Overview of New National Zogby Poll on 9/11 Coverup

    
Pie Chart Images of Poll Results

Related Links:
Press Release via Yahoo News
Final Report Details from Zogby
Breakdown of Results - Frequency Distribution
Breakdown of Results - Distribution by Category

So, what does this new report tell us? Well, to find out you really should check out the final report from Zogby linked above.

I found a few things quite interesting and made some smaller web images, the larger images can be found via the thumbnail links at the top - feel free to use these as you wish. The following is a quick graphical review of a few of the questions.


Is there a 9/11 Coverup?

Some people believe that the US government and its 9/11 Commission concealed or refused to investigate critical evidence that contradicts their official explanation of the September 11th attacks, saying there has been a cover-up. Others say that the 9/11 Commission was a bi-partisan group of honest and well-respected people and that there is no reason they would want to cover-up anything. Who are you more likely to agree with?


Should there be a new International or Congressional investigation?

Some people say that so many unanswered questions about 9/11 remain that Congress or an International Tribunal should re-investigate the attacks, including whether any US government officials consciously allowed or helped facilitate their success. Other people say the 9/11 attacks were thoroughly investigated and that any speculation about US government involvement is nonsense. Who are you more likely to agree with?


How do you rate the media's coverage regarding 9/11?

How would you rate the US media's performance regarding 9/11, including their coverage of victim families' unanswered questions, theories that challenged the official account, and how the attacks were investigated?


So, the next time the media marginalizes 9/11 skeptics - remind them that 42% of the American public believe there is a 9/11 coverup, then refer them to the older zogby poll from 2004 which found that "Half of New Yorkers Believe US Leaders Had Foreknowledge of Impending 9-11 Attacks and 'Consciously Failed' To Act", and finally point out that over half of the country thinks they have done a bad job covering 9/11 questions and related issues.

What does this poll do for us? Well, nothing if you don't get out there and pressure the media to cover it. The results of this poll show that over 40% of the American public believe there is an ongoing cover up of 9/11 - if that isn't news then I don't know what is.

Note: These are just a few things I thought stood out, check out the other images and the final report linked above for more detail.

Big thanks to 911truth.org for sponsoring this poll.

Nice dood.

Nice dood.

Yes, this is a really

Yes, this is a really tremendous tool and we must pressure any media within shouting distance. The three I recommed starting with, who have posted a couple decent items in the last year or so, are progressive heavyweight sites buzzflash.org, commondreams.org, and truthout.org.

To contact BuzzFlash: go to site, at bottom click 'about us', use their form to submit a news suggestion.

Commondreams.org: send email to both submissions@commondreams.org and editor@commondreams.org

Truthout.org: send email to both director@truthout.org and editor@truthout.org .

Thanks everyone!

To all looking for Zogby to

To all looking for Zogby to post this- I agree it looks better for Zogby to publish it- everyone who cares please make a contribution to 911truth.org, one of the hardest-working shoestring budget orgs out there, so they can afford Zogby's fee for posting on Zogby's site. The MSM is already expected to try and pan this, just as they did the GAO report on electronic voting- that's the GAO, not some rinky-dink upstart independent pollster, though Zogby's earned their good rep by getting election calls and other things right; this is a completely valid poll. Now we all have to be the media, put this in the face of the alt/MSM media ceaselessly, email it to Congress, and email/tell everyone we know. When they feel pressure coming from the People to deal w/ this, they'll fall into line. The poll is done; Zogby is wasting their own time by not posting the results as a public service, as they'll now have to deal w/ an onslaught of calls/emails for verification- I'm calling them myself tommorrow, for one, to pressure them.

DZ -- good post. We should

DZ -- good post.

We should definitely rub in the MSM's face that the MAJORITY OF AMERICANS think they've done a bad job of covering 9/11.

excellent

excellent

These are excellent DZ.

These are excellent DZ. Great work.

what's zogby's phone number?

what's zogby's phone number?

Excellent, excellent post

Excellent, excellent post DZ!!!!!

Thank You!

Google News - Your search -

Google News -

Your search - zogby 911 - did not match any documents.

Yahoo news search - NEWS

Yahoo news search -

NEWS STORIESResults 1 - 1 of about 1 for zogby 911.

1. Bush Lied About Iraq. - commissioned by OpEdNews

Yahoo news search doesn't even list this.

.

Don't know if you guys saw

Don't know if you guys saw this today, but I liked this grouping of information...

Oil lust
It was a prize that the first oil presidency -- the president, vice president and national security advisor are all former oil execs -- lusted after long before the attacks of 9/11. The Washington Post reported that even as the Bush transition team prepared to take power in 2001, changing Iraq's regime and seizing its oil were already on the table:

Early discussions among the administration's national security "principals" -- Cheney, Powell, Tenet and national security adviser Condoleezza Rice -- and their deputies focused on how to weaken Hussein diplomatically. But Deputy Defense Secretary Wolfowitz proposed sending in the military to seize Iraq's southern oil fields and establish the area as a foothold from which opposition groups could overthrow Hussein.

Former Treasury Secretary Paul O'Neill told author Ron Suskind that Dick Cheney also supported an invasion of Iraq before Sept. 11, and the New Yorker's Jane Mayer reported on a top secret National Security Council document dating back seven months before the terror attacks that gave some insight into the vice president's thinking:

It directed the N.S.C. staff to cooperate fully with [Cheney's secretive] Energy Task Force as it considered the "melding" of two seemingly unrelated areas of policy: "the review of operational policies towards rogue states," such as Iraq, and "actions regarding the capture of new and existing oil and gas fields."

A + B = C A: Former Treasury

A + B = C

A: Former Treasury Secretary Paul O'Neill told author Ron Suskind that Dick Cheney also supported an invasion of Iraq before Sept. 11, and the New Yorker's Jane Mayer reported on a top secret National Security Council document dating back seven months before the terror attacks that gave some insight into the vice president's thinking:

It directed the N.S.C. staff to cooperate fully with [Cheney's secretive] Energy Task Force as it considered the "melding" of two seemingly unrelated areas of policy: "the review of operational policies towards rogue states," such as Iraq, and "actions regarding the capture of new and existing oil and gas fields."

+

B: http://fixco1.com/Mypetgoat.jpg

=

C: Lautenberg, to his enormous credit, has stuck with this story, and issued a report today explaining that the value of Cheney's Halliburton stock options rose in value 3281% in one year.

Of course, there are more examples, but that's as simple as it gets.

And "C" could be so many

And "C" could be so many things... the police state, the bankrupting of America, Hegemony, and on and on and on...

dz, excellent work!

dz, excellent work!

C = Peak Oil

C = Peak Oil

New article by Sheila

New article by Sheila Samples -- who you may recall recently "came out" about 9/11 in a fantastic essay.

Here's her latest, mostly about the insanity of the religious right, but check out these opening paragraphs:

America has lost its way. We are a confused nation, beset on all sides by fear and paranoia. After the orchestrated 9-11 attack on New York City and Washington D.C., and its follow-up anthrax attack on Democratic legislators, Americans of all stripes rushed en masse to George Bush's Fools' Gate to trade their morality and compassion for empty promises of security.

-snip-

How easily we were fooled! Fat, indolent, and full of self-righteous pus, we were ripe for harvest. We are at the mercy of The Decider, who is manipulated from behind the scenes by unelected neo-Straussian thugs lusting for the matrix of a One World Order. They are joined by Christo-fascists soiling themselves at the thought of gaining dominion over the government apparatus and realizing their dream of stoning gays and liberals to death, and by rapacious corporations intent on ransacking the universe until it is stripped of all treasure and resources. Although their agendae differ, this greedy axis shares a single goal -- that of complete power and control -- an area where morality dies aborning. They also share one other critical attribute -- they are aggressively anti-American -- traitors contemptuous of representative democracy who will not rest until every last vestige of it is wiped from the face of the earth.

The war they are waging is on us.

The Beasts Who Would Destroy Us
by Sheila Samples

Zogby

Take Off the 9/11 Tinfoil

South tower hit:

South tower falls:

These might somewhere go

These might somewhere go under Jon's letter 'A';

Cheney: "The good Lord didn't see fit to put oil and gas only where there are democratically elected regimes friendly to the United States. Occasionally we have to operate in places where, all things considered, one would not normally choose to go. But, we go where the business is."
Collateral Damage Conference, Cato Institute June 23, 1998
http://www.cato.org/speeches/sp-dc062398.html

Today, numerous Federal departments and agencies have programs to deal with the consequences of a potential use of a chemical, biological, radiological, or nuclear weapon in the United States. Many of these Federal programs offer training, planning, and assistance to state and local governments. But to maximize their effectiveness, these efforts need to be seamlessly integrated, harmonious, and comprehensive.
Therefore, I have asked Vice President Cheney to oversee the development of a coordinated national effort so that we may do the very best possible job of protecting our people from catastrophic harm.
Domestic Preparedness Against Weapons of Mass Destruction
May 8, 2001
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2001/05/20010508.html

South tower falls as seen

Paul Craig Roberts slips in

Paul Craig Roberts slips in a little 911 Truth at antiwar.com.

http://www.antiwar.com/roberts/?articleid=9019

Absolutely Frank... and ALL

Absolutely Frank... and ALL of the PNAC stuff... and on and on and on and on...

But there's only ONE "B".

But there's only ONE "B".

Off topic - Muffins of mass

WTC 7 is the key! I posted

WTC 7 is the key!

I posted the Zogby info on the IMDB Soapbox forum, along with WTC 7 info, and someone replied:

Add me to that 42 per cent

And also I did not know a 3rd World Trade Bldg collapsed - first I've heard of that. How reliable is that information?

I'm out in the boomdocks with a s l o w computer connection so I don't even try to watch videos on it.

Also.. dz, thanks for putting the piecharts up. Very handy to link to!

One "B", heh! "Patriotic

Stoning gays and

Stoning gays and liberals?

Maybe Sheila Samples needs a hug.

I hate when people try to climb on the wagon with their own baggage.

Zogby

Zogby Contact
http://zogby.com/contact/index.cfm

2 Canadians so far, bet the rest of the world will be real interested in this poll right about now with Iran war drum beat and after Iraq WMD lies, Katrina, PATRIOT Act, warrantless spying, torture, rendition, secret prisons, indefinite detention, concentration camp contracts, the Flu and and still so many unanswered questions, so many holes and lies about 9/11- check out these recent polls also

Worldopinion of U.S. sinking- Dislike of everything American on the rise
Wednesday, May 17, 2006
http://www.nola.com/news/t-p/frontpage/index.ssf?/base/news-5/1147846451...

30-Country Poll Finds Worldwide Consensus That Climate Change is a
Serious Problem.
Concern Growing Sharply- Since Katrina, Americans No Longer See
Unusual Weather as Natural
http://www.worldpublicopinion.org/pipa/articles/btenvironmentra/187.php?...

"with Iran war drum beat and

"with Iran war drum beat and after Iraq WMD lies, Katrina, PATRIOT Act, warrantless spying, torture, rendition, secret prisons, indefinite detention, concentration camp contracts"

So true, Americans are Sheep, This Administration is our shepherd. Is Bush Jesus? or Satan? Does he still communicate with Jesus still? If so, I want to know what Jesus is telling him.

Notice how the media is bringing back the terror? Is it because its a election year? Gas is dropping in cost too, wonder if that will cloud Americans minds this Sept and Nov.

What is really excellent is that it seems Americas thoughts are on Iraq, not abortion or gay rights I hope....

What bothers me is that 14%

What bothers me is that 14% said WTC7 should NOT have been investigated. That is just unbelievable. Add that number to those who didn't even know about the collapse of building 7 and it shows there's still a lot of people totally in the dark about 9/11.

Erik, well.... it *has* been

Erik, well.... it *has* been unusually windy in the NY area the past number of months

At about 1 minute into

At about 1 minute into interview, witness reports water spriklers were working in WTC-1: http://msnbc.com/modules/interactive.asp?fmt=frame&id=n_brokaw_eyewitnes...

Don't you guys think this

Don't you guys think this issue (911 Truth, investigations) would add to the rolls of Democrats who would actually show up and vote Democratic?

I think it would drive people to show up in vote like people do for Gay Marriage Ban initiatives.

My Dkos post tries to present this idea to the "open-minded kos community".

Advanced warning that WTC-7

Advanced warning that WTC-7 was going to implode: http://msnbc.com/modules/interactive.asp?fmt=frame&id=n_banfield_sevenwt...

Radical Pragmatist, I

Radical Pragmatist, I believe that Paul Craig Roberts' latest piece is about as overt as any he's written regarding 9/11. The article isn't about 9/11 per se, but like you said, he certainly slipped in some great lines. Here are the juiciest from the article:

The Bush regime blames bin Laden for 9/11, although the evidence is sketchy and inconclusive. Take a moment to consider the chances of bin Laden, who was fully occupied in his involvement in civil war in Afghanistan, being able to organize a successful attack on high-tech America from a primitive country half a world away. A man in a cave operating on a shoestring somehow defeats the myriad intelligence agencies of the U.S.

and this:

The Republican Party has been reduced to one principle – its own power. It protects the Bush regime from accountability and covers up its lies and misdeeds. Under the myths and lies that enshroud 9/11, the Democrats have collapsed as an opposition party.

Great to see him pushing the envelope further. I know that he's under pressure from his publisher (or whoever he gets his paycheck from) not to go too far.... but, perhaps this is a good sign because they're letting him pretty much say it outright now.

http://www.antiwar.com/roberts/

Anonymous, I didn't see

Anonymous, I didn't see "baggage" in Sheila Samples' article. I suggest you read it in its entirety. She's pointing out the insanity, the hypocrisy, and the brutality of the religious right. You don't actually take issue with her contention that there are far-righters who would stone gays and lesbians, among others, do you?

Off subject...

Off subject... but...

Remember when Alex Jones said a while back that some "beloved" musician would be coming out soon? I just heard on Showbiz Tonight that her new tour, which kicked off in LA today, has a video montage of pictures of George Bush, Dick Cheney, Tony Blair, Osama Bin Laden, etc, alongside pictures of Adolf Hitler!

Could this be that "beloved musician" Alex was referring to?

I could be completely wrong...

Whoops - totally left out

Whoops - totally left out who that musicin is...

haha..

Madonna

Bush is nothing but a cheap

Bush is nothing but a cheap gangster, running a protection racket. The polls now show that the public is waking up to this fact. It's about time. I had this thug pegged years ago. What a punk.

I had him pegged the day he

I had him pegged the day he was elected. Little did I know that his destructiveness was necessary for the world to be set free.

Last video clip for tonight.

Last video clip for tonight. What are the "white-hot-looking" spots on the North tower? http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7431174701830641882&q=9%2F11+wtc

According to the FBI's ten

According to the FBI's ten most wanted fugitive list http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/topten/fugitives/laden.htm, Usama Bin Laden isn't even wanted specifically for 911. Strange...

article on zogby poll just

Well Madonna said she doesnt

Well Madonna said she doesnt think theres conclusive evidence 9/11 was an inside job, last year in rolling Stone magazine. I wonder what Neil Young and Pearl Jam have to say about 9/11?

Oh, and the real puppet master of the US was in my city of Sacramento today, Dick Cheney.

Look what the NoBeliefs.Com

Look what the NoBeliefs.Com has to say about 911 conspiracy theories.. he needs to be word smacked.

http://nobeliefs.com/comments8.htm

NoBeliefs, I was just

NoBeliefs,

I was just watching "9/11 The Fall of the World Trade Center" that the nobeliefs.com writer cited. What I find interesting is the clip of the journalist who was at the base of the towers doing a report right as the 1st building collapsed was edited. They cut the audio of him yelling, "A huge explosion with raining debris on all of us, WE BETTER GET OUT OF THE WAY!!!"

It also stated that it took

It also stated that it took 30 seconds for the south tower to collapse.

You know when "debunkers"

You know when "debunkers" cite the popular mechanics article they have absolutely no credibility what so ever.

Another thing I noticed is

Another thing I noticed is the lack of video footage used. Most of their arguements were supported by "theororetical" computer animations of truss failure and fireproofing being blown off. In no way did they back these claims up with proof. Almost got me!

Andy, Did I read a post by

Andy,

Did I read a post by you awhile back that said you sent a letter of something to our Mayor?

World Net Daily's posted an

World Net Daily's posted an article on the poll, 1st US source?

DAY OF INFAMY 2001
9-11 truth: Is it still out there?
Zogby poll shows 70% want new investigation
Posted: May 23, 2006
1:00 a.m. Eastern
http://worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=50336

These latest polls are a

These latest polls are a good sign. When I became a 9/11 truther about two years ago I think about 95% would have believed the "Official Story" and about 5% would have believed there was a cover-up. So we have made good progress the last few years but there is still much work to be done. I also believe no matter what happens Bush and his boys won't go down easy. They may have to be taken out, if you know what I mean. I hope not but it's best to be prepared. I listened to Randi Rhodes on the way to work this afternoon. She was talking about detention camps being built around the country and she sounded scared. I guess Bush is building these camps to house "terrorists" when he catches them. Just a word to the wise.

Democratic gatekeeper sites

Democratic gatekeeper sites will now most likely be forced to deal with 9/11. However; this is most uncomfortable for them since they will be pointing attention to democratic congresspersons who have been covering up the affair along with their republican colleagues. Frankly I believe most of that lot deserves in due course to be executed for treason. So; it'll be very awkward.

But this poll is monumental. Especially in the light that the mass media has been ignoring 9/11 for the most part but otherwise busy covering it up with congress and the administration.

These are very serious times.

This ugly mess overhangs everything and creates nagging uncertainty. What will cornered rats do? Will they stage another show to divert attention from their 911 flop? Will they need WW3 for that. When self- preservation becomes the main driving force anything can happen.

WTC 7 is the key. 43% were

WTC 7 is the key. 43% were unaware that it had collapsed. A simple strategy is to ask someone, were they aware it had collapsed, that it was never hit by a plane, that it was never investigated by the commission etc etc. If these simple facts alone do not get someone to question the events of that day, then they simply do not want to know. However, I believe most people when faced with these facts would be compelled to find out more, and the more people exposed to the truth then the stronger the movement will be. Ok, back to lurking!

Former Pilot Says 'Jet

Former Pilot Says 'Jet Blast' Dismissal Doesn't Fly

Contradicts facts of previous story about Flight 77 knocking cars off Pentagon highway

Paul Joseph Watson/Prison Planet.com | May 23 2006

Following the publication of our article questioning claims that wake turbulence or jet blast could have thrown cars around the highway as Flight 77 approached the Pentagon at a reported altitude of 20 feet, a former pilot and aeronautical engineer contacted us to refute the arguments presented in the piece.

It is our intention to explore both sides of the argument and leave the reader to decide for themselves if the Pentagon Flight 77 issue is a genuine smoking gun of 9/11 or an attempt by the government to bait us into a honey pot trap by later releasing crystal clear footage of Flight 77 hitting the Pentagon. At no turn do we doubt the validity of the overwhelming body of evidence proving 9/11 as an inside job. The 9/11 truth movement is currently enjoying its widest exposure ever, and a new Zogby poll which shows half of Americans nationwide (not just New York) want a new independent investigation into 9/11 is proof that this issue is evergreen and growing in popularity.

The pilot, who wishes to remain anonymous, stated that the photos carried showing planes coming in to land at St. Maarten-Princess Juliana Int'l Airport in the Netherlands, and the apparent lack of wake turbulence or jet blast as a result of their low altitude over people on a beach, were misleading. The photos depict slow moving planes at speeds of no more than 100 knots, not 400 knots as reported with Flight 77.

He said that it was key to point out the difference between jet blast and wake turbulence. Wake turbulence is defined as a ,"turbulent air condition caused by small, tornado-like horizontal whirlwinds training an aircraft's wingtips (wingtip vortices)." In contrast, jet blast is described as, "phenomena resulting from the passage of an aircraft through the atmosphere. The term includes vortices, thrust stream turbulence, jet blast, jet wash, propeller wash, and rotor wash both on the ground and in the air."
While the Boeing website points out that the direction of the entire envelope of wake turbulence can be directed upwards, sideways or downwards depending on wind conditions, no such deviation is possible with jet blast and that the sheer force of power from the jet blast of a plane traveling at 530 miles per hour would not have been altered whatsoever by wind patterns.

Therefore the pilot states unequivocally that jet blast would have tossed people and cars around like rag dolls if they were 20 feet or less below a Boeing 757, as is claimed by eyewitness reports.

Regarding the eyewitness report of Pentagon renovation worker and retired Army officer Frank Probst, who claimed that the plane flew so low past him that the engine was six feet away, our source exclaimed that this was a ridiculous impossibility.

The pilot said that Probst would have been sucked into the engine like a bird in a giant vacuum and that he had personally been in the cockpit and seen birds from 100 feet away that almost immediately get sucked into the engines.

Similar devastation would have been wrought on cars 20 feet below the plane according to the pilot, contradicting eyewitness reports describing only light shaking of vehicles.

The pilot also entertained the notion that eyewitnesses had grossly overestimated the altitude of the plane and that it was higher than the reported 20 feet but he was still adamant that those who claimed to have seen the faces of the passengers in the window were living in a fantasy land because the speed of the plane would have meant it appeared as a blur and akin to a bullet flying over their heads.

Our source, having had direct and extensive personal flying experience at low altitudes, also completely dismissed the feasibility that a Boeing 757 could be flown for any significant distance at just 20 feet above ground. He also cited other pilots of large commercial aircraft who concurred.

A phenomenon called 'ground effect' describes the energized cushion of air between the wings and the ground which increases in energy the faster the plane flies. Flight 77 is reported to have whisked up the highway and into the Pentagon at breakneck acceleration, even increasing in speed before it hit, a maneuver described as impossible by the pilot at 20 feet above the ground, due to the reaction of the energized ground effect layer which would simply not have allowed it, even if the pilot was furiously pulling back the throttle which was not the case.

The pilot and aeronautical expert said that the evidence suggests a Global Hawk was used to attack the Pentagon, citing alleged Flight 77 pilot Hani Hanjour's complete lack of flight skills and the incredulous story that he and four other conspirators overpowered two burly 185lbs aircraft veterans and pulled off military class flight maneuvers to attack what was virtually an invisible target.

Despite this, the pilot, who first approached Flight 77 questions in an effort to disprove them, was adamant that the government would soon release a "fantastic clear shot of Flight 77 coming in and close the book." He points out that modern technology and computer generated graphics can accurately forge any event and make it appear completely seamless and fears the entire Pentagon issue is a trap to distract researchers and eventually will be used to discredit the entire 9/11 truth movement.

Our source pleads with people to focus on the real hardcore smoking guns of 9/11, in particular the unexplained collapse of Building 7 and clear evidence that the twin towers were brought down by a controlled demolition. As an experienced aeronautical engineer, the pilot was stunned that he too bought the official version of events at first glance and believed that a giant modern day steel building could completely collapse from limited fire damage. Our source is now working behind the scenes to aid others in the 9/11 truth movement help educate the world on the reality behind the monumental scam perpetrated on September 11 2001.

I had trouble believing the

I had trouble believing the quotes from fire engineering magazine about 911. I went to the magazine and looked up the article. Here are direct quotes from the article.

Fair Lawn, NJ, January 4, 2002-Bill Manning, Fire Engineering's editor in chief, is summoning members of the fire service to "A Call to Action." In his January 2002 Editor's Opinion, "$elling Out the Investigation" (below), he warns that unless there is a full-blown investigation by an independent panel established solely for that purpose, "the World Trade Center fire and collapse will amount to paper- and computer-generated hypotheticals." Manning explained: "Clearly, there are burning questions that need answers ..... The lessons about the buildings' design and behavior in this extraordinary event must be learned and applied in the real world." . . .

No. Fire Engineering has good reason to believe that the "official investigation" blessed by FEMA and run by the American Society of Civil Engineers is a half-baked farce that may already have been commandeered by political forces whose primary interests, to put it mildly, lie far afield of full disclosure. Except for the marginal benefit obtained from a three-day, visual walk-through of evidence sites conducted by ASCE investigation committee members- described by one close source as a "tourist trip"-no one's checking the evidence for anything. . . .

However, respected members of the fire protection engineering community are beginning to raise red flags, and a resonating theory has emerged: The structural damage from the planes and the explosive ignition of jet fuel in themselves were not enough to bring down the towers.

You have to register to see it.

http://fe.pennnet.com/articles/article_display.cfm?Section=ARCHI&C=FYI&A...

Yes, it certainly makes

Yes, it certainly makes sense to focus on the nonsensical official fable regarding the collpase of the towers and WTC-7. But nothing will really get any traction unless the mass media, diverse gatekeppers and the congress are forced to deal with the issue in an intelligent manner. However; it's a little difficult for these entities since they've ignored it and and covered it up for all these years !

Just to let you know how the

Just to let you know how the MSM response to the new Zogby poll could look alike.

I just reviewed the response from the german 911 truth attackers back in 2003.
You may know that we have a similar poll, done by forsa, which provides that 19 % of overall population believes that the US government orchestrated 911.
And even 31 % of the under 30 ages believe this.

So, this was back in 2003, back when truth spreading books and films are rare but nonetheless bestsellers.

Hans Leyendecker, the main suspect for the Simon-Wiesenthal 911 trial remembrance list, felt forced to take a look on this. In his column from 9/10/03, “Apes of fear”, published in the german “Sueddeutsche Zeitung”, he asks: Are 19 % of our population crazy?
He didnÂ’t answer his question, but surely implies that he did think so.
He and others called it a “sociological phenomenon”, be prepared that this will pop up now in the US, too.

He further provides examples that the brain of the crazies suffer from pictures we already seen on tv or in video games. Who can distuinguish between the truth and fiction?
And to make our world-view much better fitting our brain plays tricks on us by providing “simple” explanations for complex structures, aka conspiracy theories.

Then he attacks the 911 truthers personally with the whole list everybodyÂ’s aware off today, plus he mixed-up some loony conspiracy theories.

Zogby

Agree with your comments

Agree with your comments gangster, but its just my way of getting more people on board here in the UK.

Worldnetdaily poll: Do you

Worldnetdaily poll: Do you support a new, independent probe of 9-11?

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/polls/

.

Lurker, just keep up the

Lurker, just keep up the good work.

As I was saying, these poll results are monumental especially in the light that the mass media has totally ignored the issue and covered for the official fable. Once that mass media is forced to deal with 911 in an intelligent manner it should soon be 80%-20% against the official nonsense since it holds no water whatsoever.

It's amazing really how much the 911 truth movement has achieved and this is major blow for the US mass media. Will they learn from it? We´ll see.

Like Sitting-Bull mention up

Like Sitting-Bull mention up there, I think spin doctors are already working on the results of that Zogby poll.

And I don't want to be pessimist, but since the Internet is that what help the mouvement to be where it is now, I wouldn't be surprise that Internet become soon a "National Security Threat" and that "Terrorist are likely to use Internet to attack important..." you see. Neocon have HUGE power and they certainly want us to shut up. Control over the web has already started. Just my 2c.

"5/22/2006 Dear Congressman

"5/22/2006

Dear Congressman Weldon,

I understand that Mr. Jon Gold is to meet with your office today. Mr. Gold was recently featured in a news article here: http://www.timesherald.com/site/index.cfm?newsid=16670601&BRD=1672&PAG=4...

While I think it is useful for you to meet with Mr. Gold, it is not for what he believes. Rather, it is to learn the extent to which some people are willing to overturn facts and evidence, to look away from the horrible events of 9/11, and to construct vast and unfounded conspiracy theories. For whatever reason they pursue these lines of irrational thinking, whether through ignorance or for political motives, it is important to remember that Mr. Gold represents a small minority of people unwilling to deal with factual evidence. Mr. Gold will impress you with his sincerity and conviction and may even claim, as he has publicly, that he knows the "truth", all of the truth about 9/11. I am sure it will be quite clear to you during your meeting that his version of the "truth" is somewhat confused, contradictory, and misguided.

Sincerely,

S. King"

Try hard not to laugh. This is a real letter that S. King wrote to Representative Weldon, as a way to counter Jon Gold. S. King has lost it, and apparently doesn't realize how foolish he sounds. In the process, he gives credence to what Mr. Gold has to say.

It's funny that he feels that smearing others is what makes you "American." He must have loved all the "American" mud slinging going on during the 2004 elections. Look, he really said it:

"As a true American, I have every right to express my views about those who do not have a clue what they are talking about." (Emphasis added for comic relief).

Or maybe he just thinks it's "American"

This is priceless. Kudos to

This is priceless. Kudos to all that made this possible.

_________________________---

_________________________---
http://flight77.info/

UPDATE 5/21/6

today i received the CD from the DOJ. you can see the letter that came with the CD to the right.

the CD contains two .mpg files ~33 megs each. if you're someone who is doing analysis on these videos, please email me (bronco-at-flight77.info) and i will send you the URL where you can download them to your desktop.

_________________________---

Guess what folks. According

Guess what folks. According to S. King, there are only one of two possibilities for why we object to the Official account:

1) You are ignorant; or

2) You are politically motivated.

Which is it? He fails to mention the 3rd alternative:

3) The "facts" don't add up and you don't feel that they present a closed case.

Note: the last option does not imply ignorance, although I'm sure there are many ignorant people on both sides of the fence, just as there are many intelligent people on both sides of the fence.

S. King demeans the whole point of his letter by not presenting the third option. He rather comes off as narrow-minded, and obsessively obstinate.

"Once that mass media is

"Once that mass media is forced to deal with 911 in an intelligent manner it should soon be 80%-20% against the official nonsense since it holds no water whatsoever."

I bet it already is, since the poll was given prior to the release of the all-so-conclusive Pentagon video.

Crisis shortage poses crisis

John Bolton Described As,

Take Off the 9/11 Tinfoil

Take Off the 9/11 Tinfoil Hats

http://www.americanthinker.com/ a...article_id=5488

.
Truth for a Change | 05.22.06 - 10:38 pm | #
the guy who wrote that is a royal douchebag.

From the commission, page

From the commission, page 44:

Sept. 13, 2001. A “Kingdom of Saudi Arabia Student Identity Card” was found in the rubble at the
Pentagon with MoqedÂ’s name on it. Forensic examination indicated that it may have been fraudulent.
United States Secret Service Forensic Services report for the FBI PENTTBOM investigation regarding the
physical examination of forensic science research request, Oct. 10, 2001. Hijackers Omari, Wail al Shehri
and Hanjour also had international driver licenses and Jarrah had an international student identification
card.

http://www.9-11commission.gov/staff_statements/911_TerrTrav_Ch2.pdf

S. King/Truthout, whatever

S. King/Truthout, whatever his name is... that is too funny, and shows his desperation, and fear.

Truth for a Change... Paul

Truth for a Change... Paul Thompson found that a while back...

Watch this video: Jet Blast:

Here's a good one. I was

Here's a good one. I was watching the local New York City NBC news this morning, and their "roving reporter" was covering the opening ceremonies for the new WTC 7. Somewhere in her intro, she says "the original building, which took 4 years to complete and 10 seconds to collapse..." Sometimes you have to wonder, are they slipping things in subliminally, or are they just so clueless as to not even know what they are saying?

Former Pilot Says 'Jet

Former Pilot Says 'Jet Blast' Dismissal Doesn't Fly
Contradicts facts of previous story about Flight 77 knocking cars off Pentagon highway

Paul Joseph Watson/Prison Planet.com | May 23 2006

Following the publication of our article questioning claims that wake turbulence or jet blast could have thrown cars around the highway as Flight 77 approached the Pentagon at a reported altitude of 20 feet, a former pilot and aeronautical engineer contacted us to refute the arguments presented in the piece.

It is our intention to explore both sides of the argument and leave the reader to decide for themselves if the Pentagon Flight 77 issue is a genuine smoking gun of 9/11 or an attempt by the government to bait us into a honey pot trap by later releasing crystal clear footage of Flight 77 hitting the Pentagon. At no turn do we doubt the validity of the overwhelming body of evidence proving 9/11 as an inside job. The 9/11 truth movement is currently enjoying its widest exposure ever, and a new Zogby poll which shows half of Americans nationwide (not just New York) want a new independent investigation into 9/11 is proof that this issue is evergreen and growing in popularity.

The pilot, who wishes to remain anonymous, stated that the photos carried showing planes coming in to land at St. Maarten-Princess Juliana Int'l Airport in the Netherlands, and the apparent lack of wake turbulence or jet blast as a result of their low altitude over people on a beach, were misleading. The photos depict slow moving planes at speeds of no more than 100 knots, not 400 knots as reported with Flight 77.

He said that it was key to point out the difference between jet blast and wake turbulence. Wake turbulence is defined as a ,"turbulent air condition caused by small, tornado-like horizontal whirlwinds training an aircraft's wingtips (wingtip vortices)." In contrast, jet blast is described as, "phenomena resulting from the passage of an aircraft through the atmosphere. The term includes vortices, thrust stream turbulence, jet blast, jet wash, propeller wash, and rotor wash both on the ground and in the air."

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/may2006/230506doesntfly.htm

i gotta give Alex Jones

i gotta give Alex Jones credit for giving both sides of the Flight 77/Pentagon debate equal space.

Here's an interesting video

Here's an interesting video of an airliner approach going 100 kph. They speeded it up four times to get to 400 kph. But I thought that flight 77 was travelling 500 mph. Is that right? If so, 500 mph equals 800 kph, so the simulation is only going half as fast as it should be.

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/may2006/230506actuallyseen.htm

Did you guys see this update

Did you guys see this update at flight77.info?
--
UPDATE 5/17/6

here is the reason behind the timing, and the reason why the DOJ released the latest video (and is withholding the other 84): in our original FOIA request we asked for recordings of the IMPACT of flight 77. the DOJ replied that they had only 1 video responsive to our original request and that was the video they just released; the only recording of the impact. they released this video now due to the may 26th deadline our judge gave to the DOJ. it had nothing to do with any outstanding action by judicial watch. (judicial watch's FOIA lawsuit was filed a full year after we filed our suit. it was a piggie-back lawsuit in anticipation of the resolution of our lawsuit - intended to gain media attention.)

the only reason the other 84 recordings are being withheld is because we were too specific with the term impact in our original FOIA. the other recordings simply don't show the impact. it's not a conspiracy thing as judicial watch is suggesting. it was our lawsuit that revealed the other recordings, and now to get them we have a second FOIA request.

i was listening to an interview with the head of judicial watch and the guy is bewildered why the other recordings haven't been released. he doesn't know why because he hasn't read the full documentation on which he's piggie-backing. instead he's making it sound like a deeper conspiracy.

if judicial watch didn't fling their legs open to the media wearing a dress of limited understanding of what was being released and why - we would have been able to explain these details to everyone in the beginning.
--
It appears Judicial Watch is taking credit for the release of the videos to get the media attention, and in the process are also confusing the issue.

Truth for a change, yes the

Truth for a change, yes the official story claims that the 757 hit the wall of the pentagon at approximately 530 mph. However; this is so surrealistically nonsensical that most people hesitate to even quote it. :)

Of course they needed to

Of course they needed to overhype the speed to sell that desperate story about the evaporated wreckage and all that. You know; extremely high speed, tremendous explosion, plane turned into a liquid column, bla bla bla. You can check this bunk at Purdue University. Some jokers there got a grant to cook it up. :)

"Anonymous, I didn't see

"Anonymous, I didn't see "baggage" in Sheila Samples' article. I suggest you read it in its entirety. She's pointing out the insanity, the hypocrisy, and the brutality of the religious right. You don't actually take issue with her contention that there are far-righters who would stone gays and lesbians, among others, do you?"

You don't see baggage because it's an issue you believe in or support in some way. There are lots and lots of people who are quite serious about 911 who do not support gay marriage, for example, or happen to be conservatives, or Christians. We can be those things without bringing our agenda to the table on this issue, so I wonder why it is others with their own agandas can't simply check them at the door. 911 isn't about gay marriage. It isn't about transgender issues. 911 isn't about fundamentalism, be it Islamic or Christian. Accusing Christians of wanting to stone gays to death is about as cogent and relevant as Bush's claims that they want to kill us for our freedom- it's a joke and it's offensive to those of us who happen to be traditional, conservative and Christian and at the same time adamantly opposed to the 911 crime and subsequent coverup.

It's divisive and it's just as mean spirited and nasty as when the current regime hypes the barbarism of Islamofascists.

Cut it out already and protest that particular interest in the forum where it belongs, not here where it creates yet more division.

Hey Jon, Any news on the Raw

Hey Jon,

Any news on the Raw Story article you mentioned yesterday?

Actually, the more I think

Actually, the more I think about how Judicial Watch piggy-backed flight77.info's FOIA lawsuit, the more sinister it seems.

Instead of the media talking to a 9/11-Truth related organization about the release of the videos, they instead focused the attention on Judicial Watch, with all the completely bogus angles of "attempting to finally put to rest the conspiracy theories" and such.

All lies.

Here's Penn and teller's hit

Here's Penn and teller's hit piece on 911 truth:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=syEFbdYKl9s&search=penn%20teller%20911

They edited the first minute or so off it, I guess because it reports that 43 percent of Americans don't believe the commission.

Here's my email to penn and teller in response:

Berlin January 20, 1942 - - According to a poll, ten percent of the people in Berlin believe that the German leaders are killing millions of communists, homosexuals, Catholics and Jews. Lots of people actually believe that the Polish attacks on Germany were a lie and were created for a reason to invade our enemy, Poland. And that the Reichstag fire wasnÂ’t started by Marinus van der Lubbe, but by Hitler or by Herman Goering or maybe even Santa Claus. Are ten percent of us just fucking crazy?
“People are fundamentally sceptical. People don’t trust the explanations they have. My name is Herr Herman Von Claus, and I’m chair of the political science department of the University of Berlin. This mistrust of an official explanation motivates them to go looking further and then they want to keep going and keep going and find out what they think could be a more convincing explanation.
Being skeptical is good but looking at the Reichstag fire and having your first thoughts be this is a hoax staged by the Government takes a special kind of asshole.
“Nobody can convince me that the German Government isn’t killing millions of jews one by one by gassing them in ovens.”
Nobody can convince me? Bells should go off in your head when you hear those words. ThatÂ’s his bullshit ideas of skepticism. A real skeptic demands to be convinced with evidence. We should be skeptical of the Government, but we shouldnÂ’t just make shit up. We hate showing you these photos of the Reichstag fire, and we should never have to see this again. But itÂ’s important to nip this bullshit paranoid fantasy before it takes root in the national conscience Fritz Lang makes a shitty movie about it.
If anybody knows that the Reichstag theories are bullshit, itÂ’s this guy, its Wilhelm Conrad, retired fire chief of the closest fire station near the Reichstag fire. And he was there at the fire and had many friends injured fighting the fire.
“On February 27th it was a beautiful day, I was at home and a friend came in and told me to go look outside. I said why and he said just go outside and take a look. And I went outside and saw what all good Germans saw over the next few days. So I immediately went to the fire station and gathered up the men to fight the fire. Everywhere there was smoke and fire. And before the fire was out kooky conspiracy theorists were already rising from the ashes.
“I don’t think that the Reichstag fire was what the German government said. There was a fire, the building was destroyed, but it’s not as the government tells us. I am Henrich Gerbils, I am a soft cloth manufacturer,”
And developers of one of the softest piles of steaming bullshit in the history of paranoia. He wrote a book, Painful Questions, An analysis of the holocaust. I show you the cover, because if you ever see anyone carrying it, push them down a flight of stairs.
“In a nutshell what is happening is that some people in the German government fooled a lot of people and are killing millions of Jews in ovens and faked it by saying they were showers.”
So this bullshit holocaust theory is a fake theory, cooked up by a different real conspiracy. Okay, whatÂ’s your proof?
“I don’t know, somehow the Germans military built ovens and they put people in them and killed them.”
Wow, did you do that hard hitting data research in your ass?
“I find it unbelievable that anyone in out wonderful government could have such a heinous and evil plot to strike their own people.
“I’m Shimon Yisrael a patriot fight the real terrorists behind the holocaust,”
And then thereÂ’s this asshole. Man thatÂ’s way too soft. Let me try that again. AND THEN THEREÂ’S THIS ASSHOLE!
“All I know is that there are eyewitnesses that saw Jews being killed by the German military. That the showers weren’t showers and were really ovens and gas chambers.
Little Shimon has the money and resources to purchase a full page ad in the Berlin Gazette. What do you want to bet he inherited the money? WhatÂ’s your evidence Mr. Yisrael?
“The evidence we have indicates that the people going to be relocated are really going to concentration camps and killed.”
And do anybody that says that live anywhere but little Shimon Yisrael world?
“I firmly believe that the murderers of the Jews are the German military. And the people said to be relocated are indeed dead.”
FUCK YOU! We really hope this fuck up runs into some true patriotic brown shirts most of them might not take kindly that they are being accused of murder.
“In the concentration camps there are rooms where they gas Jews. We actually see the ovens where they did the killings.”
Okay.
“Conspiracy theorists take disparate facts and put them together. And what makes a Conspiracy theorist a little bit different is that they put the facts together in alternative ways that tend to be a bit paranoid.
Shimon seemed like a nice follow, nice yamica and all. But he took us outside to show us his fancy car and jumpsuit. And sometimes you should judge a book by its cover.
“Reporting not for duty sir.” MUSIC STING
This is Franz Helmrick, HeÂ’s a fire captain and he knows about these conspiracies.
“There were no ovens there were no dead bodies, What really happened is that these people died of natural causes. When you have people living in the middle of a war where food is scarce and bombs are dropping all the time, some people are gonna die. Plus disease and infections and accidents.”
“Unfortunately This was a bad situation people died.
And that something that we should never forget, but for these holocaust theory nutjobs, itÂ’s just entertainment. They are whacking the good name of our wonderful government.
“But there are the bodies.”
“But there are the ovens.”
“There is the sarin gas.”
“There are all the witnesses”
“I think the conspiracy theories like that are an insult to the valiant patriotic people that have lost their lives in our glorious war against our enemies.”
But how do these ideas, ideas with no basis in fact, keep popping up?
“People hate thinking about the possibility that their government could be bad guys. They would rather think that their government is the fairy god mother or Santa Claus. How dare them say bad things about the best government in the world.”
IsnÂ’t the very real war against the enemies of Germany, the Evil countries bent of world domination and the tragic unavoidable deaths of a few workers enough to make the theorists happy? The evil countries like America and Britain dropping bombs on poor defenseless Germans and well paid worker. DonÂ’t the conspiracy nuts realize that something simple and easy to see as our enemies, who conspired to drop bombs and who are willing to attack the freedoms and greatness of the beautiful Third Reich, the greatest country on Earth, who are willing to kill many Germans and destroy our economy. DonÂ’t they see how our enemies so evil and mean, destroy something so beautiful?

They interview a guy that wrote for fire engineering magazine to support their position. I sent this in an email also:

Fair Lawn, NJ, January 4, 2002-Bill Manning, Fire Engineering's editor in chief, is summoning members of the fire service to "A Call to Action." In his January 2002 Editor's Opinion, "$elling Out the Investigation" (below), he warns that unless there is a full-blown investigation by an independent panel established solely for that purpose, "the World Trade Center fire and collapse will amount to paper- and computer-generated hypotheticals." Manning explained: "Clearly, there are burning questions that need answers ..... The lessons about the buildings' design and behavior in this extraordinary event must be learned and applied in the real world." . . .

No. Fire Engineering has good reason to believe that the "official investigation" blessed by FEMA and run by the American Society of Civil Engineers is a half-baked farce that may already have been commandeered by political forces whose primary interests, to put it mildly, lie far afield of full disclosure. Except for the marginal benefit obtained from a three-day, visual walk-through of evidence sites conducted by ASCE investigation committee members- described by one close source as a "tourist trip"-no one's checking the evidence for anything. . . .

However, respected members of the fire protection engineering community are beginning to raise red flags, and a resonating theory has emerged: The structural damage from the planes and the explosive ignition of jet fuel in themselves were not enough to bring down the towers.

sorry for the length.

"Hey Jon, Any news on the

"Hey Jon,

Any news on the Raw Story article you mentioned yesterday?"

I've been looking for it. John Byrne said he was going to run a story... that's all I know... I do know that it won't incorporate their review of EGLS because Larisa is sick.

I posted the following

I posted the following comment at "Crooks & Liars" this morning, and, as expected, it was deleted almost immediately:
_____
"Hey, site owner, John. You must really be annoyed (and I would hope a little humbled) by the results of the new Zogby poll regarding a certain day in 2001.

"Zogby Poll: Over 70 Million American Adults Support New 9/11 Investigation"

"Are you ready to stop insulting the intelligence of almost half of your readers? -- 05.23.06 - 8:45 am
_____
Obviously, neither he nor his site monitor are in the least phased by the strongly held opinion(s) of at least half of their readership.

I also emailed the Zogby results and link to six TV stations and seven newspapers in a three-state region here on the western/midwestern plains. I'm not holding my breath that they will even pay attention, much less report the findings, but at least I tried.

Larisa was the one who

Larisa was the one who attended the premiere of EGSL at the Tribeca.

EGLS

EGLS

Jon Gold,You are a 911

Jon Gold,You are a 911 Bogger folk hero.Good work!(and cool picture)

"Jon Gold,You are a 911

"Jon Gold,You are a 911 Bogger folk hero.Good work!(and cool picture)"

Actually.. I'm just a "Joe Schmoe American" who think murdering 3000 people is wrong. How many of us here share that sentiment? Everyone who makes an honest effort to educate people is a "Folk Hero".

Thanks.

Half of America questions

Half of America questions the official account. That is ONLY possible because of the 9/11 Truth Movement's actions. No one person made that happen...

Everyone deserves a pat on the back.

Imagine how big that number

Imagine how big that number would be if the Fourth Estate actually did their job.

"Tonight at 11... She was

"Tonight at 11... She was offered a promotion to keep her mouth shut. She was fired for Whistle-blowing. She is the most gagged person in American History. She says, "The American People Don't Know The Real Culprits Behind 9/11". Her name is Sibel Edmonds, and tonight she is our TOP STORY."

Imagine if that happened.

I used to love penn and

I used to love penn and teller ... they had some great shit on pseudo science, impactology, alternative medicine, etc. But lets also not forget SciAM's hit piece by editor of Skeptical Inquirer, Michael Shermer.

Here is a nice quote of Penn:

When you see someone with this book, 'Push them down a flight of stairs...'
what a motherfucker.

penn and teller are dicks.

mmmmmmmmmmmmmm pie charts.

mmmmmmmmmmmmmm pie charts.

Check out

Check out rawstory...

"Nearly half of Americans want new 9/11 probe... Developing..."

http://www.globalresearch.ca/

I got this great reply in my

I got this great reply in my Randi Rhodes thread on that board:

Well, chalk it all up to coincidence:

For those who buy the story, the argument for coincidence.

That intelligence agencies, politicians and terrorists have conducted criminal business together is well established, but BCCI and Iran/Contra were a long time ago, so thereÂ’s no need to rehash all that.

That Jonathan BushÂ’s Riggs Bank has been found guilty of laundering terrorist funds and fined a record setting $25 million is embarrassing, surely, but to draw sinister conclusions is foolish.

That Marvin Bush sat on the board of the Kuwaiti-owned company which provided electronic security to the World Trade Centre, Dulles Airport and United Airlines means nothing.

That George Bush found success as a businessman only after the investment of OsamaÂ’s brother Salem and OsamaÂ’s brother-in-law and al Qaeda financier Khalid bin Mahfouz is just a one-in-a-million fluke.

That Osama bin Laden is known to have been an asset of US foreign policy in no way implies he still is. That al Qaeda was active in Kosovo on the same side as NATO merely demonstrates that nothing is black and white.

The claims of Michael Springman, State Department veteran of the Jeddah visa bureau, that the CIA ran the office and issued visas to al Qaeda members to receive training in the United States, are merely sour grapes because he was fired for making such wild accusations.

That so many in the Bush White House had expressed the need for a "new Pearl Harbor" before their militarist ambitions could be fulfilled means nothing more than being in the right place at the right time.

That in May of 2001, Dick Cheney took upon himself the job of co-ordinating a response to domestic terror attacks even as he was crafting the administration’s energy policy, circumventing the established infrastructure and ignoring the recommendations of the Hart-Rudman report, merely shows the VP to be a “can do” sort of guy.

That the standing order for shooting down hijacked aircraft was altered on June 1, 2001, taking discretion away from field commanders and placing it solely in the hands of the Secretary of Defense, is simply poor planning and unfortunate timing. Fortunately the error has been corrected, since the order was reversed shortly after 9/11.

That Dave Frasca of the FBIÂ’s Radical Fundamentalist Unit received a promotion after quashing multiple, urgent requests for investigations into al Qaeda assets training at flight schools in the summer of 2001 does appear odd, but IÂ’m sure there must have been a good reason for it.

That over the summer of 2001 Washington received many urgent, senior-level warnings from foreign intelligence agencies of impending terror attacks using hijacked aircraft and did nothing, demonstrates the pressing need for a new Intelligence Czar.

That former lead counsel for the House David Schippers says he’d taken to John Ashcroft’s office specific warnings he’d learned from FBI agents in New York of an impending attack – even naming the proposed dates, names of the hijackers and the targets – and that the investigations had been stymied and the agents threatened, proves nothing but David Schipper’s need for attention.

That George Bush had plans to invade Afghanistan on his desk before 9/11 demonstrates only the value of being prepared.

The suggestion that securing a pipeline across Afghanistan figured into the White HouseÂ’s calculations is as ludicrous as the assertion that oil played a part in determining war in Iraq.

That Afghanistan is once again the worldÂ’s principal heroin producer is an unfortunate reality, but to claim the CIA is still actively involved in the narcotics trade is to presume bad faith on the part of the agency.

Mahmood Ahmed, chief of PakistanÂ’s ISI, must not have authorized an al Qaeda payment of $100,000 to Mohammed Atta days before the attacks, and was not meeting with senior Washington officials over the week of 9/11, because I didnÂ’t read anything about it in the official report.

George HW Bush and Dick Cheney spent the evening of September 10 in the Oval Office, itÂ’s true, but they were just old colleagues catching up.

That FEMA arrived in New York on Sept 10 to prepare for a scheduled biowarfare drill is a lucky twist of fate.

NewsweekÂ’s report that senior Pentagon officials cancelled flights on Sept 10 for the following day on account of security concerns is only newsworthy because of what happened the following morning.

That Mohamed Atta attended the International Officer's School at Maxwell Air Force Base, that Abdulaziz Alomari attended Brooks Air Force Base Aerospace Medical School, that Saeed Alghamdi attended the Defense Language Institute in Monterey merely shows itÂ’s a small world, after all.

That Mohammed Atta dressed like a Mafioso, had a stripper girlfriend, smuggled drugs, was already a licensed pilot when he entered the US, enjoyed pork chops, drank to excess and did cocaine, was closer to Europeans than Arabs in Florida, and included the names of defence contractors on his email list, proves how dangerous the radical fundamentalist Muslim can be.

That 43 lbs of heroin was found on board the Lear Jet owned by Wally Hilliard, the owner of Atta’s flight school, just three weeks after Atta enrolled – the biggest seizure ever in Central Florida – was just one of those things.

That HilliardÂ’s plane had made 30-round trips to Venezuela with the same passengers who always paid cash, that the plane had been supplied by a pair of drug smugglers who had also outfitted CIA drug runner Barry Seal, and that 9/11 commissioner Richard ben-Veniste had been SealÂ’s attorney before SealÂ’s murder, shows nothing but the lengths to which conspiracists will go to draw sinister conclusions.

Reports of insider trading on 9/11 are false, because the SEC investigated and found only respectable investors who will remain nameless involved, and no terrorists, so any profit-taking was merely coincidental.

That Hani Hanjour, the pilot of Flight 77, was so incompetent he could not fly a Cessna in August, but in September managed to fly a 767 at excessive speed into a spiraling, 270-degree descent and a level impact of the first floor of the Pentagon, on the only side that was virtually empty and had been hardened to withstand a terrorist attack, merely demonstrates that people can do almost anything once they set their minds to it.

That Mohammed Atta left a uniform, a will, his driver's license and a video "how to fly planes" in his rental car at the airport means he had other things on his mind.

The very mention of Israelis with links to military-intelligence having been arrested on Sept 11 videotaping and celebrating the attacks, and of a warning of impending attacks delivered to the Israeli company Odigo two hours before the first plane hit, is the vilest kind of anti-Semitism and should not be dignified with a response. That the stories were also reported in the Israeli media is a sad display of self-hatred among certain elements of the Jewish Left.

That multiple military wargames and simulations were underway the morning of 9/11 – one simulating the crash of a plane into a building; another, a life-fly simulation of multiple hijackings – and took many interceptors away from the eastern seaboard and confused field commanders as to which was a real hijacked aircraft and which was a hoax, was a tragic coincidence, but no less a coincidence.

That the National Military Command Center ops director asked a newly-qualified substitute to stand his watch at 8:30 am on Sept. 11 is nothing more than bad timing.

That the black boxes were either never found or were unrecoverable was a first for these particular boxes, but there's a first time for everything.

That a recording made Sept 11 of air traffic controllersÂ’ detailing the events of the day, was destroyed by an FAA official who crushed it in his hand, cut the tape into little pieces and dropped them in different trash cans around the building, is just one of those things.

That the FBI knew precisely which Florida flight schools to descend upon hours after the attacks should make every American safer to know their federal agents are on the ball.

To insinuate evil motive from the mercy flights of bin Laden family members and Saudi royals after 9/11 shows the sickness of the conspiratorial mindset.

Le FigaroÂ’s report in October 2001, known to have originated with French intelligence, that two CIA agents met Osama bin Laden in a Dubai hospital in July 2001, proves again the perfidy of the French.

That the tape in which bin Laden claims responsibility for the attacks was released by the State Department after having been found providentially by US forces in Afghanistan, and depicts a fattened Osama with a broader face and a flatter nose, proves Osama masterminded 9/11.

That the White House went on Cipro September 11 shows the foresightedness of AmericaÂ’s emergency response.

That the anthrax was mailed to perceived liberal media and the Democratic leadership demonstrates only the perversity of the terrorist psyche.

That the anthrax attacks appeared to silence opponents of the Patriot Act only shows that appearances can be deceiving.

That the Ames-strain anthrax was found to have originated at Fort Detrick, and was beyond the capability of all but a few labs to refine, underscores the importance of allowing the investigation to continue without the distraction of absurd conspiracy theories.

Sibel Edmonds is an attention-seeking nutcase. And since John Ashcroft has gagged her and classified her public testimony, we should speak no more of her.

But most of all, remember: there are no secrets, governments would never accept civilian casualties for geostrategic gain, and conspiracies are for the weak-minded and gullible.

Rather than treat the

Rather than treat the arrested spies as Jonathan Pollard had been treated, the US Government hurried to get the arrested Israelis out of the country as quickly as possible, in one case releasing and deporting one Israeli even though he failed his polygraph examination! Pollard had been just one spy. Here was the largest spy ring ever uncovered in the United States and the United States itself was trying to cover it all up! The media went along by downplaying the Rubin story, ignoring the Mexican incident and actually spiking Carl Cameron's four part story on the spy ring. . ."

http://www.likud.nl/extr214.html

I worked 2nd shift

I worked 2nd shift yesturday, so I didn't get the newz untill midnight last night. This is truly amazing!! I got love and respect for everybody in that 40+%. Good job guys, Thanks.
Man I'll tell you what, this right here has made my day.

I don't understand

I don't understand something.

If thermate was used to bring down the buildings, there would be no squibs. If it was a combination of explosives and thermate, chemical residue of explosives would be found in the dust.

What's the deal?

Shit, my year.

Shit, my year.

Yeah, exactly what I

Yeah, exactly what I thought.

Gold is "just" your regular Joe American.

I think the ruling elite seriously underestimates all those regular Joes out there. :)

DHS, That comes from here,

DHS,

That comes from here, (and could probably use an update);

Sunday, August 15, 2004
The Coincidence Theorist's Guide to 9/11
http://rigorousintuition.blogspot.com/2004/08/coincidence-theorists-guid...

cool thanks FrankV

cool thanks FrankV

Instead of focusing upon a

Instead of focusing upon a picture that speaks a thousand questions, we need to ask the questions of authorities. We need to demand a real investigation of the whole 9/11 event that would answer these questions. Then we can start building a government that tells the truth to its people and would never dream of killing them.

http://www.politicalgateway.com/main/columns/read.html?col=586

There it

911 for

Wow... GOOD article from

Wow... GOOD article from Rawstory...

If you haven't called,

If you haven't called, wrote, or e-mailed somebody in the media. Please do so now. What are you waiting for??

Delmart Edward Joseph

Delmart Edward Joseph Michael Vreeland II is a Lieutenant who worked for the United States Office of Naval Intelligence.

In June and July of 2001 Vreeland wrote a 37 page document addressed and intended to be sent to Admiral Vernon Clark, Chief of Naval Operations. It recounted the information on the intercepted documents and was to serve as a warning of the coming attacks. In August of 2001 Vreeland wrote a note with specifics of the attacks and asked that it be sent to the CSIS. The existence of this note was not revealed publicly until September 14, 2001.

http://www.sierratimes.com/02/04/19/araw041902.htm

pao@nmic.navy.mil

This covers what you need to

"""Delmart Edward Joseph

"""Delmart Edward Joseph Michael Vreeland II is a Lieutenant who worked for the United States Office of Naval Intelligence (ONI)."""

Ruppert was writing about this guy way back then. ONI was wiped out in the Pentagon attack as far as I know.

These are interesting angles and never covered.

Caveman Osama & his 19

Caveman Osama & his 19 lackeys w/boxcutters defeat NORAD, FBI, CIA, FAA, etc., and everyone in the U.S. govÂ’t gets to keep his/her job & many get promoted!

After several years, CIA head George Tenet is finally admonished eased out of his job.

Speaking of Tenat, how did he have this amazing foresight on the morning of 9/11, after the 1st plane had hit the WTC:

“They steered the plane directly into the building?” he [Tenet] asks incredulously. He orders his closest employees to the conference room and wants to be there himself within 15 minutes. “That looks like Bin Laden” Tenet said to Boren. Without waiting for a reaction Tenet thinks aloud: “I wonder if this has something to do with the guy [Zacarias Moussaoui] who trainned for a pilot’s license.”

So, were supposed to believe that when Tenet heard of the 1st plane impact:
1. He knew America was under attack.
2. He associated bin Laden with the attack.
3. He even associated the "20th hijacker", Moussaoui, with the attack.
And now we know that Tenet was part of this diabolical inside job!
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/bush_tenet_9-11.html

What happened to this

What happened to this Vreeland guy?

Is he still among us?

What was ONI into 5-6 years ago?

Who at the Pentagon was

Who at the Pentagon was investigating
those missing zillions Rumsfeld talked about on Sept. TENTH 2001 ? Were they perchance wiped out the next day ?

The coincidence theory would make this extremely likely. :)

I want to ask a question of

I want to ask a question of all of those people who "lurk" at 911blogger.com.

Is this poll "newsworthy"?

Why then are news outlets like MSNBC, CNN, Fox News, ABCNews, NBCNews, not covering it?

im going to email all of the

im going to email all of the local Philadelphia Major media outlets NBC10, ABC6, and CBS3 and FOX29 as well...

Note: There should be an

Note: There should be an offical post by Zogby on this poll in the coming day(s).
_________________________---
When this happens, the MSM better pay attention.

" im going to email all of

" im going to email all of the local Philadelphia Major media outlets NBC10, ABC6, and CBS3 and FOX29 as well..."

Make sure you say hi to Larry Mendte... he loves me. NOT

"When this happens, the MSM

"When this happens, the MSM better pay attention."

And if it doesn't, then not only do you need to promote the poll, but you also need to use the non-coverage of the poll to prove to people that the media is controlled.

Debunking 9/11 Conspiracy

Debunking 9/11 Conspiracy theories and Controlled Demolition Myths

Goodness Gracious! Why do people feel the need to try use Pseudo-Science to prove a tragedy! Damn, I was just starting to debunk 911myths debunking and now we have another one, and another one...they're like roaches

Does anyone know how the

Does anyone know how the trusses on the trade towers were connected to the outer beams and inner core? If so, do we have any photos of this available?

Yizzo, yeah I am just

Yizzo, yeah I am just waiting for these people to provide the other buildings that fell because of fire or damage. Since this is an everyday occurance, they should be able to provide this information.

I have yet found ONE steel framed building fall due to fire or damage onto it's own footprint at near free fall speeds. I just want to see ONE building as evidence that this can happen, besides the WTC's of course.

They can't because it is not normal and not possible.

I'm still waiting for those people to provide me with the picture of the top part of the buildings laying on the ground in a relative noticable pile. After all, they were suppose to be the "pile driver" for the lower floors. So what was the "pile driver" for the top part????

How come when i use

How come when i use cooperativeresearch.org now..most of the links are dead? is there a way to revive them? or maybe get the actual article from the company?

3 Credits! The 9/11

3 Credits!

The 9/11 traumatic events end the course discussions specifically around the Islam vs. West controversy and the future of political Islam.

http://www.telavivuniv.org/programs/summer.htm

please send this article

please send this article into bradblog, if they get a few more emails im sure they will cover it!

Gold, the mass media is

Gold, the mass media is complicit in the 911 cover up. We´ve covered that. This is just another confirmation.

"Goodness Gracious! Why do

"Goodness Gracious! Why do people feel the need to try use Pseudo-Science to prove a tragedy."

This site will help you with real science:

Debunking 9/11 Conspiracy theories and Controlled Demolition Myths

"Is this poll

"Is this poll "newsworthy"?

"Why then are news outlets like MSNBC, CNN, Fox News, ABCNews, NBCNews, not covering it?"

I think it is because it was a privately contracted poll.

"I think it is because it

"I think it is because it was a privately contracted poll."

What polls aren't?

"I think it is because it

"I think it is because it was a privately contracted poll."

Which polls aren't?

"This site will help you

"This site will help you with real science:

Debunking 9/11 Conspiracy theories and Controlled Demolition Myths
anonymous | 05.23.06 - 1:10 pm |"

Here is some of that real science:

" The suggestion that someone would need to fly airplanes into two buildings and blow them up is in itself absurd. Could you imagine the meeting?...

Government: We want to cause a tragedy so great the American people will blindly follow us into war... What do you think gentlemen...

Accomplice #1: Well, the Towers are a perfect choice.. It's been bombed before. We can just blame Osama again. We've been priming the American people by having him blow up our warships and our buildings in other countries.

Government: Yeah, good idea! How will we do that?

Accomplice #1: We can hire Osama to get some of his friends to fly planes into it!

Accomplice #2: Wait... I have a better idea, We can BOMB the buildings!

Accomplice #1: Well, that means placing enough bombs into the 110 story building. That's going to take a lot of man power and risk us being uncovered...

Accomplice #2: Yeah but that way your sure to knock it down. Besides, Maybe the hijackers wont make it to the target. Maybe they'll be uncovered!

Accomplice #1 But you don't need to knock it down, all you need is the horrific sight of the planes hitting the buildings. People will get the message. It's an attack on American soil. We'll also have people like the blind sheik to cover for us. We'll even put a guy on a train with evidence.

Your plan isn't perfect either you know. Do I have to remind you of Operation Towel Pop? We already tried to embarrass Clinton by knocking it down and failed.

Accomplice #2: Yeah, our bay of pigs, but I say the only way they can get the message is if we knock it down.

Accomplice #1 Do not

Accomplice #2 Do too

Accomplice #1 Do not

Accomplice #2 Do too

Accomplice #1 Do not

Accomplice #2 Do too

Government: Gentlemen, gentlemen... Please... What the hell, we'll just do both! :blink: How do we do that? I mean how do you keep explosions from showing up on TV? We're going to have to investigate this at some point. How do we cover up the seen?"

Anonymous, you completely

Anonymous, you completely misinterpreted Sheila Samples' article. I simply posted it here because parts of it were relevant to 9/11 truth (because she "came out" about 9/11 in a previous article and insinuated government complicity in those lines I quoted), BUT this article is NOT about 9/11 and she is NOT bringing her "baggage" as you call it to the 9/11 truth movement. Jesus, read the friggin article man. Looks like YOU brought YOUR baggage to this forum, not anybody else. Get a grip.

Reinforced buildings can not

Reinforced buildings can not - by definition - in a collapse driven by gravity (non-CD) collapse without any delay in the collapse from the reinforcing structure ! Such a building can not fall through itself at free fall speed !

Those towers collapsed at free fall speed - hence extra energy was used to help with this collapse.

If you believe that reinforced structures can collapse at free fall speed in a gravity driven event you can not also believe that parachutes work ! :)

With regard to the

With regard to the counter-arguments about "conspiratorial" thinking and the theoretical "meeting" between accomplices: There is a quote by Edward Luttwak which says that conspirators need not hide the truth forever; they need hide it only long enough for it not to matter anymore.

The Bush/Cheney/Rove/PNAC crowd is acting with great arrogance lately, essentially "flipping off" those who think they can be stopped. They are only one or two more moves, and four to eight weeks, away from being essentially untouchable.

Things will be very touch-and-go during that period of time, but there is investigation (journalistic and legal) underway not only in the 9/11 world, but with regard to Plamegate, the NSA, and the nasty little picture at the top having to do with moles, espionage, infiltration, betrayal and treason.

Keep up the pressure, and re-double effort. We are close to "breakthrough".

RE: Central

RE: Central Columns:

Warning: Red Pill:

PhysOrgForum Science, Physics and Technology Discussion Forums - 911 WTC - Evidence of an Nuclear explosion
http://forum.physorg.com/index.php?showtopic=4418

Check out the first video

Check out the first video that comes up under popular

http://video.google.com

It's a matter of historical

It's a matter of historical record that those towers had a TOTAL collapse in ten seconds. Even the 911 commission admits on page 305 that the south tower collapsed in ten seconds. This equals free fall speed. There is no way around it folks. :) This is a physical impossibilty in a gravity driven event. There is also no way around that. :)

Gangster, I posted this late

Gangster,
I posted this late last night.

I was just watching "9/11 The Fall of the World Trade Center" that the nobeliefs.com writer cited. What I find interesting is the clip of the journalist who was at the base of the towers doing a report right as the 1st building collapsed was edited. They cut the audio of him yelling, "A huge explosion with raining debris on all of us, WE BETTER GET OUT OF THE WAY!!!"
It also stated that it took 30 seconds for the south tower to collapse.
Another thing I noticed is the lack of video footage used. Most of their arguements were supported by "theororetical" computer animations of truss failure and fireproofing being blown off. In no way did they back these claims up with proof. Almost got me!

I can't determine if that's

I can't determine if that's a nuclear explosion. (Seems like a very bad idea to spread “nuclear explosion” rumors without solid proof.) However, common sense dictates that if anything, a few floors could sag, or may crumble somewhat into a floor below, etc. To the contrary, what I see in pictures like the ones provided looks much more like a volcano erupting than a building collapsing, with enormous energy shooting upwards & outwards. http://www.saunalahti.fi/wtc2001/sor11.jpg

One more thing I noticed is

One more thing I noticed is they edited the clips of the towers collapsing being careful not to show the "squibs" below the ??collapse/detonation?? zone.

" im going to email all of

" im going to email all of the local Philadelphia Major media outlets NBC10, ABC6, and CBS3 and FOX29 as well..."

Make sure you say hi to Larry Mendte... he loves me. NOT
Jon Gold | Homepage | 05.23.06 - 12:46 pm | #
HAHAHA, you had a run in with Larry Mendte? he does seem like a bit of a dick.....

I just came across this by

I just came across this by accident... anyone else seen this? Shows lots of smoke pouring out of the opposite side of buidling 7... http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=58582387431741404&q=WTC+7

Wing TV - Victor & Lisa -

Wing TV - Victor & Lisa - How Long will it be?

http://letsroll911.org/ipw-web/bulletin/bb/viewtopic.php?t=14022

T-Bone yes, a lot of people

T-Bone yes, a lot of people is complicit in this huge cover-up. How they are going to eventually escape treason charges and subsequent execution remains to be seen.

S'mee - I don't doubt that

S'mee - I don't doubt that there would be smoke.....

After all, there were some fires in the building.... Given that they were on several different floors, I would expect to see a rather large billow of smoke.

I saw a car entirely engulfed in flames on the freeway yesterday, and it looked like there was a 20 story building on fire before I got up to it. Just because there is a lot of smoke, that does not necessarily dictate the amount of damage.

Smee, WTC-7 also collapsed

Smee, WTC-7 also collapsed at free fall speed. This is a physical impossibility in a gravity driven event. There is no way around this.

Anonymous | 05.23.06 - 2:32

Anonymous | 05.23.06 - 2:32 pm |

Me!

everyone should bomb

everyone should bomb CrooksandLiars.com with questions about why they wont cover this. C&L needs to be severely bombarded. the censorship must stop.its one thing not to cover 9/11 truth, its another to delete all comments relating to 9/11 in any way and give a bullshit answer like "i believe the official story and i knew someone who died that day, so we dont cover 9/11 here".come on people, get over to C&L and ask them why they love censorship so much.

Hey - I don't disagree with

Hey - I don't disagree with you at all - I just hadn't seen this video before and thought it was worth viewing.

Hi! Take a peek at

Hi! Take a peek at http://shoutwire.com , it's a news site where the readers decide wich stories goes to the front page. 911truth all over the place :) (shoutwire can also be found at the torrent site http://torrentspy.com , lots of exposure :)

"Sir,could you test the mike

"Sir,could you test the mike so we can find a level?"
"9/11!"
"Sir,about the Iraq quagmire..."
"9/11!"
"2000 dead""
"9/11!"
"Torture?"
"9/11!"
"Massive deficits?"
"9/11!"
"No bid contracts?"
"9/11!"
"Gas prices?"
"9/11!"

this is one of the single funniest comics i have ever read.you guys gotta post this.

http://www.ucomics.com/doonesbury/2006/05/21/

Coach-"What happened out

Coach-"What happened out there?"
Player-"It was 9/11 coach."
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH.

Great comic. :)

Great comic. :)

Wing TV - Victor & Lisa -

Wing TV - Victor & Lisa - How Long will it be?

http://letsroll911.org/ipw-web/b...pic.php? t=14022
road66 | 05.23.06 - 2:27 pm | #
hopefully not too long.

S'mee, I would expect

S'mee, I would expect incendiaries like thermite to produce smoke just before a building is imploded. Just ask Larry Silverstein.

Zogby poll posted on

Zogby poll posted on GlobalResearch.ca - Centre for Research on Globalization

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=viewArticle&code=20060523...

"Shows lots of smoke pouring

"Shows lots of smoke pouring out of the opposite side of buidling 7..."

A fair amount of smoke, but no flames are visible.

Here's a better quality video:

http://www.911myths.com/WTC7_Smoke.avi

"Smee, WTC-7 also collapsed

"Smee, WTC-7 also collapsed at free fall speed."

No, that's not correct at all.

I still haven't seen any

I still haven't seen any coverage of this poll on CNN. The media loves commiting suicide.

"No, that's not correct at

"No, that's not correct at all."

Daaaah...which way did she go, which way did she go.

"It also stated that it took

"It also stated that it took 30 seconds for the south tower to collapse."

No, it took about 12.5 to 13 seconds to collapse. See this video.

"It's a matter of historical

"It's a matter of historical record that those towers had a TOTAL collapse in ten seconds. Even the 911 commission admits on page 305 that the south tower collapsed in ten seconds. This equals free fall speed. There is no way around it folks. This is a physical impossibilty in a gravity driven event. There is also no way around that."

Here's the video that proves it was about 12.5 to 13 seconds for wtc 2. That is far from free fall speed.

What is the argument over a

What is the argument over a couple of seconds??????

Whether it took 10 seconds or 18 seconds is moot! The building should have fallen in no less than 40 seconds if it was by natural cuases.

So even if you argue just a few seconds, it still does not equate to the actual time.

Argue about real issues!!!!!

2 or 5 seconds are not worth debating.

That's like arguing that the

That's like arguing that the truck should have skid 1000 feet at the speed it was going, but instead it only skid 950 ft.

The building still fell at near free fall speed, because it was not in the amount of time that it would have in a natural collapse of 40 seconds with an estimate of 1/2 second/floor collapse time.

"Whether it took 10 seconds

"Whether it took 10 seconds or 18 seconds is moot! The building should have fallen in no less than 40 seconds if it was by natural cuases."

If you can show me the physics calculations I'll be happy to look at them. I've never seen any such calculations.

You should read through this to see why you're probably wrong:

Debunking 9/11 Conspiracy theories and Controlled Demolition Myths

Would someone explain to me,

Would someone explain to me, in the NIST/FEMA collapse scenario that was driven by fire-weakened steel beams, why the top of one building FELL UPWARDS at a high rate of speed generating a cloud of debris and how the top of one of the towers started to fall over but then CHANGED ITS MIND?

"If you can show me the

"If you can show me the physics calculations I'll be happy to look at them. I've never seen any such calculations.

You should read through this to see why you're probably wrong:

Debunking 9/11 Conspiracy theories and Controlled Demolition Myths
anonymous | 05.23.06 - 5:59 pm "

Start with this link......

Though this document is informative, it too makes many assumptions and does not have facts. Nor does it provide the math to show how the towers could fall in a near free fall speed. 9.2 seconds in a vacuum versus 16 seconds is neglegable and still counts as FREE FALL!!!!!!

Show me the math that prooves that it is possible for a building to fall at near free fall speed and I will look at it.

http://janedoe0911.tripod.com/BilliardBalls.html

The following comment should

The following comment should be....

Though your document is informative, it too makes many assumptions and does not have facts. Nor does it provide the math to show how the towers could fall in a near free fall speed. 9.2 seconds in a vacuum versus 16 seconds is neglegable and still counts as FREE FALL!!!!!!

You mean this REDICULOUS

You mean this REDICULOUS account of things???

"Remember, we haven't added the energy of four floors of burning wood, plastic, cloth and paper, at- let's be conservative, say half the weight is stuff like that and half is metal, so 25lbs/sqft? And then how about as much energy as the total collapse again, from the plane impact? And what about the energy from the burning fuel? You know, I'm betting we have a kiloton to play with here. I bet we have a twentieth of the energy that turned the entire city of Nagasaki into a flat burning plain with a hundred-foot hole surrounded by a mile of firestorm to work with. - Schneibster"

Really, like fire is to be added to the KINETIC ENERGY???? Do you really know what KINETIC ENERGY is???? Fire or wood on fire does not ad to kinetic energy.

Here is what kinetic energy is.....

Kinetic energy is the energy of motion. An object which has motion - whether it be vertical or horizontal motion - has kinetic energy. There are many forms of kinetic energy - vibrational (the energy due to vibrational motion), rotational (the energy due to rotational motion), and translational (the energy due to motion from one location to another). To keep matters simple, we will focus upon translational kinetic energy. The amount of translational kinetic energy (from here on, the phrase kinetic energy will refer to translational kinetic energy) which an object has depends upon two variables: the mass (m) of the object and the speed (v) of the object. The following equation is used to represent the kinetic energy (KE) of an object.

where m = mass of object

v = speed of object

http://www.glenbrook.k12.il.us/GBSSCI/PHYS/Class/energy/u5l1c.html

Maybe you should do some more research and stop posting to this site that spouts the most rediculous information.

From New Zealand: Although

From New Zealand:

Although the Bush administration continues to exploit September 11 to justify domestic spying, unprecedented spending and a permanent state of war, a new Zogby poll reveals that less than half of the American public trusts the official 9/11 story or believes the attacks were adequately investigated.

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/WO0605/S00465.htm

"9.2 seconds in a vacuum

"9.2 seconds in a vacuum versus 16 seconds is neglegable and still counts as FREE FALL!!!!!!"

How?

:"9.2 seconds in a vacuum

:"9.2 seconds in a vacuum versus 16 seconds is neglegable and still counts as FREE FALL!!!!!!"

How?
911Poller | 05.23.06 - 7:54 pm |"

Because there are none of those nasty little laws of physics to act against it.

BASIC PHYSICS.

Try swinging a bat underneath the water and then try to swing it out on the shore.

Which one is easier and faster????? Probably the one on the shore because you don't have the forces of the water fighting you where on the shore you only have AIR fighting you.

AGAIN, BASIC PHYSICS!

"Probably the one on the

"Probably the one on the shore because you don't have the forces of the water fighting you where on the shore you only have AIR fighting you."

That's your analogy? How come that wasn't brought out in all those investigations?

"That's your analogy? How

"That's your analogy? How come that wasn't brought out in all those investigations?
911Poller | 05.23.06 - 9:17 pm"

In all what investigations???

You mean FEMA (Fake Every Means Available)?

Or NIST?

Or the 9/11 Ommission and distortion?

None of these did an actual investigation. They were not allowed to do a PROPER investigation. 15 Million is barely an investigation when 3000 lives were lost. However, a blow job warrants 40 Million.

Now they can spend 40 Mil on a president that had concentual sex, but to really discover the truth over an attack, they fight investigations and fail to provide access to the needed items.

Yeah, there was a real investigation performed.

NEXT!

I think this will probably

I think this will probably change your mind, anonymous. It was written by a structural engineer 6 days after 9/11. Is there some reason I should think he is wrong and you are right?

With both towers, the forces created by the falling floors above on the floors below would have been orders of magnitude greater than the resistance of these floors, leading to the complete collapses then observed.

I am by no means a

I am by no means a structural engineer, but I have several issues with the report to begin with.

First, how can he do an extensive review only 6 days after the collapse when the material was not available then for analysis. Not that much has been available since, but none was available then.

Second, there was very little information available regarding the facts only 6 days after the event.

Finally, anyone who immediately comes out with the answers is surely a plant and really has not done any SERIOUS INVESTIGATION.

It's like NASA picking up a few parts of Columbia and saying they had the answers without reviewing all the video and material that was available.

NOT VERY SCEIENTIFICE. So if this person is in fact what they say, I seriously lay any credibility to their analysis.

A REAL engineer looks at all the evidence and material and then makes a conclusion. Not just some small amount of data that was not even available at the time for a valid analysis.

Try again! NEXT!

In fact, that structural

In fact, that structural engineer got it pretty much correct since he knew a 767 hit it.

But you haven't explained why we should think you are right and he is wrong.

Here's some more, written in Oct. 2001:

Without exaggeration, more than 99% of all buildings would collapse immediately if hit by a 767

Here is some more from just

Here is some more from just after the attacks:

More will be learnt as the investigations proceed, but in the meantime a number of internationally
respected specialists have agreed that the towers performed very well during the attacks. To fully
appreciate this it is necessary to consider the extreme nature of each of the three abnormal loading
events that occurred. It should also be noted that it is unreasonable to compare the performance of
these towers with some notional concrete equivalent because an equivalent has never had to withstand
such an attack: the hypothetically better performance is argued from silence.

Firstly the buildings were subject to violent impact as each aircraft hit with a force that would have
collapsed most buildings. Some idea of the magnitude of the impacts is gained from the earth tremors
they caused – measured at 0.7 and 0.9 on the Richter scale for earthquake intensity at a seismic station
34 kilometres from Manhattan. The significance of these values is that, unlike an earthquake
that occurs at considerable depth in the earth’s crust causing wide–spread seismic forces, these impacts
were very localized, occurring several hundred metres above ground, before being transmitted
through the structures to their foundations and into the subgrade. The fact that such large disturbances
were measured at such a distance is testimony to the force of the impact.

Because Physics says

Because Physics says so.....

Show me anyone who can defy physics, then I MIGHT believe that a building, actually 3, can fall at a near free fall speed.

Just provide one person who claims that they can defy physics, and I will believe you.

If not, then perhaps you or they can explain the following:

1) Why the cores were not standing 30 or so floors above since the inner floors pancaked. It's like a record on a spindal.

2) Fire above could not end up in the basement and under the rubble and cause it to burn for months after the collapse. Prove that the fire 80 stories above could have ended up in the basement.

3) Show me ANY STEEL FRAMED BUILDING in the worlds history that fell onto it's own footprint and at a near free fall speed before. JUST ONE! Since this is SO COMMON this should be easy for you or them.

4) Provide evidence by simulations or sceintific means, usually by a small model, that this can in fact happen. Where's the proof???? There are other scientists that refute the official version. Just as many say the opposite, so who is right???

5) Show me how the steel cores can be sliced into about 30 ft. sections by the pancaking theory. It is a fact that most of the core columns were severed into about these sizes. Show me how their pancaking theory can account for this????

Show me how there can be small concentrated spots in the building, about 30 stories below the collapse, of the building shooting out? How can this be accounted for when the building was designed to be a hermetically sealed building???? This is impossible with the design of the building.

Show me how the top part of the buildings also were destroyed into nothing???? What can do this??? The force for the damage is suppose to be the top floors, to destroy the lower floors, so what destroyed the top floors????? There should have been a large portion of the top part still in large pieces on the ground below. However, the WHOLE building was gone.

NOT POSSIBLE OR PLAUSIBLE WITHOUT EXPLOSSIVES!!!!!

By the way.... If it is so

By the way....

If it is so easy to bring down sky scrappers as to blow up the top part and light a fire, then the people who do Controlled Demolition has been wasting a lot of money and time.

That's why they spend so much time and money preparing for a CD, because it is not that easy and buildings do not just come down from damage and fire in that manner.

I don't know where you get

I don't know where you get the idea that building collapses defy physics.

We know from videos that they did not fall at free fall speed so you can scratch that.

The cores could not stand on their own. The fires underground were burning all the debris from within the towers. There was no free fall speed. There was no "slicing" into 30 ft sections. The top floors were destroyed from the tremendous kinetic energy of the fall to earth. And a building cannot remain hermetically sealed when it is collapsing. This all is well known. I'm not sure where you're getting your information, RemoveBush.

This covers pretty much everything:

SCIENCE DESK

Compressed Air and Gravity: Physics Finished What Terror Began

By WARREN E. LEARY (NYT) 1016 words
Published: September 25, 2001

Little is left but rubble and dust. The degree of destruction at the World Trade Center after the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks seems almost beyond comprehension.

But understanding the natural forces that contributed to the disaster can help explain the destruction of the twin towers, why they came crashing down the way they did and why enormous clouds of dust erupted from the site, experts say.

The buildings contained more than 200,000 tons of steel, 425,000 cubic yards of concrete and 600,000 square feet of glass in 43,000 windows. Each floor, a reinforced concrete pad on a metal deck supported by steel cross beams, was about one acre and weighed about 4.8 million pounds.

The general outline of the towers' collapse was well known soon after the terrorist attack: engineers believe that the crash of the 767's and the intense heat generated from thousands of gallons of burning jet fuel weakened and buckled the buildings' steel framework, causing the upper floors to collapse and beginning an unstoppable chain reaction borne along by the force of gravity.

Since the crash, engineers have continued to analyze the catastrophe. The buildings came down, engineers said, much as they would have in a controlled demolition -- although a controlled collapse would have started with the strategic placement of small explosives.

The size and weight of the concrete floor pads, and the way they collapsed onto one another, helps explain why so much of the mass of each building was smashed into small pieces, demolition engineers said. As each concrete floor pancaked into the one below, their combined weight grew so large that they and everything in their path broke into smaller and smaller pieces, until mostly dust and small pieces of rubble remained.

Dr. Frank A. Moscatelli, a professor of physics at Swarthmore College in Pennsylvania, calculated that the total energy released in the disaster was equivalent to the explosion of 600 tons of TNT. This energy discharge, which takes into account the weight of the airplanes that struck the buildings, their speed at impact, the jet fuel and the mass of the buildings, is about one-twentieth of that released by the 10-kiloton atom bomb dropped on Hiroshima, he said.

''And most of this energy was supplied by gravitational collapse,'' Dr. Moscatelli said. ''People don't think of an item sitting still as having energy, but it does. The energy from gravitational collapse is what the controlled demolition people use to take down structures, and it is very powerful.''

Once the mass of the upper part of a building begins to fall, Dr. Moscatelli said, it gains momentum that adds to the force the structure below has to resist. ''If the rest of the building can't do it, everything begins to fall straight down,'' he said.

Jon D. Magnusson, chairman and chief executive of Skilling Ward Magnusson Barkshire in Seattle, a structural engineering company that worked out the original World Trade Center design, said the enormous energy released in the collapse was enough to pulverize the 110-story towers and their contents.

As the buildings fell, large plumes of dust billowed from the structures in what appeared to be high-speed jets. Engineers said compression of the buildings' air propelled the dust.

''People don't think about it, but there is a large amount of air in a structure,'' said James Redyke, president of Dykon Blasting, a demolition company in Tulsa, Okla. ''A building is like an accordion, and when it collapses the air has to exit someplace. It exits at a pretty good volume, carrying all the dust from concrete, sheetrock and other things inside.''

An initial analysis of the World Trade Center disaster released last week by Risk Management Solutions of Newark, Calif., a company that analyzes catastrophes for the insurance industry and others, estimated that the pancake collapse of the tower floors produced a major airborne ''debris surge.'' This cloud, which it said initially spread at more than 50 miles per hour, dumped significant deposits of dust more than a half mile from the site and small amounts up to two miles away.

Larry Gilmore, president of Controlled Blasting, a demolition company in Norcross, Ga., said the large cloud of dust coming from the fall of a tall structure was from more than the displacement of air inside. Watching tapes of the New York disaster, he said he noticed another phenomenon seen during controlled demolitions.

''As a building falls, it pulls the atmosphere down with it, creating a vacuum behind it,'' Mr. Gilmore said. ''Air rushes into the space that has been evacuated above and creates a downdraft that hits the debris below, pushing even more dust out with great force.''

Impact of the collapse coupled with this powerful downdraft provided the force to propel the giant dust cloud down nearby streets and around buildings, he said.

Mr. Magnusson and others said they were initially surprised that the buildings went straight down without sliding to the side or toppling.

Pictures of the collapse indicate that the buildings' outer support structures may have helped guide the falling floors, Mr. Magnusson said.

The buildings had a so-called metal tube structure design, which consisted of hundreds of steel columns spaced around the outer face of each tower to give the structures stiffness and to support much of their weight, including the floor pads. This outer ring was connected by steel trusses to a cluster of metal columns in the center that supported core components such as elevators and stairs, as well as part of each concrete floor.

Mr. Magnusson said the outer tubes of the buildings, consisting of 61 steel columns on each of a tower's four sides, seemed to keep the concrete floors aligned as they fell.

''As you look at the videotape, it seems that as the building frame peels back, it stays long enough for the floors to pass,'' Mr. Magnusson said. ''The reason the buildings stood and the reason they went straight down was that strong exterior tube.''

Since it is so common for 3

Since it is so common for 3 buildings to fall in one day, perhaps you can explain why this building did not fall?????

Of course it is not of the same construction, clearly less well constructed as the WTC's, and the plane was not going over 400MPH. However, the building never once showed signs or even collapsed........

I guess it only happens here when our government wants to do something that it knows that it won't be able to do without "a New Pearl Harbor"?

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/december2005/061205planecrashes.htm

Well, you just keep holding

Well, you just keep holding onto your beliefs and what's left of your civil liberties. After all, they both will eventually be gone. Then perhaps you will wake up, along with the remainding 48% of America.

You do realize that it's not just the WTC's, but the entire day that makes this point directly at an inside job???

It's not just one, two, or ten things..... It's hundreds of things that do not hold water by the official version.

You obviously do not have any math experience or engineering experience, so I'm really wasting my time. I can provide just as many quotes to counter what you provide. However, I have a 2 year degree and a 4 year degree that the math says is not possible the way America has been told. NOTHING is as we are told.

I'm glad that I could serve my country to give you the right to give away my civil liberties. I would rather you just said thank you, and help protect everyones civil liberties!!!!!

RE: Collapse speed. It would

RE: Collapse speed.

It would be helpful if the followers og the official story finally took the time to check what they believe (clearly blindly) actually consists of. For example on page 305 of the commission report it says that the south tower collapsed in ten seconds. So, even the commission admits this.

Anyway, free fall speed of 1360 feet comes to 9.22 seconds and is of course slower in the atmosphere due to air resistance, wind, updraft etc. As a result free fall speed at sea level from this height is probably at least 12 seconds. In this light the constant hair-splitting by people who are unwilling and unable to identify arguments

is just comical.

Clarification, free fall in

Clarification, free fall in vacuum comes to 9.22 seconds and is of course slower in the atmosphere due to the factors I mentioned. As a result the speed of the collapse PROVES that outside energy was used to help the collapse of the towers - unless you want to believe impossible things.

"As a result the speed of

"As a result the speed of the collapse PROVES that outside energy was used to help the collapse of the towers - unless you want to believe impossible things."

My question is why I should believe your claims rather than that of physicists and structural engineers? RemoveBush seems to say he is more qualified to speak on the subject but doesn't give any reasons why he is contradicting professionals. You just say it's impossible.

anonymous, you should

anonymous, you should believe that outside energy was used to help collapse the towers because you can see it with your own eyes! The physicists & structural engineers you refer to are paid & owned by the same gov't that committed the atrocities. So go play devil's advocate somewhere else, as you seem very disingenuous in continually asking the obvious.

Common sense also tells us

Common sense also tells us that when buildings are damaged, they are not designed for a chain-reaction to occur & bring the entire thing down in one fell swoop. Just the opposite. They are not houses of cards or chains of dominos!

Wow

Wow

Brand spanking new poll

Brand spanking new poll here
http://www.scrippsnews.com/911poll

very much in our favour !

Amazingly excellent post, i

Amazingly excellent post, i wonder if we can get another updated zogby poll going?

What the poll tells us about education and propaganda

Further interpretation of Zogby poll results:

http://www.911blogger.com/node/2534