Senator Bob Graham: Keys to the Kingdom

FORMER SENATOR JOHN BILLINGTON KNEW WRITING THIS NEW YORK TIMES OP-ED PIECE MIGHT GET HIM KILLED . . .

July 6th
The congressional inquiry into the 9/11 attacks left several secrets unanswered. The top three are Saudi Arabia's full role in thepreparation for and the execution of the plot; the Kingdom's willingness and capacity to collaborate in future terrorist actions against the United States; and why this and the prior administration conducted a cover-up that thus far has frustrated finding the answers to the first two questions.

Now, there is an even more ominous unknown. Does Saudi Arabia have the bomb? . . . The United States should take prompt action to prevent this potential conflict from becoming a reality.

Shortly after this appears in print, his suspicion comes true: Senator Billington, a co-chair of the 9/11 Congressional Inquiry Commission, is murdered near his Florida home. Sensing the danger he faced before he was murdered, Billington left ex-Special Forces operative Tony Ramos detailed instructions for an investigation into Saudi complicity in the 9/11 terrorist attacks.

Now Ramos, in conjunction with Billington's daughter Laura, must uncover a shocking international conspiracy linking Saudi Arabia -- the Kingdom -- to Osama bin Laden and al-Qaeda, in a race against time that will span Saudi Arabia, India, Pakistan, and Afghanistan.

But will Ramos and his team be able to stop al-Qaeda from unleashing nuclear disaster on American shores and beyond?

Destined to be a titan amongst thrillers, Keys to the Kingdom is infused with inside information and insight into the world of terrorism that only Senator Bob Graham -- as former Chairman of the Senate's Select Committee on Intelligence -- can offer.
http://www.amazon.com/Keys-Kingdom-Bob-Graham/dp/159315660X/

 

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Bob Graham: From Senator to Novelist
June 8, 2011

Bob Graham has accomplished a lot in his career. He served as governor, then senator of Florida, and on the 9/11 Congressional Inquiry Commission. Former Sen. Graham can now add “novelist” to his long list of achievements. His new book is called "Keys to the Kingdom: A Novel of Suspense." And while it’s fiction, some of the events and characters in the book bear a striking resemblance to former Graham’s real life.

Former Sen. Bob Graham joins us today in the studio.

http://www.thetakeaway.org/2011/jun/08/bob-graham-senator-novelist/

__________________________

Thank you to Bob Graham for caring enough to help get the truth out about the events of September 11, 2001.

 

Keys to the Kingdom

Senator Graham Comes to Tallahassee For Book Signing
WCTV 9:32 AM Jun 7, 2011

Hundreds of people lined up at a local book store to get the autograph of a former Florida Governor.

Senator Bob Graham was at Books-a-million today (6-6) signing his new book "Keys to The Kingdom".

The book is about what Graham calls the secrets and unanswered questions of the 9-11 attacks.

Graham says his readers will be surprised about some of the book's details.

"Well I think they'll be surprised at the role the Saudi's played in 9-11. I think they'll be even more surprised at the extent to which our government went to cover up the Saudi role," said Graham.
http://www.wctv.tv/home/headlines/Senator_Graham_Comes_to_Tallahassee_For_Book_Signing_123300733.html

_______________________________

Graham was in Tallahassee today, signing copies of his new book "Keys to the Kingdom." It's a fictional political thriller based on his belief that the U.S. government covered up Saudi Arabia's role in terrorism following the 9/11 attacks.

Graham admits he wrote the novel because he was angry the administration of George Bush withheld information about the Saudis' role in 9/11.

"My anger is directed at anyone who has made the decision that the American people should not understand the full extent of Saudi involvement in 911 and with that information take the steps to protect us from a future such action by the Saudis."
http://www.firstcoastnews.com/rss/article/206771/4/Anger-Prompts-Novel-from-Former-US-Sen-Bob-Graham

________________________________

Former Florida Governor and U.S. Senator Bob Graham says most people don’t know the whole story behind 9/11.

On Monday, Graham embarked on a book tour to promote his new novel “Keys to the Kingdom.” The book is about Saudi Arabia’s involvement in the September 11th attacks. Graham had to get clearance from the CIA to release his book, which he spent five years writing. Graham says the book merges fact and fiction.

“It’s fiction, but I would say that 35 to 40 percent of it is pure fact except I changed the names of living people. Another 20 percent is based on fact that is exaggerated and the rest of it is fiction,” said Graham.

Graham chaired the Senate Intelligence Committee during the 9/11 attacks and opposed the U.S. invasion of Iraq.
http://www.wptv.com/dpp/news/state/former-senator-promotes-book-about-9_11

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The "Saudi role" is limited*

and thus is being pushed as part of one or more limited hangouts, imo*.

*Limited, but over many decades (the full extent still to be determined, of course).

I recommend looking a bit west to get closer to finding the lead perps of this crime.

Thanks for the update!

(* added for clarity, this is just my informed opinion)

Saudi Arabia

Saudi Arabia is the head of the snake when it comes to producing Muslim extremists. Wahhabism is the rule of Saudi Arabia and it is the ideology that these people are brainwashed with. Saudi Arabia promotes and finaces Wahhabism around the world through Madrasses, Mosques, and Islamic studies departments in Universities such as Harvard, Princeton, MIT, etc...

Have you ever seen those little kids bobbing back and forth in Madrasses? Those are the children that will grow up wanting to kill you ;)

The Saudi Role is not a limited hang out, it is a big part of the problem!

In case you didn't know, most of the 9/11 hijackers were Saudi's and they were supported and financed by Saudi's which enabled them to carry out the attacks. It is obvious these attacks could not have happened without the help of people within the U.S. power structure, but that doesn't mean Saudi's didn't play a key role in the events of September 11, 2001.

I know some people can't come to grips with the fact that there is more to the story than Bush and Cheney conjuring up this evil plan and implimenting it on thier own, but thast just not true!

If you want to point fingers at the Bush administration as being the sole culprits of the crime, you can't do it with 9/11. You should be looking into the lies that led to the fraudulent war in Iraq ;)

Bob Graham is one of the very few people trying to help the public understand what is going on. He spent 5 years writing this book of fiction ( a very ingenius way to get around the classification problem) to try and get us closer to the truth and I thank him so much for that.

Thanks for posting Jeff!

The Saudi role in international terrorism is important and worth investigating.

"America is buying billions of dollars of oil from nations who are sponsors of, or allied with, radical Islamists who foment hatred against the United States. The dollars we provide such nations contribute materially to the terrorist threats facing America... In the War on Terror, the United States is sponsoring both sides. While spending billions of dollars on US military efforts in the war, we are sending billions more to nations such as Saudi Arabia... where the cash is used to finance training centers for terrorists, pay bounties to the families of suicide bombers, and fund the purchase of weapons and explosives. Oil revenues in these countries underwrite new media outlets that propagandize hatefully against the United States. They pay for more than 10,000 radical madrassahs set up around the world to indoctrinate young boys with the idea that the way to paradise is through murderous terror... Men energized by oil-revenue resources killed 3,000 American civilians on September 11th, 2001, and continue to kill large numbers of Westerners in Iraq and elsewhere... America is hamstrung because any forceful action on our part... could result in the disruption of oil supplies that the world economy depends on. We cannot stand up to those who support our enemies because we rely on those supporters for the fuel that is our lifeblood"

US Navy Commander Thomas D. Kraemer, from 'Addicted to Oil: Strategic Implications of American Oil Policy. May 2006.
http://www.strategicstudiesinstitute.army.mil/pdffiles/pub705.pdf

Hey Gareth

Hey Gareth, thanks for the info!

More on Bob Graham Book 9/11 Blogger Would not Publish as News

Why are you helping Bush with his cover up?

LeftWright said..."The "Saudi role" is limited* and thus is being pushed as part of one or more limited hangouts."

pushed by who Bob Graham? Is he "in on it" too? The "Saudi role" isn't limited it's central and is already a proven cover up that you refuse to expose....this is called a cover up....

The CIA were working more with the Saudi Intelligence than the FBI....

"However, the C.I.A. did share the information with Saudi authorities, who told the agency that Mihdhar and a man named Nawaf al-Hazmi were members of Al Qaeda. Based on this intelligence, the C.I.A. broke into a hotel room in Dubai where Mihdhar was staying, en route to Malaysia. The operatives photocopied Mihdhar’s passport and faxed it to Alec Station, the C.I.A. unit devoted to tracking bin Laden. Inside the passport was the critical information that Mihdhar had a U.S. visa."
http://www.lawrencewright.com/WrightSoufan.pdf

"The agency frequently decided not to share intelligence with the F.B.I. on the ground that it would compromise “sensitive sources and methods.” For example, the C.I.A. collected other crucial information
about Mihdhar that it did not provide to the F.B.I. Mihdhar, it turned out, was the son-in-law of Ahmed al-Hada, the Al Qaeda loyalist in Yemen whose phone number operated as the network’s switchboard."
http://www.lawrencewright.com/WrightSoufan.pdf

This is American Intelligence and Saudi Intelligence working together.....

"The C.I.A. did not pass this intelligence to the F.B.I."
"However, the C.I.A. did share the information with Saudi authorities, who told the agency that Mihdhar and a man named Nawaf al-Hazmi were members of Al Qaeda.
http://www.lawrencewright.com/WrightSoufan.pdf

Saudi Intelligence agents were helping the hijackers.....and being paid by Bush's buddy Bandar....

FBI report:.
"The exact nature of Bayoumi's employment has remained unclear, but his close associates suspected him of being a Saudi intelligence officer." (FBI Document)
http://intelfiles.egoplex.com/2002-04-15-FBI-LHM-omar-al-bayoumi2.pdf

"2. Al-Bayoumi has been determined to have co-signed for hijackers Nawaf Al-Hazmi and Khalid Al-Mihdhar when they rented an apartment at the Parkwood Apartments complex and to have sometimes paid rent for them." page 1/8
http://intelfiles.egoplex.com/2001-10-03-FBI-penttbomb-bayoumi.pdf

Bandar admits they were tracking the hijackers...no shit, and helping them too!.....

"Speaking to the Arabic satellite network Al-Arabiya on Thursday, Bandar -- now Abdullah's national security adviser -- said Saudi intelligence was "actively following" most of the September 11, 2001, plotters "with precision."

"If U.S. security authorities had engaged their Saudi counterparts in a serious and credible manner, in my opinion, we would have avoided what happened," he said.
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/11/01/saudiarabia.terrorism/index.html

Here is a 31 page FBI report showing OMAR AL BAYOUMI to be an agent of Saudi Arabian Intelligence who assisted several of the 9-11 hijackers, and introduced them to the informant...

http://intelfiles.egoplex.com/2002-04-15-FBI-LHM-omar-al-bayoumi2.pdf

Who was this informant working for and why did he want immunity? And why was he rewarded for not cooperating with the 9-11 investigation? You say it's a limited hang out, I say you are helping the Bush administratioon cover up their crimes.....

"Hijackers Lived With FBI Informant"
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/09/09/attack/main521223.shtml

"Since September 11, the FBI has learned that al-Bayoumi has connections to terrorist elements." (senate/congress joint Inquiry)
http://www.gpoaccess.gov/serialset/creports/pdf/fullreport_errata.pdf

According to Time magazine Prince Bandar supports terrorists, including those assisting the 9-11 hijackers. The joint inquiry also states this but President Bush refused to allow 28 pages of the report which exposes that to be released, because he evidently is a traitor protecting Saudi Arabians.

"A Saudi national, Bassnan was living in San Diego last year and has been linked to Omar al Bayoumi, a Saudi student who befriended two men who wound up helping crash Flight 77 into the Pentagon. The sources also say that the ambassador, Prince Bandar bin Sultan, gave $15,000 to Bassnan."
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1003790,00.html

This is a cover up and proves Bush a traitor - but you call it a limiterd hang out therefor helping Bush with his treason.......

"Congressional Record: October 28, 2003 (Senate)

(a) Findings.--The Senate finds that--
(1) The President has prevented the release to the American
public of 28 pages of the Joint Inquiry into Intelligence
Community Activities Before and After the Terrorist Attacks
of September 2001.
(2) The contents of the redacted pages discuss sources of
foreign support for some of the September 11th hijackers
while they were in the United States."
http://www.fas.org/irp/congress/2003_cr/s102803.html

The hijackers were being helped by Bush's friend who wanted the same thing he did.....for Iraq to be attacked....

"A Saudi national, Bassnan was living in San Diego last year and has been linked to Omar al Bayoumi, a Saudi student who befriended two men who wound up helping crash Flight 77 into the Pentagon. The sources also say that the ambassador, Prince Bandar bin Sultan, gave $15,000 to Bassnan."
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1003790,00.html

"After September 11, the FBI developed information clearly indicating that Bassnan is an extremist and a Bin Ladin supporter. [censured] [censured]"
page 229/858
http://www.gpoaccess.gov/serialset/creports/pdf/fullreport_errata.pdf

"Indyk remembered a different Bandar, one who was a super-hawk when it came to Saddam. "He was always pushing for the United States to bomb Iraq, much more than Paul Wolfowitz." He was referring to the neoconservative scholar and senior Pentagon official who would later press so hard for the U.S. Invasion of Iraq in 2003. "He wanted us to knock off Saddam." Indyk was convinced the prince had a personal grudge to settle with Saddam. When the State Department had taken away his security detail after Clinton came into office, Bandar had protested vociferously, arguing he needed it because Saddam had taken out a contract to have him killed. Also, Saddam had tried to assassinate his favorite U.S. president, George H.W. Bush, while he was visiting Kuwait after leaving office in April 1993. So the prince couldn't wait for the U.S. bombs to fall." page 137
http://www.amazon.com/Kings-Messenger-Americas-Tangled-Relationship/dp/0802716903

"But some CIA officers handling Saudi issues complain that Tenet would not tell them what he had discussed with Bandar, making it difficult for agency officials to know the nature of any deals their boss was arranging with the Saudis." page 188
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0743270665/centerforcoop-20#noop

"Prince Bandar, for example, was extremely close to the first President Bush and the entire Bush family; in his book about the war in Iraq, Plan of Attack, Bob Woodward reported that President Bush alerted Bandar to the timing of the 2003 invasion before he notified Secretary of State Colin Powell." Page 189
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0743270665/centerforcoop-20#noop

"John Lehman thought that he asked some of the tougher questions of Bush during the session, especially about the possibility of Saudi government ties to some of the hijackers. Lehman recalled asking Bush about the news reports that checks for thousands of dollars written by the wife of Prince Bandar, the Saudi ambassador in Washington, might have been funneled to two of the hijackers in San Diego. "He dodged the questions," said Lehman.
page 344
http://www.amazon.com/Commission-Uncensored-History-11-Investigation/dp/0446580759/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=12716328...

"I answered every question they asked" --G Bush after meeting with 9-11 Commission (1:55 mark of following video)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vio68c0h-h4&feature=related

"He dodged the questions," said Lehman. page 344
http://www.amazon.com/Commission-Uncensored-History-11-Investigation/dp/0446580759/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=12716328...

Bush is telling you right here where he doesn't want you to go..where Bob Graham did try and go.....

"A former landlord of two of the September 11 hijackers was an FBI informant at the time, knowledgeable sources confirm to CNN."
http://archives.cnn.com/2002/US/09/11/ar911.hijackers.landlord/

From Senate and Congress Joint Inquiry into attacks of 9/11:

"The Administration has to date objected to the Inquiry’s efforts to interview the informant in order to attempt to resolve those inconsistencies. The Administration also would not agree to allow the FBI to serve a Committee subpoena and deposition notice on the informant. Instead, written interrogatories from the Joint Inquiry were, at the suggestion of the FBI, provided to the informant. Through an attorney, the informant has declined to respond to those interrogatories and has indicated that, if subpoenaed, the informant would request a grant of immunity prior to testifying."
http://www.gpoaccess.gov/serialset/creports/pdf/fullreport_errata.pdf

"footnote 194 - The OIG was not able to interview the asset. The Joint Intelligence Committee Inquiry had attempted to interview the asset without success. The Committee then submitted interrogatories that the asset declined to answer, asserting his Fifth Amendment privilege. The asset indicated through his attorney that if subpoenaed by the Committee, he would not testify without a grant of immunity."
http://www.fas.org/irp/agency/doj/oig/fbi-911/chap5.pdf

"In July 2003, the asset was given a $100,000 payment and closed as an asset." {footnote number 197}
http://www.fas.org/irp/agency/doj/oig/fbi-911/chap5.pdf

The same people who KNEW Saudi involvement in the 9-11 attacks and actually protected them were the very same people who used the attacks to have a war in Iraq and tried to create fake connections between Iraq and al Qaeda. Bush was a traitor and the cover up is easy to expose, and central to 9-11 because the cover up exists because it leads back to the U.S. Government administration, Bob Graham has done more to expose truth about 9-11 than most of the people on this site, this bridge should be reinforced not burned.....

"Graham was in Tallahassee today, signing copies of his new book "Keys to the Kingdom." It's a fictional political thriller based on his belief that the U.S. government covered up Saudi Arabia's role in terrorism following the 9/11 attacks."
"Graham admits he wrote the novel because he was angry the administration of George Bush withheld information about the Saudis' role in 9/11."

"My anger is directed at anyone who has made the decision that the American people should not understand the full extent of Saudi involvement in 911 and with that information take the steps to protect us from a future such action by the Saudis."
http://www.firstcoastnews.com/rss/article/206771/4/Anger-Prompts-Novel-from-Former-US-Sen-Bob-Graham

If Bush is protecting another country while wanting to invade yet another country there is a reason for it, being a traitor is only part of it.

So Leftwright tell us...why are you doing exactly what Bush wanted, and ignoring this cover up instead of helping Bob Graham expose it?

Armstrong took one small

Armstrong took one small step, but you just took one giant leap:

"So Leftwright tell us...why are you doing exactly what Bush wanted, and ignoring this cover up instead of helping Bob Graham expose it?"

What will he expose? Al Qaeda in Saudi Arabia; Al Qaeda in America? - please.

Are you asking me to choose between John and Graham? Because that is stupid.

Talk about a tempest in a tea pot..

Let me clarify a few things, before anyone makes any more wild leaps of logic (or tries to put words in my mouth or intent in my head and heart).

[Also, in the future, when in doubt, Jimd3100, ask questions and wait for an answer BEFORE jumping to conclusions. (Unless, of course, your whole effort is to re-frame something into something it is not)]

My serious research into the Saudi's, and the region in general, began in the mid-1980's with Iran-Contra and has been ongoing ever since (I studied international relations and economics in university and my area of interest was central America, so I came into this through the Contra door, although I wrote three research papers on Israel in Palestine for a model U.N. program I was involved in].

Anyone familiar with BCCI and Iran-Contra knows how long certain Saudi's and Pakistanis have been mixing with western intelligence (esp. the Mossad, from a safe distance, of course). So clearly certain Saudis and Pakistanis are chest deep in the 9/11 false flag operation (has Abu Zubaydah's story been credibly debunked or confirmed yet?).

My research in the mid-1980's looked backward and into the October surprises, the installation of Khomeini in Iran and wherever else the leads went (and many still go, Secord and Singlaub are still running drugs, now it's Afghan heroin, but I digress).

My bottom line here, regarding the Saudi role in 9/11, is that the planning for the 9/11 false flag operation did not BEGIN there, so the search for the perps should not END there. This is the definition of a limited hangout.

This does not mean, however, that the Saudi role should not be FULLY investigated and exposed, as that WILL LEAD to most of the other participants, if all the leads are similarly FULLY investigated and exposed.

As for the created construct that is the "Islamic fundamentalist terrorism" meme, I expect that Sen. Graham sincerely believes what he believes, as do many others who can't extricate themselves from this construct, which is massively reinforced throughout popular culture and "academia" (don't get me started on Lawrence Wright, Steve Coll and the other purveyors of partial truth in this area).

I fully acknowledge this construct and accept that many people have been innocently swept along with it, including, perhaps, Sen. Graham. Thus, he is most likely no more "in on it" than millions of others who have also swallowed this construct hook, line and sinker. After all, that's why many millions (if not billions) of dollars and over two decades were spent creating this narrative (and doing a few other things as well, but that is at least two large books which I have not yet got around to writing).

I hope I've put that bit of absurd and unwarranted conflation to rest now (I'm beginning to think we should start a 9/11 truth track team, we certainly have all the jumpers we need for the jump to conclusions events. Yes, I have just as biting a sense of humor as some of you, I just keep it to myself most of the time, for what should be obvious reasons).

So Jimd3100, by all means, please encourage everyone to FULLY investigate the Saudi role in the 9/11 false flag operation, just don't stop there or let anyone else stop there, as I assure you that is not the end of this road, and is more akin to a five lane freeway of distractions and attempts at misdirection.

As for me, I will return to researching pre-1979, the earliest starting point I have found to date for the actual implementation of the operation that would later known as the 9/11 false flag.

Finally, please just ask for clarification in the future (and stop there), it will save everyone a lot of time and trouble.

Thanks, and be well.

The truth shall set us free, but it has to be the full and complete truth.

Love is the only way forward, and love means assuming the best in people.

???

"As for the created construct that is the "Islamic fundamentalist terrorism" meme"

Can you please explain???

Start by reading Nafeez Moseddeq Ahmed's

and Michel Chossudovsky's works on the subject.

Next, carefully critique the mainstream literature (beginning with Samuel P. Huntington's The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order 1997) which helps to nurture and propagate said meme.

Or. come visit me in northern California and we can share a meal or two and discuss it.

If you have a more specific question, then please ask it, as that one is pretty wide open.

Thanks again for the original post, I believe very strongly in deconstructing the government myth as a good starting point for investigating the 9/11 false flag operation.

Cheers!

In other words are you trying

In other words are you trying to say that there are no muslim extremists aka (AL Qaida)? Did muslim extremists hijack planes on 9/11?

I'll answer the second question.

probably not

and you have been a member

and you have been a member here for 4 years 42 weeks??? geeeeeeez louise!

and following everything since day one

.

DAY ONE- September 11, 2001

.

Sounds like you haven't

Sounds like you haven't learned much.

Shure, For the record: Your attitude sucks

Shure,
You definitely need to improve your attitude, and affinity for people, and tolerance of other viewpoints. It becomes destructive when those characteristics suck.

You asked: "Did muslim extremists hijack planes on 9/11?"
Joe answered: "probably not"
Personally, I agree with Joe's opinion. There is a lot of data which infers and supports "probably not".

However, shure, you went into a harsh, invalidative, attack mode of communication. What is wrong with you?
Why be so assnine intolerant of other people's opinion?
Work on improving your spirituality and humanity.

Sorry, I guess I should try

Sorry, I guess I should try to disguise my comments in predominantly polite riddles like others I see on here.

"Probably not" if you consider opinions "data". It sounds like you have a lot to learn too! Two wrongs don't make a right. Opinions are irrelevant no matter how may opinions are in agreement.

Live long and prosper.

What data?

Voice morphed telephone calls with fake dead relatives?

Fake hijacker DNA? Fake hijacker confessions? Fake flight training in Florida? Fake ticket counter employees? Fake radio transmissions? We've heard it all before haven't we, and it never changes.

For all the lecturing about attitude, you still manage to get every single thing about 9/11 wrong. So my response to you is: so what? What about Jeff's attitude? Instead, what about a decade-long onslaught of force-fed flapdoodle from self-anointed 9/11 Truth 'leaders'?

Can you bring yourself to watch this, Tom?

9/11 martyr video of Walid al-Shehri
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S53SxdGMtHk#t=4m38s

9/11 martyr video of Abdulaziz al-Omari
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zHsSvrcvACs

9/11 martyr video of Saeed al-Ghamdi
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fr_sRV6-vAM

9/11 martyr video of Ahmed al-Ghamdi
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Fr3rA_KKyk

If you can bring yourself to watch any of this at all (I know 90% of Truthers simply cannot watch the above, because it will cause cerebral lockdown and a possible belief system crisis) Are you going to say it's all 'fake'? Are you going to say something about 'chain of custody'? Lament about the same chewed out false BBC reports about 'hijackers alive'? The more I learn about 9/11, the more insane I think MIHOP is. (Yes I use the term) I think MIHOP is a convenient buffer of nonsense obscuring the real deal. People like Jimd3100 are trying to expose part of that and they are being treated like garbage.

So how do you reconcile the building collapses?

Snowcrash,

If you now think the MIHOP theory is incorrect that would imply that you believe the building collapses were caused by aircraft impact and fire on Sept. 11, 2001.

If that is true, then I would be interested to hear how you think aircraft impact and fire could have caused these failures. If not, are you only talking about things like the hijackers being aboard the planes and the like? If that is the case then you wouldn't be completely opposed to the MIHOP theory.

Good point!

It would be nice to have a reply from Snowcrash here.

Nice bump

I am not bound by misinterpretations and misdefinitions of MIHOP or LIHOP, nor am I bound by the false dilemma fallacy. Since I wrote an entire blog post about it, I expect people to know, and not to ask.

Did any of you read my elaborate blog post (including illustrated PDF) about WTC 7?

To call these videos 9/11 martyr videos

is highly misleading. They are martyr videos, if you will, not uncommon for any of the afghan mudjahedeen sworn in by bin Laden. But I can assure you, there is none, nada, nothing regarding 9/11 or any mentioning of any kind of terrorist plot in it. Sure, somebody would like you to think they have something to do with 9/11, but all the 9/11 stuff was copied in by As-Sahab (whoever that is- doubts are certainly well in place). Please consider that most of alleged 9/11 hijackers did fight in the balcan or Chechnia and faced death in these fights, so that a last will for them is nothing unusal.

I want to know if you know this and call these videos 9/11 martyr videos anyway or why else you say 9/11 martyr videos to them like any flat minded "debunker"...

Hilarious

You didn't watch the videos. You can't. It would invoke a belief system crisis.

"But I can assure you, there is none, nada, nothing regarding 9/11 or any mentioning of any kind of terrorist plot in it."

What a crock. No mention of any kind of terrorist plot in it huh?

And no, obviously there's no direct reference to 9/11, or did you expect them to be clairvoyant? All in on the entire plan long beforehand?

Who are these guys in the videos exactly, SB? Where are they now? Show me some evidence for YOUR theory. No falsification, verification. Not believing something is not evidence. Perceived lack of evidence for one thing is not evidence for another thing.

And if you want to make a jab about someone's intelligence, best not do it in horrible, toe-curling Denglish.

If I was a captain,

If I was a captain, boxcutters would not stop me.

If I was a captain and I knew what was happenig on 9/11 - I would not let anyone enter the cockpit. Period.

No matter what, 4-5 guys with boxcutters would not have suceeded.

None the less, maybe they tried. Maybe they ALL suceeded with their 1 inch boxcutters subsequently hitting their targets (with reportedly poor flying skills perfectly) and the towers steel weakend from thermal expansion resulting in a total collapse that damaged #7 into a full collapse as well. I guess we dont know.

Furthermore, if the reports of these "muslim extremists" having drinks at a club are true, they were not Muslim by definition, so your question doesn't apply.

As to your first question:

I have never met an Al Qaeda member, do they have a badge - or are they just dark skinned?

Shure -

You seem to be rather confused about some things, or just have a very odd and inefficient way of asking questions.

No, I am not saying that there aren't "extremists" who claim to be Muslim.

I have no idea what happened on those planes, I wasn't on any of them, were you?

As a researcher I do have a working hypothesis about what took place on the planes, however.

In the future, if you want to know something, ask a direct question that I can answer.

Be well.

LeftWright you said: "I have

LeftWright you said:
"I have no idea what happened on those planes, I wasn't on any of them, were you?"

No, I wasn't on any of the planes, but the phone calls from the planes give me a pretty good idea of what happened ;)

LIke this call, you mean?

From: http://www.historycommons.org/timeline.jsp?day_of_9/11=aa11&timeline=complete_911_timeline

An FAA memo written on the evening of 9/11, and later leaked, will suggest that a man on Flight 11 is shot and killed by a gun before the plane crashes into the World Trade Center. The “Executive Summary,” based on information relayed by a flight attendant to the American Airlines Operation Center, states “that a passenger located in seat 10B [Satam Al Suqami] shot and killed a passenger in seat 9B [Daniel Lewin] at 9:20 a.m.” (Note that since Flight 11 crashes at 8:46, the time must be a typographical error, probably meaning 8:20). A report in Israeli newspaper Ha’aretz on September 17 will identify Lewin as a former member of the Israel Defense Force Sayeret Matkal, Israel’s most successful Special Operations unit. [United Press International, 3/6/2002]

The phone calls only tell you about the phone calls, nothing more, and since we don't have complete records for all the phone calls, there is a reasonable element of doubt regarding the phone calls, yes?

That said, my working hypothesis regarding the presence of individuals on the planes, who would later be identified as "hijackers", is that 19 men fitting their general description were on the planes under one of the following scenarios:

1) They thought they were part of an operation to hijack planes and fly them into targets.

2) They thought they were part of an operation to hijack planes for some other reason, perhaps to make a demand of some kind.

3) They thought were doing more reconnaissance flights to study airline security, etc.

4) They thought they were part of a red team/ blue team exercise of some kind.

I highly recommend reading the entire History Commons thread I linked to above, along with everything else on 9/11 there.

As I have said before, and will undoubtedly write again, if you want a direct answer, ask a direct question, and please do not assume you know what anyone thinks unless you ask direct questions, get direct answers and have then summarized said answer and received a positive response to said summary. Then, and only then, you can have relative confidence that you know what someone else thinks about that discrete issue or question.

Finally, when it comes to things you have no direct experience or knowledge of, I find it very helpful to keep an open mind. This helps to define and limit ones own confirmation bias and makes analyzing events accurately much more likely, especially when much is not known about said event(s).

Hope that helps.

Cheers!

Jon Gold: Nafeez... I have a

Jon Gold:
"Nafeez... I have a question for you... what are your feelings about individuals who try to say there is no evidence of "hijackers" or "Muslim involvement" with regards to the 9/11 attacks, and say that if you promote information regarding that, you are promoting the "Islamofascist Myth", and are being a racist? I'd be interested to hear what you have to say since that is a focus of your research, and you are a Muslim. Thanks."

Nafeez Ahmed:
"Jon, mostly these people largely lack a broader political or historical consciousness. obviously i think this is a ridiculous position to take. it comes from a total lack of familiarity with the politics of the muslim world, as well as with the development of us-uk unconventional warfare doctrines after ww2. in particular, the anomalies surrounding the alleged hijackers do not have easy answers - the problem is people like easy simple answers. they divide things up into simplistic binary choices, either 'this' or 'that', 'us' against 'them', etc. ironically, it's a very neocon like mentality that does us no favours..."

Jon Gold:
"Thank you Nafeez for your input. Here is something I wrote on the subject.
http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/sh...555&postcount=1 "

Nafeez Ahmed:
" i've seen that post. i like it. :) "

Jon Gold:
"Nice. Thanks."

source:
http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/showpost.php?p=97869&postcount=6

"Muslim Extremism" in the

"Muslim Extremism" in the category of our discussion is mainly born and bred through our own foreign policy.

Our involvment in foreign affairs is an issue aside for discussion; I don't know your politics, but I don't support getting involved.

In regard to 9/11, the idea of "muslim extremisim" becomes almost obsolete when compared to our lack of air defense, the demolition of the towers in NY, the controlled 9/11 Commission, and so much more.

The emphasis you want me to take from you on investigating and supporting the concept of "muslim extremisim" in regard to 9/11 is lost upon the mirad of closer-to-home-extremism: Infact no-one has really claimed that "muslim extremism" doesn't exist. I have simply said there are bigger problems. I stated that no muslim has ever attacked me or restricted my freedom, however Bob Graham has - directly through the PATRIOT Act.
Part of the investigation, yes. but you said Saudi Arabia is the "head" of the problem and I simply disagree with the evidence at hand.

As you quoted Nafeez saying:

" ..they divide things up into simplistic binary choices, either 'this' or 'that', 'us' against 'them', etc. ironically, it's a very neocon like mentality that does us no favours..."

And it has been my noted observation on many times during this forum discussion that both you and Jim have attempted to lump those of us taking disagreement to your certain positions into "deniars" of everything; from muslim extremisim, to planes, to flyover/unders, to fake country ridiculousness, and more.

My words were "all or nothing" in regard to how you and Jim take criticism, or disagreement and where your arguements lead into.

PNAC anyone? How about the PATRIOT Act? Election Fraud? If I wanted to hear more BS about "muslim extremism" I would listen to Leon Panetta's Sec. Def. confirmation hearings today.

I do not support bombing any of these countries Jeff and Jim, the term "muslim extremeism" is essentially unneccesary for most discussions in this country because we have our OWN CORRUPT OFFICIALS to deal with first.

I don't think Nafeez would

I don't think Nafeez would endorse the idea that there is somehow no "real" Islamic fundamentalist terrorism. To conclude this is a critical shift in our world views about terrorism and will be judged harshly by our critics if this conclusion is reached without proof. One ought to think twice when changing our ideas of 'Al-Quaeda is a often (or mostly or partially etc.) gov't influenced and utilized entity' to, 'Al-Quaeda is a ONLY gov't influenced and utilized entity to.' This is a radical conclusion which requires more proof than is currently available. These kinds of positions are also quite vague. For instance, is the implication then, that every single interview and video of alleged muslim terrorists we have seen are ALL actors or some? Where is the proof?

I wish you (LeftWright) and others would embrace Nafeez's far more reserved and fact only approach. This man worked hard to avoid any theorizing from day one, for he knew, especially in his position with his credentials, that theories or conclusions of 'I know what happened' is the last thing the 9/11 truth movement should be calling out.

Nafeez Ahmed on CSPAN's Book TV:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7177999362710155109

Shortly after an hour in:

"I do have a personal opinion, I'm not going to talk about it here, I don't see the relevance, of me saying, 'i believe this, or I believe that.' What is important, is getting to the facts. And the fact that we have this.....I mean, to say that Al Qaeda doesn't exist, is a non-sense. It doesn't make any sense."

And then he says about the question of, are you a conspiracy theorist, or are you a let it happen theorist, or are you an incompetence theorist (just to clarify he wasn't asked this, he brought it up that these are common questions being thrown around the 9/11 movement):

"The important thing is that we have certain things in place, to do things in a normal way. We have laws., which prevent us from doing things in another way. Now, on 9/11 and before 9/11, did we fail to protect American lives? Did we, effectively render our existing system inoperative in some way? My argument is yes we did. We failed. The gov't failed us. "

"I really believe the 9/11 movement has to get it's socks up on this issue. People complaining about "you don't say there was no plane at the pentagon? Sorry, your a traitor.' Or 'I believe this', NO! Why are we discussing these issues? It's legitimate to hold your opinion. It's legitimate to have these discussions, and these debates, and I think anything is open to discussion, BUT this is (about) what we agree on! Whether your a 'conspiracy theorist' supposedly or a 'coincidence theorist,' we can unite on this point...that clearly the gov't failed. The gov't failed us, and we need to understand, we need to have disclosure, we need to have an investigation as to why they failed. And these people who failed us need to get out of office, because they do not belong there..." "...they need to be held accountable, that is what counts, and that is what we should be calling for."

A true intellectual and academic's perspective. Something we justice seeking individuals should consider.

If you or your friends only feel that you can prove some form of prior knowledge of certain aspects of the 9/11 attacks, allow me personally to applaud your efforts. I apologize if anyone has made you feel bad, or 'not allowed in the club' for not embracing or concluding a particular conspiracy theory which you could not prove, in the name of those searching for 9/11 justice. You are on the right track. You are fighting the good fight. Read those Nafeez quotes again. Peace.

I take a very academic approach to 9/11

My working hypotheses are all based on facts.

When there are as many gaps in the data as we have with regard to the events of September 11, 2001, then it is rational to have multiple parallel working hypotheses that all make use of the same data.

As more data becomes known, the spectrum of working hypotheses will narrow accordingly.

When I am working with the general public, my default position is always to the most "conservative" interpretation of the facts and I always make sure to be very clear when I am stating my own speculation.

I have great respect for Dr. Ahmed and I'm quite sure that he also has working hypotheses, he is just keeps them to himself.

I don't think I have ever said that there are "no real Islamic fundamentalist terrorists", as I am quite certain that there are people who consider themselves to be just that, and their belief creates their reality. However, my research indicates that "global terrorist networks" such as "al Qaeda" were created, nurtured and manipulated by outside forces, which make use of them for their own ends, usually in service of a strategy of tension.

Thus, I have never said that "al Qaeda" doesn't exist, as that is patently absurd. (Perhaps there's a wee tad of conflation going on here?)

Finally, I have no problem stating when I don't know something or when something is not yet known publicly.

Quite clearly the government (several, actually) failed us. I think it is also quite clear that the U.S. government and much of the global corporate elite are corrupt.

If we are to survive and flourish, then the rule of just laws over men has to prevail. This is the core value of 9/11 truth.

The real question is: how do we get there?

The electoral process is rigged, the courts are rigged and the fourth estate is on the take.

We have to educate the public, one person at a time, and the 9/11 false flag is the best single tool we have for awakening the populace, if handled properly.

The truth shall set us free, and everyone has their own path to the truth.

Love is the only way forward, and love means understanding and accepting that everyone has their own path.

Exposing the Cover up is TRUTH

LeftWright said..."My bottom line here, regarding the Saudi role in 9/11, is that the planning for the 9/11 false flag operation did not BEGIN there, so the search for the perps should not END there."

Who's saying it ends there? Oh right, you are. So the planning of 9-11 didn't begin there where did it begin? Ramzi Yousef and Abdul Murad claimed it began with them as part of their Bojinka plot along with Ramzi's alleged Uncle KSM. This was 1995, But that just can't be true because they aren't Zionists or Christians so they must be innocents framed by the evil U.S. I suppose right?

LeftWright said..."This is the definition of a limited hangout."

Yes, because you insist on defining it that way because you want blame placed on the U.S. and no one else. To Bad. No one is suggesting limiting blame except seemingly you. The Saudi cover up leads to who orchestrated the cover up and then the biggest question. Why? Why the cover up, and there goes your limited hangout out the window.

LeftWright said.."This does not mean, however, that the Saudi role should not be FULLY investigated and exposed, as that WILL LEAD to most of the other participants, if all the leads are similarly FULLY investigated and exposed."

Yea, so much for a limited hangout but you have to first acknowledge the existence of brainwashed religious fanatics which you don't want to do. Then who is manipulating them? And why? Kind of hard to get a full investigation without even acknowledging this obvious and proven cover up. The ones protecting and covering for Saudi Arabia are the same ones trying to connect Iraq to Al Qeada when they knew it was Saudi Arabia not Iraq that was assisting, and funding them but you can't even get yourself to admit al qeda existed. Covering up the Saudi role while at the same time creating false connections with Iraq in order to have a war with them was not just despicable it is called treason. Limited hang out is total BS. It's an important lead, it's a fact and it's important. And it leads to a REAL international conspiracy behind the 9-11 attacks. And the despicable ways they were used.

LeftWright said..."As for the created construct that is the "Islamic fundamentalist terrorism" meme, I expect that Sen. Graham sincerely believes what he believes, as do many others who can't extricate themselves from this construct, which is massively reinforced throughout popular culture and "academia" (don't get me started on Lawrence Wright, Steve Coll and the other purveyors of partial truth in this area)"

Lawrence Wright and Steve Coll have both authored excellent books with good research. The Looming Tower and Ghost Wars are both excellent books- I don't care if they ruin your "no such thing as Islamic religious fanatics" mantra. That isn't dealing with reality.

LeftWright said..."I fully acknowledge this construct and accept that many people have been innocently swept along with it, including, perhaps, Sen. Graham. Thus, he is most likely no more "in on it" than millions of others who have also swallowed this construct hook, line and sinker. After all, that's why many millions (if not billions) of dollars and over two decades were spent creating this narrative (and doing a few other things as well, but that is at least two large books which I have not yet got around to writing)."

Not only are religious fanatics alive and dwelling on planet earth they've been around for thousands of years now and some of us are sick of them f**king up our planet.

LeftWright said...."As for me, I will return to researching pre-1979, the earliest starting point I have found to date for the actual implementation of the operation that would later known as the 9/11 false flag."

Oh, so you are to smart to fall for what Bob Graham did, he thought there were real hijackers, but you've discovered that the 9-11 plot was hatched before 1979 by who? Richard Nixon? Or was the funding and training of the Afghan War against the Russians just a ploy to attack the U.S. 22 years later by framing those nice freedom fighters?

You are

Jim, you are basically a 911 genius, but you are hurting your own cause with insults. If your civility were to match your intellect, you would be much more persuasive. And yes, the Saudi involvement (along with WTC 7, nano-thermite, etc etc etc) appears to be of extreme importance.

I second this comment

Jim, your research has documented a lot of important info, but if your goal is to persuade people that your interpretation of the facts is the best one, you're undermining your goal. Some will never be persuaded (I think your partially correct), but obnoxious behavior, and the use of logical fallacies in arguments, i.e. anyone who doesn't immediately embrace your view believes the Jews did it all and a missile hit the Pentagon, are going to turn off people who are open minded, seeking to understand, and support a full investigation. I'm turned off.

And, speaking as a moderator, if you continue to violate the rule that requires civility in commenting, your account will be placed in moderation.

There's significant evidence that certain Saudi royals and the GID provided financial, logistical and other assistance to the named hijackers, and monitored their activities, outside and inside the US. There are Pakistani ISI connections as well. And according to a DEA report, Mossad agents appear to have been keeping tabs on the named hijackers in FL, and were on location to film the attack on the WTC.

Furthermore, while certain Saudis, Pakistanis and Israelis benefited from the 'war on terror' it is difficult to conceive that principals of these foreign states would attempt 9/11 on their own or in collaboration w/o the cooperation of people in the MIC, including the Bushes. The most likely explanation, imho, is that the Al Qaeda plot was co-opted at some point, and was helped along beginning years before 9/11.

Graham's book "Intelligence Matters" documents a lot of important info and gives an insider's view. Graham is an Establishment figure and it is significant that he dissents from the official "Al Qaeda and no one else" OCT. It is significant that most of Congress and the MSM downplay or ignore his perspective. His view is potentially useful to the 9/11 truth movement because it is a potential wedge that can be driven into the Establishment.

However, it's not the whole story, and there are places Graham doesn't go, whether out of ignorance or some motive, i don't know. For instance, in one example from Intelligence Matters:
"An FBI lawyer mistakenly thought that Moussaoui had to be connected to an organization on the State Department list of foreign terrorist organizations--a 'recognized' foreign power. Though this would have prevented the lawyer from having to break new ground in FISA court, it was not a FISA requirement. Somehow, the word 'recognized' had been added to a rule that didn't include it. During the Joint Inquiry, North Carolina senator John Edwards asked Marion 'Spike' Bowman, the deputy general counsel of the FBI, whether any of his lawyers had given any mistaken advice on the law. Bowman said they hadn't. He was wrong." (2008:55)

Graham has concluded that this was not intentional sabotage, though there are other reasons to suspect that Bowman - and others involved in the Moussaoui incident; Michael Maltbie, Rita Flack and Dave Frasca were not simply 'incompetent', 'confused' and 'misinformed'. And others at the FBI and CIA have a lot to answer for as well.
http://www.historycommons.org/entity.jsp?entity=marion_%28_spike_%29_bowman

Despite Graham's mandate to investigate intelligence failures, these questions weren't pursued. Now, he's put out a novel which, it appears, will perpetuate his 'theory' that Saudi Arabia unilaterally supported the 9/11 plot, with no assistance from the Bushes, people in the FBI, CIA, State, INS and DOD, etc. If people read his book and begin demanding that the Saudi evidence be addressed, great. It will drive a wedge into the Establishment and create opportunities for other stuff to be addressed. However, the 'Saudis and Al Qaeda alone' theory is an incomplete theory, which requires ignoring or distorting a great deal of other information.

Bob Graham doesnt put all the

Bob Graham doesn't put all the blame on the Saudi's, he has explained that Bush and company were just as dirty. Whats frustrating is people that try to put all the blame on America doing it to themselves and marginalizing the provable cover up by calling it a distraction or limited hang out. Even worse, look at some of the comments on the thread... no hijackers, fictional extremists???

Now you're getting warmer, jimd3100

Or was the funding and training of the Afghan War against the Russians just a ploy to attack the U.S. 22 years later by framing those nice freedom fighters?

Please recall that the "Afghan" Mujahedin were created months BEFORE the Soviets invaded Afghanistan.

There were multiple reasons for choosing Afghanistan as the home for "al Qaeda" and the creation of the "Osama bin Laden" narrative, creating a plausible back story for the 9/11 false flag was only one of them.

My above admonition about the Saudi's being a "limited hangout" was simply that, a warning NOT to stop there, to keep pushing, as I want to nail ALL the perps (as I think everyone truly interested in 9/11 truth and justice does, yes?).

I find it mildly amusing that some people seem to think they know what I think without even asking me (Ok, all you remote viewers, what am I looking at right now? j/k)

Some folks seem to think the best way of finding out what I think is to keep throwing out assertions about what I think and wait for me to make clarifications, this is a highly inefficient way of communication and one I will not engage in.

If you really want to know what I think, ask me (I think this is the third time I've stated this in the past week here, is this really that difficult a concept to grasp?)

Getting back to the issues at hand...

Jimd3100 - What credible evidence do you have the places which alleged hijackers on which planes? If they were all on the planes, how can you know why they thought they were on the planes?

My working hypothesis regarding the presence of the alleged hijackers on the planes remains fairly open, as I have yet to see credible evidence that shows if, how and why they were on the planes. There remain many plausible scenarios, imo.

Note for the logically impaired (or those who want simple answers, which is NOT me): This does not mean I'm saying that the alleged hijackers were not on the planes, my default view on this is that most or all of the named individuals were on the planes, in exactly what capacity I have yet to determine.

Jimd3100 - If YOU were going to plan a false flag as large, important and complex as the 9/11 operation, how early would YOU start planning it?

In the future, if you want to actually know what I think about something, just ask. Trust me, I'm not shy about expressing my opinion.

On the other hand, if you keep making false assertions about what I think or about what I have written, then you may find one of the other moderators reviewing your comments and reminding you to avoid such pointless fishing expeditions.

Finally, I would highly recommend to everyone that if you have not done due diligence on the Saudi role in the 9/11 false flag, to do so. It is important, relatively significant and goes back for at least two decades (but my research indicates that it is certainly not the beginning or end of the 9/11 story). I have been researching the Saudi's covert activities since the mid-1980's, as I stated above.

I hope this lays to rest much of the pointless speculation and rather bizarre assertions and leaps of logic that have taken place.

If not, just ask a direct question and you can expect a direct answer within a reasonable amount of time (say, 48 hours).

The truth shall set us free, but it is not easy or quick to discover, and should be considered more a means than an end.

Love is the only way forward, and love means taking great care to not let let one's own confirmation bias influence your comprehension of reality.

Left Wright: "My bottom line

Left Wright:

"My bottom line here, regarding the Saudi role in 9/11, is that the planning for the 9/11 false flag operation did not BEGIN there, so the search for the perps should not END there. This is the definition of a limited hangout."

"The "Saudi role" is limited*
Vote up! Vote down!
and thus is being pushed as part of one or more limited hangouts, imo*."

These statements of yours seem to assert that we limit our knowledge of fundamental truths and ideas about 9/11. Your statements here also serve as a way to limit the amount of time reasonable people wanna hangout here.

Interesting comment, kdub

These statements of yours seem to assert that we limit our knowledge of fundamental truths and ideas about 9/11. Your statements here also serve as a way to limit the amount of time reasonable people wanna hangout here.

I would appreciate it if you would expand on this and perhaps enter into a dialogue via email, so that I can better understand exactly what you are trying to say here and how you came by this impression.

As it is off topic, I think it best that we move this discussion to email.

However, and FTR, I would never want anyone to limit their knowledge or understanding of anything, and certainly not regarding the fundamental truths about 9/11.

I look forward to your email.

How is it off topic, btw YOU brought it up

Accusing people of embracing "limited hangouts" is a form of belittling research efforts (whether you mean it or not, i don't personally care). It's on topic because you are acting as though Bob Graham hasn't done the truth movement a huge service in regard to our general credibility. You would rather people not utilize this supposedly limited tool? You think people should feel bad about discovering truths, if they aren't the full blown theory you supposedly know and understand?

So I say again:
If you assert the limited hangout finger pointing positions, you are discouraging valid researchers who have embraced a credible (far more credible than the 'finger pointer'), and whether you mean to or not, you turn people off from the truth.

Rag Head Scapegoats

Pressure to acknowledge 9/11 comes with a price. -- Feds will completely jump blame for 9/11 on Saudis to invade and take over oil.
Latest disinfo says high oil prices will continue due to orders from OPEC, (quaint notion, right?) NATO is OPEC!....OPEC, indeed!.

Expect military action to encroach on sanctity of Saudi Arabia. Remeber how Bush french-kissed the king?

HWS

The truth shall set you

The truth shall set you free
and sometimes the truth means accepting people who aren't informed about everything YOU claim to know about
Love is the only way forward
And this means applauding people discovering new elements of the "truth" before embracing a "theory."

I hope he SELLS SELLS

I hope he SELLS MILLIONS OF COPIES and people study his work, because the "40% truth" in his book may lead you to his political perception too!

As Graham says above:

"The threat of Al Qaeda is, post Bin Laden, is still VERY great."

And thats when I raise my finger to click "stop," because I don't wanna hear it anymore...heard enough bullshit in my day.

For some reason I feel NOT ONE IOTA of threat from Al Qaeda. But man, the PATRIOT Act and Obama Admin - that really is freaking me out.

Yeah, maybe I should look at Saudi Arabia as the source of my problems....but alas, I don't: I can't get my eyes past OUR OWN corrupt Government.

Shure said:
"It is obvious these attacks could not have happened without the help of people within the U.S. power structure, but that doesn't mean Saudi's didn't play a key role in the events of September 11, 2001."

I would put it differently, specifically:

It's obvious these attacks could not have happened without the KEY help of KEY people within the U.S. power structure, but that doesn't mean Saudi's didn't play a role in the events of September 11, 2001 - is more like it.

HA! Thanks for the downvotes!

HA!

Thanks for the downvotes!

I am fully aware some of you disagree with me on the fact that Al Qaeda is NOT the giant threat Bob Graham has apparently convinced you of.

Who downvotes someone who describes being more frightented by Obama and the PATRIOT Act more than Al Qaeda on any forum? Care to name yourself?

-1

-1, that was me.

I know. At least you have

I know.

At least you have courage.

Informational Audio books...

The Looming Tower: Al-Qaeda and the Road to 9/11 -
http://s1.zetaboards.com/pumpitout/topic/4224225/1/

_________________

House of Bush, House of Saud -
http://s1.zetaboards.com/pumpitout/topic/4288271/1/

_________________________

Sleeping With the Devil -
http://s1.zetaboards.com/pumpitout/topic/4201509/1/

.

Emphasis on "House of

Emphasis on "House of Bush..."

Read them. Thanks.

Grow up

There would be no stand down if there were no hijacked planes. There would be no war in Iraq if known al qaeda members were not let into the U.S. being funded and helped by Bush's Saudi buddies. If Bandar was the Ambassador for Israel instead of Saudi Arabia you and others would be all over it. Saudi Arabia and Pakistan are good Governments aren't they? Not evil governments like the U.S. and Israel huh? Grow up.

Bomb em to hell Jim, but I'd

Bomb em to hell Jim, but I'd charge you for warcrimes just the same.

no you wont

You wont charge me with anything but telling you the truth. You are the one saying to bomb people because of your limited intellect.

This is about to get too

This is about to get too stupid too quick.

The record is here.

You and Shure are more scared of Al Qaeda than the PATRIOT Act and Obama.

I am more scared of the PATRIOT Act and Obama than Al Qaeda.

And contrary to what you try to put into my mouth, I am against bombing people: Hence the fear of Obama, not Al Qaeda.

Readers can judge for themselves what poses a greater threat to their security and freedom; PATRIOT Act and Obama or Al Qaeda.

Grow Up and be a big boy

Nor Cal Truth said..."This is about to get too stupid too quick."

I guess you haven't noticed...it got stupid a long time ago

Nor Cal Truth said.."The record is here."

The record is in different places, try reading some reports, just for fun.

Nor Cal Truth said...."You and Shure are more scared of Al Qaeda than the PATRIOT Act and Obama."

You put words in my mouth as you accuse me of putting words in your mouth makes you absurd, and I'm not scared of anything-YOU are! Try to not be so cowardly.

Nor Cal Truth said..."I am more scared of the PATRIOT Act and Obama than Al Qaeda."

As I said you are the one easily frightened.

Nor Cal Truth said..."And contrary to what you try to put into my mouth, I am against bombing people: Hence the fear of Obama, not Al Qaeda."

These are your words not mine..."Bomb em to hell Jim, but I'd charge you for warcrimes just the same." Also..."Hence the fear of Obama," try and be a big boy and don't be so scared.

Nor Cal Truth said..."Readers can judge for themselves what poses a greater threat to their security and freedom; PATRIOT Act and Obama or Al Qaeda."

Hey genius there would be no patriot act without Bush's Saudi buddies coming into the country and him covering it up to attack Iraq.

Keep on keepin on Jim. I

Keep on keepin on Jim.

I don't want to insult you anymore. Your insinuations are yours to make.

As I said it would, it has now become "too stupid" for me to participate any longer.

I will be the "big boy" and offer an apology towards getting more work done; perhaps "reading reports" or something.

Some reading material

Here is some reading materail for you:

Why I support the "Official Story" -
http://s1.zetaboards.com/pumpitout/topic/3863772/1/

9/11---Public record proves inside job! -
http://s1.zetaboards.com/pumpitout/topic/4071855/1/

"Do the orders still stand?" Who was he? -
http://s1.zetaboards.com/pumpitout/topic/3712237/1/

____________________

"You will know them by their fruits".

Here is

Awesome links here and above

Awesome links here and above shure, thanks.

Hey genius there would be no

Jim says:

"Hey genius there would be no patriot act without Bush's Saudi buddies coming into the country and him covering it up to attack Iraq."

Or it being drafted and signed by the Bush comrades; and now Obama again, but never mind that point.

Especially when trying to insinuate that someone is stupid for not believing the PATRIOT Act is Saudi Arabia's fault.

Are readers reading this? Wow.

As I said: I'm saying I'm

As I said:

I'm saying I'm more scared by the PATRIOT Act and Obama. Al Qaeda, if our military would not have stood down on 9/11, has never entered my life or this country with the ability to attack.

6000 years old

Nor Cal Truth said..."And thats when I raise my finger to click "stop," because I don't wanna hear it anymore...heard enough bullshit in my day."

And I have heard enough BS too, like planted plane parts, a shoot down during a stand down, missiles that no one saw, fly overs, no hijackers, alive hijackers, fake phone calls, and on and on...your made up conspiracies are not helping you while you ignore the real conspiracy right in front of your face.

I guess you've never realized that powerful people and governments have used religion to manipulate people and gain power, it's only been going on for 6000 years now.

Is the real conspiracy you

Is the real conspiracy you and Shure trying to freak me out about Al Qaeda even more than others are trying to do?

Is the real conspiracy you trying to insinuate Bob Graham is speaking more truth to power than Left Wright?

Is the real conspiracy you trying to insinuate that John is helping Bush cover up 9/11?

You sir, are acting dellusional.

Your frustrations are present in every comment. I have not talked about planes, Pennsylvania, missles, hijjackers, none of it. bnut there your loose lips go, just like Shure: All or nothing.

Jimd3100Stein confesses (yet again)

Nor Cal Truth said.."Is the real conspiracy you and Shure trying to freak me out about Al Qaeda even more than others are trying to do?"

Yes, we are secret agents trying to get you to give up your freedoms for security, and trying to get you to attack Saudi Arabia because we are being funded by Centcom

Nor Cal Truth said.."You sir, are acting dellusional."

Obviously-- I even think Afghanistan is a real place on a planet called earth.

Sarcasim begets sarcasim.

Sarcasim begets sarcasim. Nice.

Al Qaeda Al Qaeda Al

Al Qaeda Al Qaeda Al Qaeda

"Lets Roll"

Thanks for airing more Al Qaeda promotion.

Not really.

Al Qaeda, extremists, jihadis...

Al Qaeda, extremists, jihadis, call them whatever you want, but there really are people out there that don't like us. Not because they hate us for our freedoms (at one time they were called freedom fighters), but because of our policies in the middle east. As "jimd3100" pointed out before, the hijackers made video testimonies as to why they were doing what they were doing ;)

A few months ago I spoke to a guy who went to the training camps in Afghanistan. His father knew OBL, and they all knew something big was going to be happening.

I would love to hear you try and explain to him there is no such thing as Al Qaeda (or whatever name you want to give to the people who flew planes into buildings and smashed one into the ground in Shanksville on 9/11).

Here it comes, as always. The

Here it comes, as always.

The all or nothing philosophy:

,I would love to hear you try and explain to him there is no such thing as Al Qaeda (or whatever name you want to give to the people who flew planes into buildings and smashed one into the ground in Shanksville on 9/11).

No. No. No.

Read all the posts again.

I'm saying I'm more scared by the PATRIOT Act and Obama. Al Qaeda, if our military would not have stood down on 9/11, has never entered my life or this country with the ability to attack.

Get real. Get real. Get real.

And I'm supposed to be excited about this . . .

because. . . ?

Senator Graham

I don't trust Bobby.

Another "limited hangout" attempt... probably bogus.

On the morning of 9/11, at the Capitol, Bob Graham was in a meeting with the ISI's Mahmud Ahmed, alongside soon to be appointed CIA boss Porter Goss and others. Bob Graham knows a lot more than he's letting on.... it seems apparent that the "Saudi" angle is a form of "limited hangout", to disguise a far greater involvement/crime... and possibly to justify future action against Saudi Arabia, if this angle is pursued?

Questions: How does "Saudi involvement" include:
(1) the deliberate stand down of the US air defenses that morning?
(2) the deliberate scrapping of the highly efficient scramble-intercept protocol, shortly before 9/11, to require the permission of the Sec.of defense (Rumsfeld), replacing a near perfect system with one that "failed" completely?
(3) the obvious (and proven) deliberate demolition by explosives of the three largest buildings of the WTC?
(4) the deliberate refusal of the White House to hold an investigation into 9/11, for 441 days, until their hand was forced?, and subsequently
(5) the deliberate compromise (read trashing) of that "investigation" by Philip Zelikow and others?

etc. etc. etc.

Where was your hero, Sen Graham, on 9/11?

This bloggulator post is perhaps the best in this entire thread. Where is your response to it? Meeting with the Pakistani ISI paymaster of the patsies while the mass murder is going on should make someone a suspect, not a savior or a whistle-blower!

Hmmmm...

Hmm, well... since Graham was a Senator and a member of the Senate Intelligence Committee, I guess it would be part of his job to be meeting with Mahmood Ahmed the director of Pakistan's ISI to discuss intelligence matters ;)

Show "Its too bad..." by shure

You are the only one saying

You are the only one saying that shit here man.

This forum is not about Jesse Ventura or DRG.

Dont bring them up because many of us are in disagreement on this post.

Thats a distraction.

Bob helped write the Patriot Act.

So I see no need to support him like you and Jim plead us all to, like he is a hero.

When Sen. Bob Graham campaigned in Iowa last weekend, at least two Democratic activists complained that the USA Patriot Act threatened civil liberties. They asked what he planned to do about it.

The Florida senator replied that he was unhappy with Attorney General John Ashcroft's implementation of the antiterrorism law, but Graham neglected to mention an important fact: He co-wrote it.

http://www.sptimes.com/2003/06/14/Worldandnation/Graham_quiet_about_hi.shtml

Read Much?

Nor Cal Truth said...."So I see no need to support him like you and Jim plead us all to, like he is a hero."

Of course not because he is an American politician and therefor he is "in on it" because the only thing you truthers have shown you are good at are baseless accusations and burning bridges thereby guaranteeing you will never accomplish anything but give money to your conspiracy theory industry capitalists who take advantage of your paranoia.

The C IA refused to share info with the FBI because they were to busy working with their Saudi counter parts. Graham thought it might be better if the CIA knows an Al Qaeda operative is going to come to the U.S. to share that info with the INS and FBI like they were supposed to anyway. Isn't that horrible? Are you frightened of Bob Graham now?

From your own link......

"A spokesman for Graham said he wrote portions of the law that have not been controversial, such as sections that require criminal investigators to share information about possible terrorists with foreign intelligence analysts. Graham also wrote sections that are designed to improve the sharing of information among federal, state and local agencies."

"Graham said this week that he is concerned about the implementation of other sections of the law. "I think the attorney general has gone beyond what the Congress intended, particularly in areas such as disparate treatment and what amounts to a form of racial profiling against Americans of Islamic background."

"Graham said Congress should conduct "a serious review of what has happened under this act." He said he opposes an expanded bill dubbed "Patriot 2" and opposes an effort to make the current law permanent. It is due to expire in 2005."
http://www.sptimes.com/2003/06/14/Worldandnation/Graham_quiet_about_hi.shtml

Worse than people who think

Worse than people who think "everyone is in on it" are people like you who think everyone including myself think that everyone is in on it; but in reality you dont know what the fuck you are talking about because you don't know me or where I stand on these issues.

You think Bob is a awesome? Cool. I would give him much more credit for NOT signing the PATRIOT Act.

LOL!

Nor Cal Truth said..."I don't want to insult you anymore. Your insinuations are yours to make." 06/08/2011 - 10:11pm.

Nor Cal Truth said.."but in reality you dont know what the fuck you are talking about" 06/09/2011 - 1:20am

Nor Cal Truth said.."You crazy boy." 06/09/2011 - 1:27am.

LOL! I'm supposed to take you seriously?

Jim,You hostility and

Jim,

You hostility and insinuations towards me have made me negate on my previous statement.

When you talk about me, its true when I say "you don't know what the fuck you are talking about."

And your comments that try to lump everyone on this Blog who doesn't agree with you into "missle advocates, pentagon flyovers, fake countries, and other absolutely ridiculous comments you have said are "crazy" to me to be short.

But innaccurate, unfair and wrong is probably a better, and less insulting term.

Crazy?

Nor Cal Truth said...."You hostility and insinuations towards me have made me negate on my previous statement."

LOL, gee that hurts.

Nor Cal Truth said..."But innaccurate, unfair and wrong is probably a better, and less insulting term."

I know- I can't get anything right and am always being duped by secret agents.

Nor Cal Truth said...."And your comments that try to lump everyone on this Blog who doesn't agree with you into "missle advocates, pentagon flyovers, fake countries, and other absolutely ridiculous comments you have said are "crazy" to me to be short."

Crazy? Have you even considered my Fly Under theory that happened on 9-12? I suppose you think that's crazy as well? As crazy as a plane hitting the pentagon?

I am amazed you have not been

I am amazed you have not been banned as a disruptor.

Your statements are so far outlandish, it's amazing.

You are way over the edge.

Read lots, thanks. I agree

Read lots, thanks.

I agree with Bob when he says this:

We found that failures of intelligence collection and analysis, compounded by a lack of information-sharing within the intelligence community and between the intelligence community and the law enforcement community, cost us the chance to detect and disrupt the plot of the 19 hijackers. In short, September 11 could have—indeed, should have—been prevented.

http://www.cfr.org/terrorism/senator-bob-graham-remarks-council-foreign-relations/p6905

Unfortunately, he signed the PATRIOT Act which is nothing about being a PATRIOT.

Bob Graham co-wrote the Patriot Act?

Thanks for pointing this out, Nor Cal Truth.

For many of us living elsewhere on the planet, America is no longer a country we readily recognise. We've learned that words like 'freedom', 'democracy' and 'values' are lip service - while the Patriot Act, Espionage Act and the Nobel Peace Prize Winner's bloody Drone Wars and Wall Street Bail-Outs represent the harsh reality. Bob Graham strikes one as a limited hangout. But I'm willing to be proved wrong.

Your hero, not mine:

He was a primary author of the portions of the USA PATRIOT Act which mandate greater information sharing among foreign intelligence and domestic law enforcement agencies to help fight a unified war on terrorism.

(Bob Graham)

Scary huh?

Isn't that frightening? I think you've just outed the mastermind of 9-11 - turns out it was Bob Graham. Nicely done! Now if we can just get him and Lloyd in front of a grand jury.

Jim, You crazy boy. All or

Jim,

You crazy boy.

All or nothing - typical.

Wow!

A genuine idiot!

Listen, it IS possible to be in disagreement with you, to think this article a shill, and to not genuflect to your lover, Bob Graham, WITHOUT being a fan of either Ventura or Griffin's. That you even bring them into the conversation indicates two things:

1) you have nothing substantive to say
2) you are attempting to distract from the truth of what is being said to you.

We see through your puerile games.

And we laugh.

Conspiracy theories Vs Conspiracy Facts

TruthTroubadour said..."This bloggulator post is perhaps the best in this entire thread. Where is your response to it?"

I have a life and wasted to much of it on paranoid conspiracy BS and I don't feel a need to respond to every post and paranoid rant, but because I'm such a nice guy I'll indulge you this one time.

TruthTroubadour said..."Meeting with the Pakistani ISI paymaster of the patsies while the mass murder is going on should make someone a suspect, not a savior or a whistle-blower!"

Being on the intelligence committee of course he is going to meet with the ISI intelligence chief when he is in America, your paranoia and baseless accusations mean nothing but typical conspiracy theory flawed thinking. Burning bridges and baseless accusations have gotten you and the truth movement nowhere and will continue to do so. Maybe he was meeting with other people to..ya think?

http://911blogger.com/files/DOD_FOIA_response_20-May-08.pdf

bloggulator said..."On the morning of 9/11, at the Capitol, Bob Graham was in a meeting with the ISI's Mahmud Ahmed, alongside soon to be appointed CIA boss Porter Goss and others."

Yea, and Goss is the one who censured those 28 pages that Bush wanted censored not Graham, Graham and Goss were the heads of the Senate Intelligence Committee, The 2 heads of the Congress Intelligence Committee agreed with Graham that those 28 pages should not be censured the only one that agreed with Bush to do it was Goss, who was later appointed to head the CIA.

And shure has already pointed out that the co chairman of the intelligence committee meeting with the head of Pakistan Intelligence is not proof of a made up conspiracy in your head, it is what he is supposed to do. Everyone is not "in on it" get a grip on your paranoia.

bloggulator said.."Bob Graham knows a lot more than he's letting on.... it seems apparent that the "Saudi" angle is a form of "limited hangout", to disguise a far greater involvement/crime... and possibly to justify future action against Saudi Arabia, if this angle is pursued?"

Those poor poor innocent framed nice religious boys from Saudi Arabia led by their brave truth telling hero Osama Bin Laden is a fantasy land BS that will get you nowhere. Of course Graham knows more than what he is allowed to say. Bush and Goss made it illegal for him to say it but it's been exposed anyway. There is a cover up. As usual so called truthers and their conspiracy theory paranoia is only good at burning bridges and keeping itself nothing but a fringe loon group. Lloyd the cab driver isn't "in on it" either. Why don't you conspiracy theorists actually focus on a real conspiracy? The Saudi-CIA-ISI one.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u7WMygIb9Ko

bloggulator said..Questions: How does "Saudi involvement" include:
"(1) the deliberate stand down of the US air defenses that morning?"

psst... here is a secret most people in the world already know...most of the hijackers were Saudi's and Al Qeada was funded by Saudi money. No hijackers= no stand down.

bloggulator said.."(2) the deliberate scrapping of the highly efficient scramble-intercept protocol, shortly before 9/11, to require the permission of the Sec.of defense (Rumsfeld), replacing a near perfect system with one that "failed" completely?"

Gee, it's almost as if he was getting ready for Saudi's in a group called Al Qeada, being tracked by the CIA and Saudis agents assisting the Saudi hijackers huh?

bloggulator said.."(3) the obvious (and proven) deliberate demolition by explosives of the three largest buildings of the WTC?"

You mean the wtc buildings that were hit by planes hijacked by religious fruitcakes funded by Saudi Arabia? And being tracked and assisted by Bandar Bush and his brother in law Turki al Faisel head of Saudi Intelligence? Along with the CIA who along with the NSA had their communications hub bugged since 1998?

bloggulator said.."(4) the deliberate refusal of the White House to hold an investigation into 9/11, for 441 days, until their hand was forced?, and subsequently"

You mean the investigation that was called for by the victims families AFTER it was discovered that the hijackers were living with an FBI informant who was introduced to him by Saudi Agents? Yea, Graham's Inquiry or "investigation" discovered this stuff and more which lead to a demand for an Independent 9-11 commission where the cover up continued.

bloggulator said.."(5) the deliberate compromise (read trashing) of that "investigation" by Philip Zelikow and others?"

You mean like when he fired investigators who tried to follow the Saudi leads despite his orders the Saudis were off limits? Thereby continuing the cover up?

Graham on Graham?

Sen Graham admits his book contains only 30% truth. Believe him on that. We need a new investigation for all of the reasons everyone here as mentioned, and more....... Bob Graham should be the first in line calling for a new investigation. WAC should be all over him right about now.

My curiousity has got the better of me:

FICTION: "The congressional inquiry into the 9/11 attacks left several secrets unanswered. The top three are Saudi Arabia's full role in the preparation for and the execution of the plot; the Kingdom's willingness and capacity to collaborate in future terrorist actions against the United States; and why this and the prior administration conducted a cover-up that thus far has frustrated finding the answers to the first two questions...........Shortly after this appears in print, his suspicion comes true: Senator Billington, a co-chair of the 9/11 Congressional Inquiry Commission, is murdered near his Florida home.

FACT:

28 Redacted Pages

To read A LOT more about Saudi Arabia, go here -
http://911truthnews.com/the-facts-speak-for-themselves/#fact14

paranoia

After reading through many of the comments, I just had to say this. It is pretty ridiculous to call somebody paranoid because they are suspicious of Bob Graham.

Most high ranking US politicians deserve the same consideration. Although it is clearly obvious to all of us that the WTC collapses were all CDs, his existence supports the OCT against that one damning fact. Truth, justice and peace are apparently not among his priorities. Why should we trust him?

Glad to see some sound common sense expounded here

The discussions attempting to link different parties to the crimes on Sept. 11, 2001 concerning who did what, when, or where are insignificant and to a degree a distraction, when they don't include the clear evidence that those three buildings did not collapse due to aircraft impacts and fires, but due to controlled demolition.

The fact that the building collapses are not being investigated or talked about by officials points to a cover-up on a large scale.

If the building collapses were investigated properly the rest of the scenario involved in the crimes would quickly become clear. The starting point would be to investigate the collapse of Building 7 and go from there.

When deconstructing a multi-faceted, multi-decade

operation the scale of the 9/11 false flag, one should leave no stone unturned, imo. Especially when it is clear that said operation was highly compartmentalized.

Thus, while the obvious demolitions of the three WTC buildings clearly indicate the involvement of actors beyond the alleged hijackers, this is only one part of the story.

I hope everyone here agrees that, if we are to get something close to real justice, no one involved in the 9/11 false flag should be ignored or under-investigated.

I think it also safe to say that there are multiple cover-ups going on, some being a bit deeper than others, perhaps...but all need to be investigated and exposed, yes?

Finally, I think all rational avenues of investigation are equally valid.

Thanks for all your fine work, Tony.

Be well.

Amen!

...

March 15, 2001: Bush Tells

March 15, 2001: Bush Tells Saudi Prince that Military Action in Iraq Needs to be ‘Decisive’

During a meeting with President Bush, Saudi Prince Bandar expresses concern about the US’s continuing patrolling of the “no-fly zone” in Iraq. The prince complains that it is “costing us militarily, financially, but much more importantly politically,” and adds that “it is not hurting Saddam Hussein.” Bush seems to agree. “If there is any military action, then it has to be decisive. That can finalize the issue,” Bush says. “The Iraqi opposition is useless and not effective.”
http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=BushBandarMeeting20010315#BushBandarMeeting20010315

Indyk remembered a different

Indyk remembered a different Bandar, one who was a super-hawk when it came to Saddam. "He was always pushing for the United States to bomb Iraq, much more than Paul Wolfowitz." He was referring to the neoconservative scholar and senior Pentagon official who would later press so hard for the U.S. Invasion of Iraq in 2003. "He wanted us to knock off Saddam." Indyk was convinced the prince had a personal grudge to settle with Saddam. When the State Department had taken away his security detail after Clinton came into office, Bandar had protested vociferously, arguing he needed it because Saddam had taken out a contract to have him killed. Also, Saddam had tried to assassinate his favorite U.S. president, George H.W. Bush, while he was visiting Kuwait after leaving office in April 1993. So the prince couldn't wait for the U.S. bombs to fall." page 137
http://www.amazon.com/Kings-Messenger-Americas-Tangled-Relationship/dp/0802716903

"Speaking to the Arabic

"Speaking to the Arabic satellite network Al-Arabiya on Thursday, Bandar -- now Abdullah's national security adviser -- said Saudi intelligence was "actively following" most of the September 11, 2001, plotters "with precision."
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/11/01/saudiarabia.terrorism/index.html

Senator Bob Graham on Keys to

Senator Bob Graham on Keys to the Kingdom
The Leonard Lopate Show June 7, 2011

Graham speaks about the patriot act @ 18min20sec. of the interview -

audio link -

http://www.wnyc.org/shows/lopate/2011/jun/07/senator-bob-graham-keys-kingdom/

.

Frontline: Saudi Time Bomb

Frontline: Saudi Time Bomb

Can America still count on one of its most important allies in the Arabworld -- Saudi Arabia? Or does an undercurrent of militant Islamic fundamentalism threaten the stability of both Saudi Arabia and the entire region? FRONTLINEand The New York Times explore these and other questions in "Saudi Time Bomb?"

Through interviews with U.S. and Saudi officials, political analysts,religious experts, and observers, this report outlines the history ofU.S.-Saudi relations, the internal problems and contradictions within Saudisociety, the growing Islamic fundamentalist movement that threatens SaudiArabia's stability, and the troubling connections between Saudi Arabia and someIslamic religious schools, or "madrassas," whichpropagate an extreme form of Islam, known as Wahhabism, throughout the Muslim world.

"Saudi Time Bomb?" explores how Wahhabism is one of the undercurrents of Islamic extremism. This form of Islam, rooted in SaudiArabia, is based on a particularly austere, literal interpretation of the Koran.(Critics say that Wahhabism's rigidity makes it open to misinterpretation anddistortion.) Observers say some madrassas -- though intended to spread literacy among underprivileged youth through study of the Koran -- have evolved into Wahhabi schools that use the Koran to justify waging war against non-believers.

FRONTLINE chronicles how these madrassas grew into the thousands during the ten-year Afghan war against the Soviets. And how -- because of the nature ofthat war -- the madrassas, most notably in Pakistan, became training centers for jihad.

"They were recruiting, organizing schools which used Islamic ideology as a wayof creating a very efficient guerrilla army," says Vali Nasr, anauthority on Islamic fundamentalism. "You have the whole rise, if you would,of Islamic West Points."

Exploring the far-flung influence of Wahhabism, FRONTLINE tells the story of animpoverished boy from the Comoros Islands, Haroun Fazul. Schooled by aWahhabi cleric at a madrassa, he received a scholarship to study at a Wahhabi madrassa in Pakistan,and from there went on to join Al Qaeda in Afghanistan. In 1998, he bombed theU.S. embassy in Nairobi, Kenya.

This report also examines the role of Saudi charities in funding some of these madrassas; the Wahhabi sect's close ties to the Taliban, many of whomwere educated in Saudi-financed madrassas in Pakistan; and the current tensions between the U.S. and Saudi Arabia arising from the kingdom's seeming reluctance to cooperate in the war on terrorism.

In his interview with FRONTLINE in late September, the Saudi ambassador to the United States, Prince Bandarbin Sultan, maintained that the kingdom's relationship with the United Statesremains strong. Yet former National Security Adviser Brent Scowcroft concedesthat there is much resentment among Saudis and other Arabs over America's strongsupport of Israel. And U.S. policymakers say there is also lingeringresentment over the presence of U.S. troops stationed in Saudi Arabia. But both Scowcroft and former Secretary of State James Baker maintain thatAmerica's Saudi-based troops are necessary to protect the region and its vast reserves of oil, on which the United States economy depends.

more:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/saudi/

.

The culture of DC and the corporate media: preventing justice.

Is it *POSSIBLE* for not just Bob Graham, but *any* Washington DC insider, especially entrenched incumbents, to come out with what they really know? This does not just apply to 9/11, but many other (lesser) controversies which, in a world with any semblance of justice, would prompt full unbiased, independent investigations, and nail the perps to the wall, no mater how privileged or influential they were.

When one is deep in the DC club, the last thing one dares to do is shop your extended family and associates, regardless of which side of the political aisle they adhere. We all know what happens to whistleblowers, especially in the new post 9/11 world. Keeping mum is the 12th Commandment in DC... the 11th being "thou shalt not get caught". "National security" is a catch-all excuse to keep information away from the scrutiny of the unwashed masses; however rather than "national", the security about which they are far more concerned, is their own personal security and that of their associates.

By rights, anyone who was in talks with the alleged paymaster to the alleged 9/11 hijackers, on the day it all happened, *should* have attracted droves of FBI agents to question, in depth, everyone in that meeting which (if Mohamed Atta had anything to do with the attacks other than as convenient patsy), could have easily resulted in charges of at least "accessory-before-the-fact" to mass murder, a crime that carries a similar penalty as that handed out to the actual perpetrators. How much more damning do circumstances have to get, in order for the Feds to act?

The DC political machine is a self-regulating entity, effectively compartmentalized by its inbuilt hierarchy and rules as a self-protection mechanism. And as we all must surely be aware, self-regulation works as effectively in the pursuit of justice as in, for examples, the police investigating the police, the Mafia investigating the Gambino family (!), a study of the health effects of GM foods funded by the Monsanto corporation, or... most blatantly of all, the Bush Administration's hardline neoconservative appointee Philip Zelikow in charge of the 9/11 commission's so-called "investigation".

Bob Graham, IMHO, has no choice but to follow what is open to him... and the same goes for any other DC insider who have written about this (and other) topics. He obviously knows a lot more than he is telling, but he doesn't know enough to effectively blow the whistle and name names, without being hung out to dry, roundly ignored, or castigated as a conspiracy nut, no matter how much integrity the man has.

Like any other person, Senator Graham has a sense of self-preservation. In DC (as in so many areas of political and corporate life), pragmatism trumps principle every time.

Bob Graham pens political

Bob Graham pens political thriller
By PATRICK GAVIN | 6/8/11 7:23 AM EDT
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0611/56490.html

Bob Graham is an old hand when it comes to writing policy tomes such as “Intelligence Matters: The CIA, the FBI, Saudi Arabia and the Failure of America’s War on Terror” and “America, The Owner’s Manual: Making Government Work for You.” But the latest effort by the former Florida senator and governor presents a different challenge — it’s fiction.

Out Tuesday, “Keys to the Kingdom” is a political thriller that takes readers on a journey that includes the murder of a former senator, nuclear weapons, a government cover-up and an ominously dangerous Saudi Arabia. POLITICO sat down with Graham, who left the Senate in 2005, to discuss how fictional his book really is.

Tell me about the book’s genesis...

It had several parents. One was anger. I co-chaired the congressional inquiry into Sept. 11, and I came away from that experience feeling there were some important questions for which there were answers, but there had been a cover-up to keep us from getting those answers. And part of this book is to try to provide some — albeit fiction, I think credible — answers to those questions.

Second, I had given a number of commencement addresses, and one of the standard lines was to stay alert and intellectually engaged, you ought to periodically challenge yourself to do something that is different than what you had done before and hard, such as learning a musical instrument or a new foreign language. And when I retired from the Senate in 2005, I thought I ought to eat my own cooking. So I decided that writing a novel would certainly be different, and it turned out to be really hard.

Tell me about the process of writing fiction and what challenges you perhaps hadn’t anticipated. Was it easier than nonfiction?

I’ve written three nonfiction books, and I found them to be easier in the sense that you already have a road map. … In a novel, you’ve got 300 blank pages; you can write whatever you are moved to put on paper. I found it to be a lot of fun writing a novel precisely because … you’ve got to come up with characters that are interesting and are affected by what happens in the book. You want your characters to be a different person at the end of the book, and that’s kind of fun.

Did you just literally sit down and start writing?

I wrote it in spurts, and then there were a couple of long delays. I was chairman of the weapons of mass destruction commission in 2008 and into 2009. I did almost no work on the novel during that period. And then, last year, I was co-chairman of the national oil spill commission, so I took an almost six-month sabbatical from the book. The WMD commission turned out to be very valuable to the novel because the plot is a terrorist group getting access to nuclear bombs, what the group would do with them, how affected they are and what the U.S. does to try to counter that. I did it all on the computer.

There’s a character — Tony Ramos — that you talk about at one point as the Will Smith of the State Department because of how he dresses. Is that based on a real person, and who is that person?

Most of the characters are composites. … Tony is probably the most composite-like. As someone who’s lived most of my life in south Florida, I know a lot of Cuban-Americans, so there are several people I have known who have contributed to this.

Do you feel that this book could only have been written by somebody with the kind of background in government and in your current capacities?

Immodestly, I don’t think there are very many people who could have written this book, because it requires some experiences that are not generally available, some understanding of the way the people in these positions function and some geopolitical understanding of international politics.

Was this enough to inspire you to write a second novel?

The publisher has asked me to write a second book, and if you get to the last chapter, it sort of presages the next book. I told the publisher I want to see how the first book is received before I commit to doing a second. But I hope there will be a second. … It will probably not be on nuclear terrorism, as this is, but on biological terrorism.

You’ve been such a prolific chronicler of your day-to-day activities (Graham has long kept a near-legendary personal diary of his daily life) … and that makes me think that you were an original tweeter, just before tweets existed. What is your take on modern social media and politicians?

I am not a tweeter. I think the difference is I do this for my personal records and it’s also reminders for things I have committed to do or want to do. It is not a public document. I have done about 2,500 of these, most of which, all except the last couple of years, are at a library at the University of Florida, and they will be at some time released to the general public. Now, they’re available on request for academics or for others who are interested. But it was not intended to be a form of communication, which Twitter is. I respect that, and I know a lot of people are interested in following the hour-by-hour activities of Paris Hilton and other prominent people, but that’s not what I’m about.

.

Graham's book still doesn't explain what happened

I read the book.

The given reason for Saudi leadership support for Bin Laden in regard to 9/11? The King was afraid Bin Laden would stir up trouble (i.e foment a rebellion). For some reason we are to believe that Bin Laden had the upper hand. It doesn't make sense.

Graham explains the 9/11 cover up by stating a US private equity firm called Peninsular was trying to conceal collusion (including kickbacks to US players) on a secret nuclear weapons program with the Saudis. Meaning the cover up was about issues unrelated to 9/11. As an explanation for pre-9/11 conduct it doesn't make sense. Granted the book is fiction but one would hope that even in fiction Graham would have put forth a credible explanation as to why US intelligence obstructed al Qaeda investigations.

Thanks for the review.

Thanks for the review.

Saudi Arabia: Friend or Foe?

Saudi Arabia: Friend or Foe?
Jul 11, 2011 12:56 PM EDT
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2011/07/11/saudi-arabia-fried-or-foe-asks-senator-bob-graham.html

Senator Bob Graham asks why hard questions about Saudi Arabia have gone unanswered since 9/11. He explains why he’s finally taken to fiction to explore this controversial topic about what the U.S. is covering up.

On September 12, 2001, Americans learned that 15 of the 19 commercial-airplane hijackers of the previous day were Saudis. The thought that went through many minds was, What are the Saudis thinking? Were these 15 individual suicidal decisions, or does 9/11 represent a break in our mutually beneficial relationship stretching back to World War II?

From that date until today those questions have largely gone unanswered. Unanswered because the government of the United States has engaged in a sustained and effective campaign to keep the American public from knowing the truth. And we may ask: Why?

These are some of the questions that have preoccupied me since co-chairing the congressional inquiry into 9/11. They arose from the truth that surfaced, which included: The first two hijackers who entered the United States did so through Los Angeles International Airport in mid-January 2000. Within days they were urged by a shadowy man, already described in an FBI report as an “agent” of the Saudi government, to relocate to San Diego with promises of extensive support—promises on which he promptly delivered.

The agent’s cover was as a ghost employee of a contractor to an agency of the Saudi government—paid a salary and allowances but never expected to show up and work. His real job was to monitor Saudi youth in San Diego getting an education to ensure they were not also plotting the overthrow of the monarchy.

When the two future hijackers reached San Diego, the agent’s allowances were substantially increased. Upon their arrival the agent secured and paid for an apartment. He arranged flight lessons. He introduced them to a tight circle of Muslims, primarily Saudis, who offered additional support.

Yet the support being funneled to the two visitors proved insufficient for their decidedly non-Islamic tastes—alcohol, strip clubs, even a desired, though unfulfilled, marriage to a stripper. The agent then tapped another source of funds: a welfare account maintained for the benefit of Saudis in need by the wife of the kingdom’s ambassador to the United States.

That is some of what we do know, and we got a sufficient glimpse to know what we didn’t know. Still unanswered after nearly 10 years are the questions of the full extent of the Saudi pre-9/11 involvement: Did any or all of the other 17 receive support from Saudi interests? Why would Saudi Arabia do this? Do the Saudis have the will and capability to aid future attacks against the United States? And most important: Why the cover-up by our government?

I have attempted to address these questions in the final report of the congressional commission and the nonfiction book Intelligence Matters, published in 2004. Each was censored by authorities in the intelligence community, particularly on the role of the Saudis in 9/11. I am now attempting to provide these answers in the form of fact wrapped in fiction in my novel Keys to the Kingdom.

Some have claimed my statements and anxieties are over the top, that there are less incendiary explanations for what the Saudi and U.S. governments have done. But a string of recent occurrences has brought to the surface the suspicion of direct, deep Saudi involvement in 9/11.

Why would the Saudis have given substantial assistance to at least two of the hijackers, and possibly all 19? The answer I have come to is survival—survival of the state and survival of the House of Saud. The Saudi regime in the late 1990s faced the prospect of a repeat of the 1979 Iranian revolution, when young revolutionaries toppled the shah. Osama bin Laden was ascending. He had achieved hero status—in his country of birth, Saudi Arabia, and across much of the Muslim world—for his work with the mujahedin in expelling the Soviets from Afghanistan. He had successfully bombed two U.S. embassies in Africa. He had trained thousands of potential terrorists in his Afghan camps. And he was planning even greater attacks—this time within the United States itself.

But bin Laden recognized a deficiency: Most of those who would be spirited into the United States had never been there before and did not speak English. How could they survive and maintain anonymity while they completed the final planning, practiced and executed an enormously sophisticated attack? The Saudis, who were known to have a global network of agents to monitor their youth against the prospects of another Iran, could provide the support infrastructure to make this possible. The threat of civil unrest against the monarchy, led by al Qaeda, could be the leverage for access to this network.

The Arab Spring has posed a similar threat to the survival of the state and the House of Saud.

There have been at least three responses from the palace.

Beheadings, the traditional means of traumatizing the population into submission, have surged. According to Amnesty International, at least 27 such executions occurred during the first five months of 2011. This was the same number as the total for 2010. Another 100 or more wait on death row.

Religious organizations, many aligned with the austere Wahhabi sect and the religious police, have been allocated an additional $200 million.

The royal treasury, swollen by $214 billion in oil revenues last year, has been opened to essentially buy off the people. Public employees have received an additional two months’ salary; $70 billion has been lavished on 500,000 units of low-income housing.

One of the few reformists in the royal palace, Prince Talal bin Abdul Aziz, brother of King Abdullah, has said, “These people want to preserve their power, their money, and their prestige, so they want to keep the status quo. They are afraid of the word ‘change.’ This is a problem because they are shortsighted, but the difficulty is I don’t know how to change their way of thinking.”

An insight into how far the regime might go in defending and perpetuating the status quo occurred in May of this year at the Vienna meeting of the World Health Organization. Advancing its policy of avoiding the proliferation of weapons of mass destruction, nuclear or biological, the United States offered a resolution that would have required all 193 members of the WHO to either declare they were smallpox-free or—as would be the case with the United States—to commit to the destruction of any smallpox pathogens held in laboratories or elsewhere within five years. Throughout history, smallpox has been a scourge of mankind, and the virus remains the only communicable human disease successfully erased from nature, a miracle of organization and determination. There is only one way it can reappear, and that is in a weaponized form from a nation or group bent on mass catastrophe and worldwide havoc. The results of any dissemination would automatically be classified as a crime against humanity. This resolution to destroy all samples was successfully filibustered by Iran. It is not surprising that a country which for more than a decade has sought to develop a nuclear capability would also be seeking a biological weapon. What was surprising was Saudi Arabia, one of Iran’s staunchest opponents, declaring that it “strongly disagreed” with the United States' position.

Why would the kingdom abandon its most important ally to support a nation that for the past 30-plus years has been considered its archenemy? Could it be that Saudi Arabia is also developing biological weapons?

The most perplexing unanswered question remains: Why would the United States engage in a cover-up? Many have pointed to the special personal friendship between the royal family and the highest levels of our national government. The fact that the Saudis were allowed to fly a planeload of their elite home from the United States in the days immediately after 9/11, when all other commercial aviation was grounded, is often cited as support for that position. In fact, all that actions such as this do is make America’s post-9/11 reaction to the Saudis even more mysterious.

Secrets deemed this critical by both governments are bound to be buried under many layers of official protection and unofficial obfuscation. The actions since 9/11 are a perverted application of Winston Churchill’s truism on the Allies’ plans to end World War II: “In wartime, truth is so precious that she should always be attended by a bodyguard of lies.”

If one method of disclosing precious truth doesn’t work, you try another. I’d always wanted to try my hand at a novel—to place characters of my own invention in challenging and intriguing situations that tested and defined their wits, strength, courage, and moral fiber. Now I had both motivation and material. Having been thwarted in my “real life” efforts to bring out the answers to these questions, which should be among the highest priorities to our citizens, I resorted to fiction, to the imaginative world of “What if?” With the publication of Keys to the Kingdom, I feel I have finally conveyed the reality I’ve pursued for so long.

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Who tried to get word to Senator Graham prior to 9/11?