef etc.
I can't see anyone with such priorities ever getting elected, and no comments at all on 9-11 Truth
The connection between Paul supporters and some in the Truth Movement seems a lot closer than needed.
(Moore is a divisive character in the US, but he has proved he's not afraid to go against the flow. A lot better response than from Goodman !)

I don't think he said get

I don't think he said get rid of Post Office... just offer alternatives in the private sector

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Alternatives in the private sector?

Yeah, Look what great hands our health care is in.

On Colbert...

That was pretty much a joke. Colbert was asking him, one-by-one, if he would get rid of various agencies. He said yes to all of them, including Unicef, saying something like "I really think we could handle charity better." Regarding all the other agencies, I think he meant he would like to restructure them and get rid of their corruption. But I couldn't believe he answered the way he did, joke or not, because some will take what he said literally.

It would be a herculean task

It would be a herculean task to accomplish 1/10th of what he agreed to, remember Colbert asked the question, he just answered by NOT lowering his hand.
The last agency on the list was UNICEF, and he said it was not in his sights.

I admire any man who speaks the truth... Don't twist the truth to suit your personal beliefs.

I agree with a lot of what

I agree with a lot of what Paul has to say. However :
- There are ways of saying what you want to say, and not what the interviewer controls. Media relations 101. When Colbert reads his list - Pipe up 'Federal Reserve'. Where was any mention of that ? I thought that was supposed to be one of his main points.
- They have dress rehearsals . He would come across as a bit of an extremist to a casual observer. Unicef was probably meant as a joke, but he didn't really handle it well, and that was the final topic.
- Where is any mention of a new 9-11 inquiry anywhere on his web site ? Or in a public debate or speech ? Isn't this a 9-11 site ?

you have that wrong

1. there are many former democrats in my ron paul meetup.
2. ron paul is NOT against immigration as you say. go read his website
3. evidence that ron would "scrap all social programs"? he is against collectivism, therefore against most government programs. but as president he would not be able to just "scrap" programs at will, nor would that be his priority.
4. You won't HAVE your favorite social programs at all if we continue the insane empire building. Show me another candidate who will actually change our foreign policy, not just pull us out of Iraq only to invade Syria or some other country?

"Our country's founders cherished liberty, not democracy."
-Ron Paul


Very well said.

Any other candidate will be nothing but "business as usual".

And you people that keep throwing around "right wing agenda"... I support Ron Paul, and I was / am more of a "lefty". (Waking up to 9/11 though, I now think the left/right thing is a joke.)

Ron Paul strikes me as someone who will listen to the will of the people, so I wouldn't worry too much that he's gonna cut off all the free-bees if we don't want him to.
"Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without." - Buddha
"What you do will be insignificant, but it is very important that you do it." - Gandhi
"The Sun never shined on a cause of greater worth." - Thomas Paine

Great video. Loved the

Great video.

Loved the Åmy Goodman confrontation. She runs around pretending to be "of the people" but she won't even answer a question by a REAL indie reporter on WTC7, which she witnessed in the flesh.

Moore? "Who gives a shit" is my initial response. His F911 was garbage. Schoenman did a great piece on the film called "Fahrenheit 711" which is probably still available on the TakingAim website. Lots of evidence has emerged since which locks the "inside job" thesis, but lots of evidence was available when he made his film too; he intentionally avoided said evidence in order to promote the demorats. I don't really care about his opinion one way or the other.

The Eleventh Day of Every Month

Pied Piper

Yeah, I'm gonna follow this guy, and Amy Goodman, and Greg Palast. These people are professional scumbags. How the hell can you call yourself an investigative reporter six years into this nightmare and make a statement like "they've got cameras in the trees" when referring to the pentagon? It's beyond belief.

I think this is a positive development

However, let's not celebrate this one too much yet.
Michael Moore has always been a controlled opposition shill for the democrats.
He supported the war monger Wesley Clark in the last election.
His F 9/11 movie was good at giving the message that "if only democrats were in office, none of this would happen."
And, at the end of the interview his comment about only being able to consider democrats tells me he has not changed, that he is part of the left/right sham that exisits, and will probably shill for Obama in the upcoming election. Where does that get us? Yep, bombs away in Iran. More war.

Let's take M Moore with a grain of salt for now. Keep pushing him wherever possible but in no way should we expect this guy to actually do any more investigation. I think Dylan & Co. may be the trailblazers to this with LCFC but we'll have to see.

"Our country's founders cherished liberty, not democracy."
-Ron Paul

There's only one reason that

There's only one reason that Moore is making this kind of statement now.

The movement is growing legs and the establishment needs to once again distract people from facts by distorting them with spin. MM is retaking the stage so that the spin doctors can go back to work - referencing his lies, his half-truths, and his distortions in order to derail 9/11 Truth once again among the uninformed.

From day one MM had no interest in exposing the truth of 9/11. His job was to provide the foundation for a massive spin campaign. He sat on stage at the 2004 DNC alongside establishment insiders Carter, Dean, Leiberman, and the worst of the bunch who are behind silencing 9/11 Truth.

For those who believe in him now, all I an say is "fool me once..." etc.

In fact, Moore's latest propaganda piece "Sicko" speaks loudly of his true intentions. The guy took our bravest survivors/victims from "the pile" and used them to promote a national socialist system of medicine for our supposedly "free" and "independent" nation under "limited" government. He's the lowest form of worm, preying upon 9/11 NYFD survivors and using the INTENTIONAL failures of our government to create an illusion that our medical system must be replaced by a socialist system to be run by our corrupt corporate leaders who''ll use it as a means to funnel your tax dollars into private coffers.

In many ways, Moore is like George Bush. Charming, witty, resourceful, etc. But he's not a good person. He's likeable in social settings but his politics are a reflection of deception, manipulation, and evil.

Don't fall for another lie. Place Moore on permanent ignore and he won't have the ability to use his popularity against us.

I agree, "the collective vs

I agree, "the collective vs private ownership debate" is sneaking in.

stupid question about the site:
how does this point system work? How can I vote on a reply?


Socialist medicine...

"...used them to promote a national socialist system of medicine for our supposedly "free" and "independent" nation under "limited" government."

See, to me this is ignorant.

I think the "limited government" we should be looking for right now is one that doesn't have a military budget twice the size of the entire rest of the world's. One that doesn't have 10 or 15 unaccountable "spook" agencies with "black budgets". One that doesn't have over 700 military bases throughout the world. One where a presidential election season doesn't cost in the billions. One where huge subsidies aren't given to the richest, most powerful corporations so that they can rob and poison the public and the planet more efficiently. One that isn't spending billions trying to put a surveilance camera up every citizen's ass, a small arsenal of exotic weapons on every police officer, and a microchip in every baby...

In my mind the government should be as small as possible IN ALL AREAS, but that doesn't mean it shouldn't function to better people's lives. Government should offer protection and some degree of "help", where needed.

I'm a Canadian, but I grew up in the States. If I get sick in Canada, I just go to the doctor. If I get sick in the States... Guess I better take up Christianity and start praying. YOU HAVE TO BE FUCKING RICH NOW TO GET HEALTHCARE IN THE STATES!! Is some of the tax revenue that is supposed to go to healthcare being funneled off for nefarious purposes? Sure, probably. Could the system be more efficient? Sure, probably. But you're not going to hear me complaining about the government setting up a system THAT ACTUALLY HELPS PEOPLE before you hear me complaining about all of my money they're using to KILL PEOPLE. You do realize that the dreaded "socialized medicine" has been a reality in all the other developed "western" countries for a long time now, right? And despite the propaganda we've all heard about the "Greatest Nation On Earth", many of those countries actually have a much higher standard of living than the U.S.

See, in my mind, healthcare is A RIGHT not a priviledge. Every human should have realatively easy access to healthcare. Yes doctors need to make money, yes healthcare is a business, but it isn't one where the profit motive should be the driving factor. THAT'S WHY THE GOVERNMENT SHOULD BE INVOLVED, TO MAKE SURE THAT THE FOCUS IS ON PEOPLE, NOT MONEY. And what do you have in the glorious USofA right now? Oh, that's right, 40 or 50 percent of the population CAN'T FUCKING AFFORD TO SEE A DOCTOR!!! The wonders of the "free market", huh?

Think about this:

If the U.S. skimmed just 5 or 10 percent off the top of the military budget, it could set up the best "socialized" healthcare system in the world, and care for every single one of its citizens, no problem.

Let that sink in for a while.

Now think about how fucking silly you sound bitching about the fact that your government might want to take some of your money to HELP PEOPLE, when they're spending such obscene amounts to kill and control people.

Fuck, cut the military budget in half, put 10% into healthcare, and the rest back into the taxpayer's pockets. You'd STILL have the strongest military in the world, and free healthcare, AND everyone would be living "high on the hog".

"Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without." - Buddha
"What you do will be insignificant, but it is very important that you do it." - Gandhi
"The Sun never shined on a cause of greater worth." - Thomas Paine

nice one consciousness, as

nice one consciousness, as an american without health care i say that was a great post. ive had a few health problems in the past and without healthcare im still paying off bills. if i get cancer or something im seriously fucked. the system is broken. you dont have to be some super-liberal socialist to see our priorities are fucked up and to want to make the government work where it should, like in healthcare. i am NOT about big government im just about using government in the most effective and rational way(as you said, cut the military budget, including Israel and other nations militaries we help fund and make sure people are healthy etc). im a liberal-libertarian with a few conservative stances. fuck labels though. like "socialized medicine" for instance. its funny because Moore was just on The View today and some conservative chick(not the blonde bobblehead) was on there and used the exact same term when trying to bait Micheal Moore. so weak.

"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Former Director, CIA

It's not ignorant. First

It's not ignorant.

First off, try not to be so combative. We can discuss issues rather than scream at each other over them.

Second, I agree with you 100% regarding the size of the US military. You see - we're getting closer in our thinking without having to call each other ignorant.

Third, you missed the operating phraseology with regards to my opinion of health care - the fact that it's gonna be handed over to private interests for a profit.

Don't be fooled into thinking that healthcare is unaffordable in the US by so many (I disagree with your statistics, BTW) because it's simply an expensive service. It's unregulated costs are driven sky high in a hegelian attempt to profit while simultaneously convincing the people that healthcare should be a government obligation. The corporations win both ways - only they're gaurunteed the win with socialized medicine.

Secondly, in the real world do you really think the corporations are gonna relinquish their control of the US government so that the people can downsize the military? Not in a million lifetimes. My response that has upset you is geared towards the current reality as opposed to a utopian wish list.

Also, as opposed to being rich to get healthcare in the US, that's a misnomer. Any American can walk into any clinic and receive service. Additionally, medicare is available to anyone whose employer doesn't provide insurance and who's income level is low. The system is screwed up, it's over-priced, and it's in desperate need of repair. But you have to remember that the government's goal is to generate support to socialize medicine for the sake of making it law that our tax dollars go into corporate coffers. I can't support that goal.

Reduce the military? Absolutely. By 80%. But I doubt it's gonna happen. Push for socialized helathcare while the corporations still run the government and will use socialized medicine as a tool for profit? And while we're still running around building a New World Order by force? Like is already well under way in the EU? Absolutely not. No way. The criminals are already in control of too much. They won't get my health care as well.

Take Canadian healthcare for an example. Your doctor says you need an MRI. Are you scheduled to have an MRI next month? In 4 or 6 months? I would have mine the next day. And believe me, I'm far from being rich. And my health insurance isn't cheap.

I had a relative in Canada who spent days in a hospital corridor dying with cancer - and that was in Alberta - the wealthiest Canadian province. In Ontario they laid off thousands of nurses and closed down hospitals because they said there wasn't enough money. They had MRI machines in boxes with no trained technicians. Then they ended up rehiring the nurses at lower wages and sent them to patients at their homes because the hospitals had been closed. is that how health care should be practiced?

And that's better healthcare? if it's so good then why do wealthy Canadians buy supplemental US health insurance policies?

The bottom line is that the Canadian government has already given over health management to private corporations - at taxpayer expense. And the system is as bad as it is in England.

You're also not the only Canadian who's lived on both sides of the border. So have I. One thing that I've learned is that a system with a smaller safety net makes you work harder. When I had a job with poor medical care I was determined to learn and find a job with better care.

I've never taken a dime of assistance from any agency, and I've struggled in both countries. I'm better off because of it and so is my family. If I'd walked into an office in Canada when I had no work and said "please pay my rent and buy me some food!" I wouldn't have had incentive to get up at 4:30 AM to dig ditches in the cold. I've worked two jobs at a time so that my wife could raise our kids without daycare, and I've earned a career where I can now work a single job while my wife is able to stay at home.

Not because of state or socialized support. But because of the belief that the individual is responsible for his or her self, not the government. The government of a wealthy nation should provide a nice safety net for those who can't support themselves, but liberty and freedom from oppressive government doesn't come without hard work and independence by each individual.

Based upon those beliefs, I believe that healthcare is a PRIVELEDGE, not a RIGHT. We need to work for it. Those who can't work for it should have a good safety net (as opposed to todays poor net). But the government should never be my keeper. Once they are, then I become answerable to them instead of them being answerable to me. Just imagine if the Bush Administration or a Hillary Administration were also in charge of our health plans. It's unthinkable.

My apologies. Civility is good.

(CAPS ARE FOR EMPHASIS, not shouting.)

Secondly, in the real world do you really think the corporations are gonna relinquish their control of the US government so that the people can downsize the military? Not in a million lifetimes. My response that has upset you is geared towards the current reality as opposed to a utopian wish list.

In the real world do you really think the corporations, media, and government are just going to say, "OK, you got us!! We did 9/11." and reliquish their control so we can live in peace instead of apocalyptic madness? No? So what are we all trying to do here?

People like to sling that "utopian" epithet around a lot. I think we should work towards utopia, but expect to settle for reality. Work towards utopia using realistic methods and have realistic expectations.

Third, you missed the operating phraseology with regards to my opinion of health care - the fact that it's gonna be handed over to private interests for a profit.

We're kinda getting caught in a "Catch 22"/paradox here. You're claiming that "socializing" medicine is in reality handing it over to private interests, since our "elected officials" are incestuously interacting with these corporate forces, right? So... if we "socialize" it, we're giving control to the corporate elite, and if we leave it like it is... we're giving control to the corporate elite! No, no, no. Ok, the problem here is that there is a solution that was implicit in my statements, that I should have made explicit. OBVIOUSLY there must be MASSIVE reforms in government for any social progams to be desirable. We must return control to the people, and restore the rule of law. Right now, this is only a hypothetical, to be sure. But assuming we are able to restore some kind of system of just governance, a just healthcare system would be within the realm of reality instead of fantasy.

I agree with you on the issue of personal responsibility. I think people should strive to provide for themsleves and their families, and that hard work builds character. I definitely believe that some sort of meritocracy, and some degree of capitalism are 100% necessary for a just society. But there must be limits on everything. I don't think personal responsibility Vs. "entitlement" is a black and white issue, and I don't think an "either-or" solution is viable. There must be some compromise.

As far as healthcare = right/priviledge... I stand on my original statement. The same with education (maybe to a lesser degree). These, TO ME, are two of the pillars of what makes our society "civilized". If the systems we devise are not intended to provide humans with healthcare, education, some degree of protection from violence, and access to food, what exactly are they for? I believe that government is best which governs least, but I want that small amount of governing that it DOES do to be to the benefit of man, not to his detriment, or simply to control him. If we go too far in the direction of "personal responsibility", well that's just the "law of the jungle", now isn't it?

(PS. I was being hyperbolic when I said 40%-50% can't afford healthcare.)

"Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without." - Buddha
"What you do will be insignificant, but it is very important that you do it." - Gandhi
"The Sun never shined on a cause of greater worth." - Thomas Paine

For all of those who are

For all of those who are blocking my comments, I maintain the same positions that Presidential Candidate Ron Paul holds. Smaller military, no foreign entanglements, abolish the IRS, individual liberty, limited government, and removal of government control by corporate interests.

That's the basis of of my concerns regarding the new MM movie "Sicko" and that's the basis of my concerns regarding a socialized health system. Giving corporations more control over our lives by expanding their influence does not align with the tenets of liberty and government by the people. I thought 9/11 would have opened more people's eyes to that concept.

So go ahead and vote this comment down as well. I oppose tyranny in all forms - including domination of my health interests by profiteering corporatists who run this country. You're lying to yourself if you think our current GOP/Dem led government would give you anything that they promise or that you hope for.

Stop Dreaming:

Oh but he would love to take

Oh but he would love to take away a woman's right to choose.

I say NO THANKS, i'll pass on this guy.
I don't need a man telling me what I can and cannot do with my body.


I'm sorry ladies, but this is dumb. DON'T YOU FUCKING UNDERSTAND WHAT IS GOING ON IN THE WORLD RIGHT NOW?!?!?!?!?! If we don't get people who believe in LIBERTY running the show, you're going to have MEN telling you what to do with your body, what to eat, what you can wear, when you can have kids, when to SHIT, when to PISS, when TO SAY "BOO", WHEN TO BREATHE, WHEN TO SPEAK, WHEN TO BLINK...

So just keep making your political decisions based on the little "pet" issues. I swear, that's not playing DIRECTLY into their strategy or anything.

These dominators, these authoritarians, these CONTROL FREAKS want to take away your right and your very ABILITY to even think freely!!! YOU'RE NOT EVEN GOING TO KNOW THAT YOU DON'T HAVE REPRODUCTIVE RIGHTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Can you understand that? The governments and militaries of the US and other western countries are developing technologies and tactics that are truly beginning to enter the realm of science fiction. Research is being done on drugs, human cognition, media/propaganda techniques, artificial intelligence, human-computer interfacing, nanotechnology, population control... This is going on 24-7-365 WITH AN UNLIMITED BUDGET. If you're posting on this site, I assume you already understand to some degree how effective the "Powers That Be" have been in shaping our perception of "reality" thus far. THEY'RE LEARNING MORE EVERY DAY. THEY'RE DEVELOPING NEW TECHNIQUES AND TECHNOLOGIES EVERY DAY.



I'm pro-choice. But it just doesn't fucking matter at this moment in history. WAKE UP.

"Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without." - Buddha
"What you do will be insignificant, but it is very important that you do it." - Gandhi
"The Sun never shined on a cause of greater worth." - Thomas Paine

Here's some constructive criticism... fuck you.

Your hypocrisy is showing. This is a liberty v. tyranny issue RIGHT NOW, not in some coming dystopia as foretold by Alex Jones. Okay? You're either for the right of human beings to be sovereign in their bodies, or you're not. YOU are the one falling into "their" trap, allowing "them" to shape your reality, when you display your ignorance of the fact that the danger is in the form of a continuum of violations of individual liberty, which include prohibitions on abortion AND the implanted chip AND "population control."

Paul is seriously conflicted in this area and I can see you have a problem with that. I suggest you grow up and recognize that major compromise is going to be required of anyone who wants to support a presidential candidate in this fucked up system. Asking people who recognize existing threats to their liberty to shut up and let you live undisturbed in your Ron Paul fantasy world is pathetic.

"Fuck you." Duly noted.

It was my version of tough love. Deal with it.

"This is a liberty v. tyranny issue RIGHT NOW, not in some coming dystopia as foretold by Alex Jones."

I agree. Reproductive rights is a tyranny issue right now. I'm pro-choice, I agree that it is an important issue. The thing that I have a problem with is I see this issue pulling people around by the nose, acting as a distraction when there are deeper issues threatening us in much more sweeping ways that will likely end up hurting reproductive rights anyway. I get disgusted when I see a person who is presumably "awake" disqualifying Ron Paul simply because he might leave abortion up to the individual states. For get about the fact that he is probably the only candidate who isn't owned by the very people who would like to enslave us.

I believe I've said it to you before... You'd rather have Hillary? Just because of the abortion issue?

I don't understand why this concept is so hard to grasp, casseia. You and I are political dissidents in the neocons' book. If we don't get control of the situation (an effort which I feel Ron Paul would help greatly) you won't be worrying much about your uterus.

And this "dystopia" that you seem to think is such a fantastic impossibility? East Germany. Stalin's USSR, North Korea, Nazi Germany, Communist China (do you know what happened during the "Cultural Revolution" in China?)... Now imagine those horrors with modern information technologies in the mix. Modern surveilance. All the creative new lethal and "non-lethal" weapons that are being put into the hands of state sponsored thugs. Fun new drugs. Nanotech. I don't get my opinions on these matters from Alex Jones or any other pundit. I do my own research. I understand the implications of the exponential growth of technology. (Exponential growth that is largely invisible to the public...) I look at the objectives of our current "leaders" in documents like "Rebuilding America's Defenses" or the ones found here : Military Future

I don't agree with Ron Paul on every issue. I just think he's the only genuine, principled human being in the presidential race. I think if we end up with Rudy, or Romney, or Hillary, or Obama we're likely to be in the same boat as now or worse. I don't think the abortion issue is important when compared to the fact that we are careening into totalitarianism. I guess some of us still don't quite grasp what this means. We've lived in fantasy land for to long. Once the brutality begins, maybe you'll understand why my priorities lie where they do.

"Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without." - Buddha
"What you do will be insignificant, but it is very important that you do it." - Gandhi
"The Sun never shined on a cause of greater worth." - Thomas Paine

My .02 cents

"If we lived in a perfect world, abortion would be safe, legal and affordable...and nobody would be choosing to get one. Such a choice is one of the most extreme burdens facing a woman". That is what i told my girlfriend when she was pregnent, and Her reply was "thank You so much for saying that".

I believe such choices are made out of economics. Restoring states rights brings prosperity to the individual and society as a whole wich allows freedom enough for "good choices" to be made. Ron Paul wants the american people to be economically "free" enough to make "truly" informed decisions.

Lets work together toward a perfect world.

"What's so hard to grasp?"

I could ask you the same thing. What is one of the most disturbing things about the dystopias you mention or the ones to come? Infringements on the right to bodily sovereignty (forced organ "donation," forced medication, implanted chips, prohibition of certain treatment modalities, forced abortion, forced sterilization, prohibition of sexual expression) Do you deny that it may be a good idea to subject Paul to the same kind of rigorous scrutiny in this area as all others and determine whether he is really, truly the champion of liberty you suppose he is? And be honest and critical if he falls short (which he certainly does)?

There are segments of our population who have already lived with horrific, dystopian abridgments of their human rights -- including women subjected to forced pregnancy, gays subjected to forced psychiatric treatment, and people of color subjected to forced sterilization. I'm extremely skeptical of anyone who is not concerned about the very real possibility that we could back slide into PRECEDENTED dystopias -- at LEAST as concerned as they are about ones to come.

The choice is NOT between Paul and Hillary -- that's quite the obnoxious straw man argument, in fact.

This is my rationale...

The thing(s) that I see as most important right now is stopping the globalists and bringing the 9/11 perps to justice. Decentralization of power.

The desired outcomes of those actions would be increased personal liberty and a return to the rule of law. If we don't create a new decentralized power structure, I don't see us as having any chance at self-governance with regard to ANY other issues, not just abortion. We will no longer have the right to choose in pregnancy matters, in economic matters, environmental matters, international relations, war... If we don't regain control of the power structure, any arguments about abortion are moot. Have I been clear enough?
"Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without." - Buddha
"What you do will be insignificant, but it is very important that you do it." - Gandhi
"The Sun never shined on a cause of greater worth." - Thomas Paine

Thank You Casseia!!!!! Damn,

Thank You Casseia!!!!!
Damn, this guy doesn't have a chance in hell of getting elected anyway.
I don't know about you, but I don't need some OLD ASS dude telling me how to live like it's fucking 1950..Thank you very much.

And he voted to put a wall up on the Mexican border...ok..doesn't that tell you something.

Get a grip on reality for christ's sake!!!!

Please don't

spread disinformation. Ron Paul delivered many babies in his career. I would question any ob who was okay w/abortion, even though I personally support the woman's right to choose. But just to be clear on this, Ron Paul feels there should be NO federal law regarding this and it should be left for the states to decide. That way over time people can migratate toward like-minded people--if they so choose--w/out having to leave the country. He doesn't like the idea, and neither did the founders, of a strong central govt that passes a lot of laws for the entire country. He would NOT "love" to take away a woman's right to choose.... If you knew anything about the man you would know that he's probably the last person in the world to support anything that infringes on another's personal liberty. I'm not telling anyone to support Ron Paul. I think there are good candidates on both sides: Kucinich, Gravel and Paul are probably it though. But anyone here who thinks that 9/11 is the first and last real bad thing the govt has done to us is only fooling themselves. The 08 election is going to be huge for 9/11 Truth among many other things. If Hillary, Obama, or any Republican other than Ron Paul wins, 9/11 will become the next JFK--debated for years with no resolution. Campaign advisors like Karl Rove love dividing up the population with issues like that. Thats how a good country like this one can end up with such a talentless criminal like GWB in the WH.

Ummm, yeah....i think this

Ummm, yeah....i think this speaks for itself..... he is hard core pro-life.

And let me reiterate....he voted to put a wall up on the mexico border.

I just don't see the fascination with this guy. And no, I would never vote for Hillary.

"The right of an innocent, unborn child to life is at the heart of the American ideals of liberty. My professional and legislative record demonstrates my strong commitment to this pro-life principle.

In 40 years of medical practice, I never once considered performing an abortion, nor did I ever find abortion necessary to save the life of a pregnant woman.

In Congress, I have authored legislation that seeks to define life as beginning at conception, HR 1094.

I am also the prime sponsor of HR 300, which would negate the effect of Roe v Wade by removing the ability of federal courts to interfere with state legislation to protect life. This is a practical, direct approach to ending federal court tyranny which threatens our constitutional republic and has caused the deaths of 45 million of the unborn.

I have also authored HR 1095, which prevents federal funds to be used for so-called “population control.”

Many talk about being pro-life. I have taken direct action to restore protection for the unborn. "

And someone please tell me

And someone please tell me what he thinks about 911, because judging from his webpage he seems to think "911 terrorists" with expired visas pulled it off.

"The talk must stop. We must secure our borders now. A nation without secure borders is no nation at all. It makes no sense to fight terrorists abroad when our own front door is left unlocked.

Physically secure our borders and coastlines. We must do whatever it takes to control entry into our country before we undertake complicated immigration reform proposals.
Enforce visa rules. Immigration officials must track visa holders and deport anyone who overstays their visa or otherwise violates U.S. law. This is especially important when we recall that a number of 9/11 terrorists had expired visas."

I hear

you but Ron Paul just wants to leave it up to the states. The constitution does not authorize congress or the president to collect taxes to subsidize abortions. That responsibility should not lie with the american people as a whole but solely with the individuals involved.

"I am also the prime sponsor of HR 300, which would negate the effect of Roe v Wade by removing the ability of federal courts to interfere with state legislation to protect life."

After the 2nd debate when he was on Hannity and Colmes, he stated what he's always said: that the federal govt should stay out of it and let individual states choose for themselves.

Having a different opinion on such matters isn't threatening until the federal govt decides to pass a law one way or the other. They should just stay out of it. People have more control over their state govts than we'll ever have over the federal govt.

With 9/11, Ron Paul admits that he doesn't know much of the details regarding alternative theories, and he's said that they may be trying to cover up embarrassing failures more than anything. But he's also said that he remembers the FBI agenst coming out publicly months before 9/11 saying that they felt their investigations were being stopped by someone higher up. He's consistently said that he would support a new investigation, but said that it probably wouldn't do much good until the current admin is out of the WH

You do know about the NAU, right?

North American Union...

There just happens to be a little plan in motion right now for "one world government", and the flood of immigrants into the US is designed to dissolve national sovereignty. Maybe, just maybe this is why RP is concerned with border security??? I'm a Canadian, and I don't want some fucking North American Union. I love multiculturalism. But that's not what this immigration thing is really about. It's about turning North America into one "country" like the EU is becoming.
"Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without." - Buddha
"What you do will be insignificant, but it is very important that you do it." - Gandhi
"The Sun never shined on a cause of greater worth." - Thomas Paine

I sincerely urge everyone to listen to Alex Jones live daily on

the web (or on shortwave radio too). Alex covers 9/11 truth & NWO like no one else!

Scroll down & choose links on his page here:

Amy Goodman?

What is with Amy Goodman. She was there when WTC came down and still would not make a comment? What a bitch. At least Michael Moore was willing to talk about a new investigation. I don't think he is such a bad guy. I saw his first 9/11 flick before I even knew 9/11 was an inside job. I had no idea Bush stayed at Brooker after being told the second tower was hit. That is when I started asking questions and browsing the net for answers. Soon after I came across "In Plain Site" and woke-up instantly. As far as a 757 hitting the Pentagon you got to be kidding. There is no way a 757 could have hit the Pentagon. You would have seen the videos a million times if it did. Something hit the Pentagon but you can bet your sweet ass it wasn't a 757. I would bet my life on it. A bird couldn't shit on that building without being shot down. The whole "Official Story" is a sick joke. I am getting fed-up with all the lies and bullshit. I also blame the MSM for helping with the cover-up. Joe six-pack better get off his lazy ass and start fighting back like we do. I don't know one single person who still believes the official story. Moore also should forget this left vs. right crap. We are all in this together. Hell, I even registered Republican just so I could vote for Ron Paul in the primaries. If he don't run I don't vote. Sorry for rambling but I am sick of all the lies and bullshit. I have had enough. I want my country back!

Please submit this story to



Daily Kos:

And then please let us know where we can vote for your posts.

This is a very important story. I invite you to spread it far and wide.

Buzz It...

while you can. - (Deleted by Buzzflash)

I expect they will delete this post at, but I will repost until they either leave it up or delete my account.

1st Repost - (Deleted by Buzzflash)

2nd Repost<---Buzz here (while you can).

Don't know what to make of it

I never want to look a gift horse in the mouth. This guy does have a fair amount of media clout and a large following of fans, which means that 9/11 skepticism will be given a new blast of air and a platform to be discussed openly. That is good.

However, I am very skeptical of this sudden turn from this guy. Number one, he is extremely polarizing. Half of the country finds him repugnant and will instantly reject anything he espouses. By him going forward on this subject, the spin machine media can pitch 9/11 truth as a "left-wing" issue, especially when combined with Rosie. (...No coincidence that these two personalities are the most visible and vocal anti-2nd amendment celebs around...) I personally think that the 9/11 orchestrators are okay with modest numbers of "the left" believing it was an inside job, but they must absolutely at all costs prevent average joe conservative or establishment ("non-fringe") liberal from coming to that conclusion. The easiest way to do that is to have comical figureheads lead the charge ... total goof-offs.... that "the right" will find repulsive, and that "the mainstream center left" find embarressing to have in their ranks, so that the end around is that 75 % of the politically engaged population will never even entertain the notion or will do everything possible to distance themselves from and purge their party of.

The other reason I find this very suspicious is that Moore had the opportunity and a receptive audience to expose much of this stuff with F911 .... and instead opted to enforce the notion that it happened because Bush is dumb and takes too many vacations. He basically gave the U.S. government a free pass, overlooked the hardcore evidence, and made it seem as though this occured because Americans voted for a stammering imbecile instead of for Gore.

You factor that in with his stock portfolios (big oil, weapons makers, support contractors like Halliburton) - this guy is cut from the same cloth, and is just the errand boy/court jester who gets to run interference and smokescreens for them while they make their big getaway.

The least powerful stuff is the Pentagon speculations. No wonder he is making that the thrust of his arguments. Add it all up. I smell a rat.

I think that's a pretty good assessment.

Moore should be held at arm's length. His response here does seem a bit "conspiratorial" and controlled to me. Let's not expect too much from him. Let's assume that we are going to do this all by ourselves.

If he does push forward a little more, it could mean a huge influx of people from the "left". This alone could push us over "critical mass". But it could also slam the doors shut on many from the "right". I say don't worry about what MM is doing. Goodman is a complete write-off at this point. So is Palast, and Chomsky, almost definitely. They will soon be infamous.

"Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without." - Buddha
"What you do will be insignificant, but it is very important that you do it." - Gandhi
"The Sun never shined on a cause of greater worth." - Thomas Paine

Great work! Less accusatory

Great work! Less accusatory than the standard confrontations.
Amy Goodman was a bit of a bitch.

Still for me, the best confrontation is of the female student who simply asks Giuliani who told him the towers were gonna collapse. No explicit accusation, it was barely implicit in the question. It was brilliantly done. It's her example you should all follow.


"To know a thing well, know its limits. Only when pushed beyond its tolerances will its true nature be seen."
-The Amtal Rule, DUNE


Thank You for posting the film. Fabulous. Informative. Poignant.

it's what I

it's what I do.

///////////////////// - $1 DVDs shipped - email for info

Yeah thanks DHS. It's a

Yeah thanks DHS. It's a powerful piece of work. Probably his best documentary.

The Eleventh Day of Every Month

One word:


If Moore wanted to expose the fraud that was 9/11, I believe he would have tackled this long ago. Also, there are a number of strange things he says, such as "in my own way". That reminds me of what Kucinich said about a "limited investigation". I think we're being fed crumbs to stave us off for a little while longer. I don't trust Michael Moore anymore than I trust Greg Palast, who openly called Steve Jones a "fruitcake". Moore also said that discussing the NORAD standdown was "unamerican", and I don't think he meant it "tongue in cheek".
When it comes to gatekeepers or "controlled opposition" like Michael Moore, Amy Goodman, and Jon Stewart, I think we need to be extraordinarily cautious with them because they in reality ARE wolves in sheep's clothing...or might as well be. They are only pretending to be our allies when in fact they are working for the other side. My gut tells me this along with all the available clues.
So for all those who insist on giving Moore the "benefit of the doubt", your naivity scares the daylights out of me.
Either way, the same conclusion holds true: at some point in our movement's "career", we are going to have to hit the streets. Final Cut may very well become the day of reckoning and we absolutely have to prepare for a showdown. Ultimatley Michael Moore is irrelevant to our cause, other than as a smokescreen and a distraction. Do not fall for it. Chris and Consciousness are absolutely correct and are most astute at spotting phonies. These 2 gentlemen are generally Spot-on with everything. Keep it up, you guys are invaluable leaders for our movement.

"I think we're being fed

"I think we're being fed crumbs to stave us off for a little while longer."

i tend to agree with that, especially in the case of kucinich. i think i give Stewart more of a pass than most people in the movement though because i refuse to play into the "liberal hero" thing about that guy(and for the record, so does HE, he always stresses how he shouldnt be the guy that people look to for news). i take him for what he is, a comedian. just because others put him on some pedestal because our real media is so pathetic doesnt mean we should play into that by expecting a guy who makes dick and political jokes every night to be the torch bearer for 9/11 truth. as far as Moore goes, i think hes a smart business man(thats not a compliment and explains much of his silence) and though he has done some good work before we should continue to press him hard on his 5 year silence on the issue. i gotta say though, considering that most people around here dont seem to like me very much and sometimes vote me down just on principle, calling me an invaluable leader is pretty shocking,haha. thanks a lot though man, and im guessing that Consciousness probably agrees with me here, but none of us are leaders in this movement. but seriously, thanks for the compliment, thats rare around here, at least for me,haha.

"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Former Director, CIA

Moore Is Part Of The 9/11 Coverup

Moore is a Mossad false opposition put in place to attack America's traditional values and soften us up for the NWO takeover. Moore is working for a foreign government!

Take a close look at who his associates are. Michael Moore's agent is Ariel Emanuel, the brother of Rahm Emanuel. Rahm Emanuel is the top powerbroker in the Democratic Party which is 100% complicit in the 9/11 coverup since day one. Do you think this like between Moore and Emanuel is just coincidence theory?

I'm with you on this...

I do disagree with you sometimes, Chris, but I think you tend to be on the ball.


And TruthNow...
Thanks, very flattering comments. Chris is right though, each and every one of us needs to be a leader. I'm just thankful to be "awake" and have a shot at saving my own ass from the NWO! I'd like to be doing a lot more, but I've been getting sucked into cyber-space lately.

"Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without." - Buddha
"What you do will be insignificant, but it is very important that you do it." - Gandhi
"The Sun never shined on a cause of greater worth." - Thomas Paine

yep, including on this

yep, including on this thread,haha(casseia is right, abortion is not a "pet issue". hell, i dont even like to talk about it, it should be a personal issue, but it is important no matter how you feel about it.) we all want the same thing here though, despite our differences.

"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Former Director, CIA

Yeah, I'm "pro-choice"...

I just think we have over-arching political concerns right now, and it would be foolish to be making decisions based on that issue at this moment in history. It's important, but let's not give it a disproportionate amount of weight given the current political developments.
"Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without." - Buddha
"What you do will be insignificant, but it is very important that you do it." - Gandhi
"The Sun never shined on a cause of greater worth." - Thomas Paine

im not, and i dont think

im not, and i dont think casseia is either, she told me she was actually supporting Paul right now as am i. i consider myself a liberal-libertarian so its not like im in line with all of or even most of Paul's stances but that isnt gonna stop me from supporting the best candidate. that doesnt mean we shouldnt call him out when hes wrong or when hes not forceful enough on 9/11 though.

"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Former Director, CIA

"he always stresses how he

"he always stresses how he shouldnt be the guy that people look to for news"

No he doesn't. He mentions it in passing and then proceeds to allow himself to be "the guy that others look to for news". In other words, he's windowdressing for himself to appear humble and hospitible. I think he's secretly very happy with his position, otherwise he'd seek out a different avenue or flat out quit. I don't trust Jon Stewart. Especially since he interviewed 9/11 Commissioner Thomas Kean.

You guys are very welcome. And when I say "leader"...I mean it in an inspirational sense...not the literal sense. I'm of the belief also that we ALL lead and having actual "leaders" would only sabotage our efforts. And just because I consider you guys invaluable doesn't necessarily have to mean that I agree with you 100% of the time. 99.99% is quite enough! ;-)

yes, he actually does,

yes, he actually does, pretty regularly too. do i really need to go dig up some clips for you? look, my point about Stewart is that he is a COMEDIAN and the very fact that people like you are expecting him to be some sort of torch bearer just highlights how pathetic our media is now. Jon Stewart has said the same exact thing almost, that the fact that people look to him for news is depressing to him. why do you think people like Kean and other scumbag politicians go on there? its not meant to be a hardball interview, its a show on COMEDY CENTRAL and even if you dont get that, the people that come on his show most certaintly do. just because some people put Stewart on a pedestal and pretend that hes a real newsman doesnt mean we should. i dont play into that shit. hes no hero to me, hes simply a comedian, not a newsman. he doesnt "allow himself" to be that, our fucked up society and pathetic media does. dont blame the court jester, such a waste of time and energy in my opinion.

"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Former Director, CIA

I'm not so sure

As a comedian he's not obligated to be a "torch-bearer". But what about as a human being with a voice? If you had the fame and prestige that Jon Stewart had, and you KNEW that 9/11 was orchestrated and carried out by OWN OUR GOVERNMENT AGAINST OUR OWN PEOPLE, would you let the label "comedian" stop you from shouting it from your rooftop? Or...from your own national TV show? I sure as hell wouldn't. But I guess it really does come down to personal character.

And assuming your logic is right...I STILL think that Stewart is derelict in his duty as an American citizen, as is Bill Maher who takes it a step further by insulting our movement. Personally I think you're making excuses for someone who has an obligation to tell things as they are....which he sometimes does. Unfortunately they tend to not be about the most consequential issues.
And another thing...what about the times when he DOES call out politicians on things they've done wrong? It's ok for him to "pick and choose" what battles he fights I long as he gets to keep his job until Martial Law is declared. I guess my sense of urgency doesn't register to some others. I hope I'm wrong. I usually agree with everything you say Chris, but this is one example of where I think you're dead-wrong.

im not making excuses for

im not making excuses for him as a human being, im just saying its weird how some people hold him up to the same standards as the REAL media. i never understood that and have always found it counter-productive because while we wait on so called "liberal heroes" like Stewart to spout some truth we take our eye off of the real media. your asking the man to bring up the murder and cover-up of 3000 people in the context of a comedy show and im saying thats not very realistic. thats all. i dont think Stewart is anything but a comedian while some people try and pass him off as some kind of media maverick. hes only a media maverick because our media is so goddamn pathetic. thats the point. yes, Stewart is just like everyone else who stays silent on 9/11, its wrong and its shameful in my opinion but you are holding this guy up to the SAME standard as people who consider themselves journalists, investigative reporters etc. im not making excuses for him, hes wrong, but i certaintly dont expect as much from him as you seem to. its unrealistic. again, Stewart is wrong and even cowardly(he seems like a smart guy, he should be aware of 9/11 truth by now) but i think holding him up to the same standard as the real media is a mistake and gives them a pass. we should expect the truth from our media, not just from a show on Comedy Central. and that certaintly shouldnt be the first place we look to for the truth. dont play into that. Stewart does satire. lets attack G.E.,Time Warner, Redstone, Murdoch etc., the people that own the Stewarts and Courics of the world. thats who im really angry at.

"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Former Director, CIA

I agree with you on this.

I think he has a responsibility as a human being in the public eye.

Stewart and Colbert might be gatekeepers though. They make light of EXTREMELY serious and humorless issues, and lull the liberals into an apathetic state of mind. They're funny as hell, but I think they do have an obligation to act if they know the truth.
"Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without." - Buddha
"What you do will be insignificant, but it is very important that you do it." - Gandhi
"The Sun never shined on a cause of greater worth." - Thomas Paine

Why do you neglect Nader?

Although he has not addressed the 9/11 coverup, I am surprised how everyone who wants to distance themselves from the Dems or the Republicans does not think about Nader. He is a scientist first and formost, and I doubt that he is owned. If he waited until after Loose Change Final Cut to declare that he wants an independent inquiry, why wouldn't he receive legitimacy and support? I would support Nader over Paul any day of the week.
Just my two cents. Please set me straight if you know of blatent coverup on Nader's part.


why does Nader neglect

why does Nader neglect us?(9/11 truth)

"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Former Director, CIA

though for the record i do

though for the record i do agree with more of Nader's politics than i do Paul's

"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Former Director, CIA



"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Former Director, CIA


I agree. Where's Nader ? Gore Vidal spoke. Sort of. Lampham is pretending to be reading. Was sorry to hear about Gwyn Dyer's (sp) lack of integrity. Chomsky's gone.
Nader's devoted his life to public service. Get Nader on side !
He seemed to know, long before most, that the two party system in the US wasn't working and was a joke.
{As Kurt Vonnegut pointed out - 'An election between two members of Skull and Bones, what happened to democracy ?'}
Paul doesn't have a chance until he moves more to the center, or actually says something, despite the efforts of the many shills he seems to have converted in the 9-11 Movement.

Moore also can't vote for

Moore also can't vote for Ron Paul because he's for privatized health care according to Paul's comments.

MM is cool. Sicko (download)

MM is cool.

Sicko (download) is utter common-sense, and NOTHING ELSE. It shows the health system of countries by way of typical examples.

It only SOUNDS controversial in the MIND of deprived people. Slaves cannot imagine freedom, I am sorry to say.

"socialised medicine" is

  • cheapest -- (because the weight of people's sickness is carried by the broadest amount of shoulders, i.e. less weight for each)
  • best -- (because doctors working for "society" have much better work-ethic than doctors working for profit.! "society-valued-doctors" have Audis and comfortable homes, too)

The US of amnesia is THE MOST socialised country in the world. The amount of VALUE/EFFORT/RAW MATERIALS that is pumped into NATIONAL DEFENSE surpasses ALL REASON.

This is not a contradiction. Ability to kill is what is important for USA-ians. They value violence and "defence" (actually "offence") many magnitude higher that the welfare of people. Compassion is limited to "compassion for the status quo".

Common-sense... instinctively we all know it. Many indoctrinated souls cannot reconcile their common-sense with the brutal world they witness. They blame their common-sense since the brutal world seems beyond remedy.

When Moore shows us the health-care systems in France and England (free home-care, free hospitals) .. he shows us reality. In a slave-metality society (USA) this is nothing short of revolutionary.

This film is the MOST SUBVERSIVE film ever.

Michael Moore knows it ;-)

He is much smarter that you take him for.

However, without help, he hasn't got a hope in hell to "expose 911", and he knows it.

Yet however.. he has already received lots of help... yes, from the truther-hippies on this BBS for example. We are all little children . we do not know WHAT REALLY HAPPENED, yet we squabble amongst ourselves... just like children do.

We are not humble.

Whereas, with our VERY limited knowledge, we ought to be.

HOWEVER.... I am CERTAIN that 9/11 is "already" out. It is unstoppable. If we woudl only RELAX and LAUGH about our "government":... and take to the streets in humourous demonstrations. We should make light for the many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many people who are simply intimidated, coerced, frightened ... I urge you to take to heart what TONY BENN said in SiCKO.
(you know, the old geezer from London, an "old labour" socialist.)

I thank you for reading this. I love you for your patience.

Lets spoil it by asking you to review the TV-Fakery evidence again.
(Nose-out and NoPlane explosion as seen on VERIFIED TV transmission.... and tell-tale FADE-TO-BLACK and Audio-evidence of missile-scream)

I, for my part, cannot get myself to ingore this evidence. How about yous? Are you willing to ignore it "for the benefit of a united 911-truth-movement" ??

I have a hard time doing that.

I tell you why.

My secret hope (yes, wishful thinking) is that when TV-fakery is admitted then the world of TELEVISION with "grow up" and we will have understood the power of TV propaganda. Our society will "come of age" and use TV for good causes. I mean the many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many people who spend lots of time watching TV. They are ENTITLED to a "TV that is accountable" .. I personally know many TV victims...

If you think my wishful thinking makes me more gullible for TV-fakery, you are wrong.

I happen to insist that "September Clues" is hard to refute and I would like a honest upfront debate.

over and out

I have been posting on Kos

I have been posting on Kos (2 messages) that have been removed yet the nasty ones remain. I just posted again asking why questioning posts are removed. Who is this character Terry Pinder? Is he deleting my messages. Is he typical of a kos friend.

I posted this link:

to show the pentagon right afterwards when it was whole and before the explosion took down the roof. Pinder is a major coward.

The Government

9/11 workers from Michael Moore film fear political attack
New York, June 23 (AP): Three Sept. 11 workers who accompanied
filmmaker Michael Moore on a trip to Cuba for medical treatment, and
were featured in his new movie ``Sicko,'' claimed on Friday they are
being targeted by the government for participating in the project.

``It's ridiculous after what we did for the city and the country on
that day, that they won't allow us to go 90 miles offshore to get
treated,'' said Reggie Cervantes, a 46-year-old EMT who worked with
only a thin dust mask after the World Trade Center collapsed on Sept.
11, 2001.

The Brooklyn-based worker, among the first responders performing
triage on the street below the burning towers, now suffers from
severe pulmonary diseases, as well as kidney and liver problems.

Moore and the ailing 9/11 workers went to Cuba for treatment in March
despite a U.S. trade embargo restricting travel to the Communist
country. The U.S. Treasury Department's Office of Foreign Assets
Control sent Moore a letter in May notifying the filmmaker that he
was under investigation for travel violations.

Although the three workers have not received similar letters, all
said they were expecting them. Cervantes was joined by another EMT,
John Graham, 45, and a 9/11 volunteer, William Maher, 54, along with
their lawyer, noted constitutional free speech attorney Martin

Garbus said any investigation of the three was politically motivated,
a charge made 11 days ago by Moore's attorney, David Boies. In a
letter to the Treasury Department, Boies noted that Moore is well
known as a harsh critic of the Bush administration _ particularly in
his Sept. 11 movie ``Fahrenheit 9/11.''

Moore had asked the Treasury Department last fall to approve his Cuba
trip under rules permitting travel there by journalists. Moore made
the trip after receiving no response.

All three workers said they were denied treatment for various
conditions by U.S. insurance companies that refused to pay for
coverage. Each received treatment in Cuba.

Graham suffers from esophageal burns, an enlarged heart and post-
traumatic stress disorder. He said he has repeatedly been denied
medical coverage and is still battling for Social Security disability

Cervantes, who now lives in Oklahoma, said workers' compensation and
Social Security do not cover the medical tests she needs, and she now
owes $17,000 (euro12,647) for treatment and emergency room visits in
the United States. She has no regrets about her Cuban excursion,
where she said she saw nine specialists.

``I would have gone to the moon,'' she said. ``We need treatment.''

The three were not paid for their appearances in Moore's film.

Letter to CNN

Dear CNN, Michael Moore, and everyone else:
I found Dr Guptas report useless and I listened with an open mind. He said nothing useful except that Michael Moore rounded up a number to 7,000. Way to go doctor! You found a mistake! I am offended that he suggested Michael Moore was unfairly leading the American public to believe things that are untrue and feeding us falsehoods. I am not a person niave and stupid enough to believe whatever is fed to me. I research what is made available to me. Michael Moore represents so many Americans and he can speak for me anytime. A doctor (who practices in America) to argue government run health care? How stupid do you think Americans are? Highly overpaid doctors should not represent most of America, as you are far from the majority. I am 40, a divorced mother of one, and I have no health care. However, I do not want it. I will choose, instead, to get free government health care and hope that it will soon be the standard here in America. We Americans have paid for far too many fat salaries, coverage we cannot use, and overpriced prescriptions which all contribute to the wealthy getting wealthier, while the working class American must lose a loved one so that insurance execs can purchase another yacht, get another costly divorce, or reserve the hottest new sports car to feed their shallow souls. I work in the non-profit industry and I know professionals in the health care industry who are not afraid to speak up. I will be starting a letter-writing campaign to request that CNN offer the truth about our health care system in this country. Please include the government officials who enjoy the perks thrown to them by those all-too-important lobbys in Washington. Why DON'T you try to pick Moore's movie apart, piece by bloody piece? Don't skim over it briefly with no information like your doctor did. Really try to prove him wrong! Why won't you? And for heaven's sake, get a conscience and apologize to a man who, like Al Gore, is just trying to raise awareness for a very important issue. Why can't we ever seem to expose the fat, greedy, wealthy people scooping up all the pennies in this country? Does money really matter that much to that many selfish people that you'd rather all Americans remain clueless and quiet? Don't complicate things, simplify. What is the worst that could happen? You'd lose an advertiser or two? Maybe you'd even get a call from Bush! Don't worry, he's the dumbest American and I am quite sure HE is willing to accept any hot air you blow in his direction.

Sharon Jenson
40 & uninsured