New 911 Documentary Segment: Zeitgeist- Part 2

Wow very good. Excellent

Wow very good.
Excellent production skills, and concise, clear content selection.. top marks!

Is there a part 1?

There is, but not 9/11 related...

Looks to be an examination of the historical roots of Christianity, I only watched the first couple of minutes...

Or see it in it's entirty in one sitting ..

I found it much more powerful seeing the film from start to finish - it's threaded together with wonderful articulation and the upmost aesthetic. Use headphones - the music is composed well too.



Headphones HIghly Recommended!!

I cant explain how important Part 3 is!!

If nothing else watch part 3.

Based on the comments here I only watched parts 2 and 3, as part 1is not for me.
The parts I did watch are very well done, and very well informed, and should serve to open peoples eyes, if they are not well versed in the deeper issues beyond 9/11. Great job, spread it to the four winds!

Physics/Science/Mathematics do not lie, only people do.
9/11 was an INSIDE JOB

Actually part 1

was excellent and well done, the only reason to say "its not for me" would be because you treat the FACTS about Christianity the exact same way that 50% of this country treat the FACTS about 9/11 which is Total Denial and flatly refuse to accept cold hard fact.

but why focus on christianity alone?

why not, if the intent is to denounce superstition, go after other religions? Ones that don't, for example, teach such nice messages of universal brotherhood (and sisterhood) and love as Christianity? Sorry, but singling out the Jesus "myth" for scrutiny is suspect.


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ALL religions are represented here, in fact Christianity was LAST.
They are all basically the same and date back to ancient Sumeria, Babylon and Kemet, they are all tied together and Christianity is just re badged paganism of the many other Sun god religions that existed 1000s of years before Christianity was a twinkle in some Bronze age Bedoiuns eye.

Christianity does not teach universal brotherhood & love.

this is the fallacy

no, all religions aren't basically all the same and have the exact same root. This is the intellectual laziness that goes with this new age interpretation. Do research into what historians and archaeologists actually believe about the roots of various faiths in that region. It is NOT, "they are all about the sun, and rehashes of the same thing!"

some religions aims to free your mind


some religions aims to free your mind, rather than enslave it.

The scope of the movie is about the mind-controlling religions, eg. ones that wants your money and your mind.


I have researched

most of the "SUN GOD" based religions for over 34 years. I suggest you do a few years of honest research yourself, something besides "the bible says".
Look into the REAL origins of Christianity, the archaeological evidence is well documented and overwhelming.
You obviously know zilch about it.


Part two is about the tightest half hour on 9/11 I can imagine. No hyperbole, just bullet points. Huge congratulations. But then, part 3 topped it with a state-of-the-art melding of the histories of the banking cabals, the debt pyramid, synthetic terrorism, Orwell's manufactured enemies and perpetual wars, and the Brave New World around the corner if we fail to wake people up. Phenomenal composition.

Zeitgeist part 3 is the most concentrated dose of true knowledge currently available. As Aaron Russo and G. Edward Griffin and many others have pointed out, the Federal Reserve and the other central banks are the nexus for the prison of bogus wars and terror hype that we are trapped in. Attack the fiat currencies and the chains of debt, and Oz and the Wizard crash, along with the funding for terror and the military-industrial complex.

Part 3

. . . is brilliant. Zeitgeistnyc has authored a manifesto of awakening. Thrilling stuff, compellingly told.
Watch this Part if it's the only one you watch.

WOW... That was intense !!!

Really good job, contained tons of info, all delivered with a punch !!!

A-Z of how the "elites" have manipulated the goodwill and naivety of the human psyche.

Would love to get hold of the high quality version, i.e. DVD, DivX / XviD to share with friends...

Any chance of putting the HQ version on torrent or binary newsgroups and posting the info here ?

Thanks for putting such a "work of art" together...

Best wishes

Well done

This is quite good.

Well done.

I keep being surprised at the original takes on re-presenting this information. This is a distillation of the intent of Terrorstorm, combined with the presence of David Ray Griffin, Steven Jones and others.

A good introduction piece.

Rep, if this video is saying

Rep, if this video is saying "Jesus is fake" then I don't think it combines any presence from David Ray Griffin, Steven Jones or Alex Jones for that matter. It’s like the no planes version of the Da Vinci Code, forget the conspiracy theory about Jesus having a surviving bloodline, he just straight never existed. Not something we need relating to 9/11 Truth frankly.

You'll be wise to push individual segements of the movie

As people will not want to watch the whole thing, and may be turned off and miss the 9/11 part before they even get to it.

P.S. the claim made that there were absolutely no historians of the period that mentioned Jesus is patently false.

I'm sure art historians immediately after the death of Vincent van Gogh were just clamoring to write about his life story /sarcasm

There are basically 4

There are basically 4 historians people site to claim Jesus existed. 1) Tacitus 2)Pliny 3) Josephus 4) Suetonius,
-All poor, interpretive sources, while Josephus was proven a forgery.

The info denoted by these writers is obscure, ambiguous and FAR from any proof that the great "Jesus" existed in
all his fantastic, miracle ridden glory. I would say about 5 PARAGRAPHS exists outside of the bible which have any semblance of
this "Jesus" character... all interpretive. Not to mention you would think a guy who rose from the dead and all the other silly sci-fi crap,
would have made into into thousands of volumes of the historians... not a few paragraphs of dribble. Its pathetic.

911 was an inside job and Christianity is a fraud. It's time to wake up.

Show "Jesus was way cool." by u2r2h

The historical record of Jesus

Zeit-man, you have done a fabulous thing here. I will be burning a lot of these DVDs and passing them out as soon as you make it available - any plans for that?

I have not yet watched part 1 - the following comments are only in response to other comments on this forum including your own.

The historical record of Jesus is not restricted to the (4) sources that you mention. Jesus did not die on the cross, he survived it (having only been on the cross 3-4 hours) and made his way with one or more "disciples" to India. There are many books about the evidence of this and one particular source that is unimpeachable. Jesus lived a full life in India and was buried in what is now Kashmir.

Your otherwise fabulous video is self-denigrated by your prejudice and presumed knowledge of that which you cannot know - whether Jesus was a real or mythiical character. I can get behind all the denigration of religion and the way that religion is used by "the controllers" that anybody wants to put out there, but I cannot get behind speculation about Jesus' not having existed based solely on the limited sources that you mention. (And, I'm not a Christian in case you're wondering about prejudice on my part.)

As others have stated, your speculative statements about the existence of the historical figure we call Jesus constitute a serious flaw in what otherwise is a fabulous piece of work. Truth.

The work is an analysis of

The work is an analysis of information coming out of the Bible. I'm not talking about other people's ideas, such as "the jesus who went to india", as that isn't in the Gospels.
The Jesus OF THE BIBLE however, if ones take the time to research it fully, is nowhere to be found in the historical record, while nearly all aspects of this "character" are attributed to other pre-christian gods. The logic of the evolution of the jesus character in a "solar/steller" cult myths becomes very obvious.
Please watch part one.
I find it odd for you to criticize a part of the work haven't even seen!

this statement

"while nearly all aspects of this "character" are attributed to other pre-christian gods. " is repeated often in new age circles but isn't really true. Most of the aspects of the character is related specifically to the Torah and the psalms of the old testemant. The 'solar/stellar' generalization (Horus! Mithras!) comes from people who don't take the time to research the connections of the new testament to the old testament.

News editor at The Watchman Report,, delivering 9/11 truth to the Christian community

The Pre-Christan gods are a

The Pre-Christan gods are a reality. It's there for all to see.... if one chooses to see.
Go ahead and dismiss them.... they won't go away.
The truth will never go away.

pre Christian gods

are realities, and so is the Torah and the books of prophets and other writings that make up the Tanakh, or in Christian terminology, old testament books. Your response just shows you haven't done the research, sorry. There is at least a realistic argument that a jewish sect made up many or all of the stories in the gospels to fit their leader into satisfying hundreds of verses specific to the faith given in the Tanakh.

The Horus/Mithras stuff is just intellecual laziness and dishonesty, "Ooh, another story with a virgin birth!" "Another story with someone dying and coming back to life! Wow! That's incredible! I'm just going to disregard that just about every word supposedly stated by and every action supposdly taken by Jesus is specifically related to a section of the Tanakh."

News editor at The Watchman Report,, delivering 9/11 truth to the Christian community

Well I HAVE done my research

over 34 years worth in fact and what Zeitgeist is saying is absolutely correct.
Notice how you are doing exactly what those that refuse to accept the cold hard facts of 9/11 truth do, just flat out denial of what is right in front of your face.
The Bible is without any question just an Astrological Drama, even they way it was written in verses & parables, homilies etc are like old Pagan Passion plays which were acted out on a stage.
The NT follows a 1 year ministry of the SUN, first the SUN meets whom? well the first constellation of course which is Aquarius the water bearer (John the baptist).
Whom does the SUN meet second on his 1 year trip? The 2 Fishermen (Pisces). and so on all through the bible.

How is it that the SUN manages to ride BOTH an "ass, and on a colt, the foal of an ass" into Jerusalem in August? Well maybe it just could be that Cancer is rising that month and the SUN passes through both of the stars that make up the claws of the constellation Cancer and guess what the names of those stars were in Chaldean star charts... Yep "The ASS & THE FOAL....DOH!
Today they are more commonly known as "Asellus Borealis and Asellus Australis" (The Northern and Southern Donkey/Ass).

I think Part one is a good precursor to 9/11 truth because it shows exactly how ignorant myths become fact in the minds of the delusional.
Millions have been fooled into believing the myth of Christianity, so too have millions been fooled into believing the utter BS of the Official Government Conspiracy Theory.

you haven't done enough research.

"The Bible is without any question just an Astrological Drama, even they way it was written in verses & parables, homilies etc are like old Pagan Passion plays which were acted out on a stage."

which pagan tradition are you referring to here? Because it isn't true.

"The NT follows a 1 year ministry of the SUN, first the SUN meets whom? well the first constellation of course which is Aquarius the water bearer (John the baptist).
Whom does the SUN meet second on his 1 year trip? The 2 Fishermen (Pisces). and so on all through the bible."

Once again, you are disregarding the facts, that every word supposedly spoken by and every action taken by this person in the gospels is related specifically to sections of the Tanakh. Your opinion, which is a common fallacy of new age belief systems, is looking at the new testament without knowing enough about the old testament.

And please, talk to a real scholar of ancient religions about the foundation of the religious traditions in near Asia. While some are based on sun worship, many are not, including Judaism.

I have forgotten more than you will ever know

"which pagan tradition are you referring to here? Because it isn't true."

This proves your ignorance of the subject as you don't even know about pagan passion plays which were extremely popular for many centuries, the orators were literally the rock stars of their day.

The gospels are passion plays designed to be read or acted out in front of an audience. Passion plays were a common feature of pagan religion. Looking at the Gospels themselves one finds a chopply written, scene by scene, display of the life of the God man. Only the important aspects of his life are described. The minor events and influences of the life of Jesus are not recorded, which leaves one to think that the Gospels are indeed a play.
One in particular that comes to mind is the "Yusirian Drama", which was the enveloping of a priest in a shroud by two other priests, disguised as wolves. These two wolflike characters – portraying the divine guides of the dead – conducted the shrouded one to a temple of Auset/Isis outside the city where they left him. They would later return and lead the shrouded priest, who enacted the role of King Rhampsinitus, back into the city. On his return, the shrouded priest brought with him a napkin, supposedly given to him by Auset. Parts of this ceremony became the narrative in the Gospel of John where we read of visitors to Jesus’ tomb beholding a napkin and a shroud and two angels.
Another is the Drama of Bel

The bible is written as a stage play, verses, acts, etc this is obvious to anyone not brain dead.

I have spoken to MANY scholars of ancient religions, have also read many diaries of several archaeologist , I also have about 85 volumes in my library concerning this subject.

You have no clue what you are talking about, all you are doing is grasping at straws out of desperation to defend your belief in your sun god.

Part 1 - further comments from MDI

Yo Zeitgeist!

Now I have viewed Part 1, so I can comment more specifically on the things I’ve been reading from others’ comments.

I have to begin by “praising” your filmmaking talents (religious pun intended). This is a very good movie from a technical standpoint. The only small critiques I would constructively offer is (1) the level of the music track is so high as to be distracting in a few places so that I really have to work to understand what’s being said, (2) the text font is too small to easily read in several places where it serves no artistic purpose to be so and (3) a few scattered misspellings (all 3 ‘Parts’). I offer those comments strictly in support – I’d like for this product to be as professional as possible because I intend to show it to a lot of people.

As to Part 1, I very much enjoyed your connecting-of-the-dots with regard to the ancient mythologies from around the known world, their migration through cultures and times and the relationship(s) of (some of) those religious/historical myths to astronomic and solar cycles. Indeed, it is beyond debate in most objective circles that much of what constitutes the Christian religion of today was imported, plagiarized and bent to serve the political agendas of the day.

I also agree with the basic point of Part 1 – that religion in today’s world is comprised of a great deal of priest-class detritus and is used as a tool of control by the controllers. You’ve done a masterful job of presenting your considered position.

However, with regard to scholarly research, the conclusion that you draw seems to be built of the same type of deeply-held beliefs that you excoriate in those who hold beliefs are in the religious/spiritual realm of human thought and experience. For instance, do you believe that the empirical world is the final reality? If so, you are expressing a belief – not a ‘fact’ – no matter how many humans agree to say so. Such knowledge is not within the realm of the empirical.

That which we lump together with the term ‘religion’ is actually a lot bigger and more complex a phenomena than can be explained by superstition, mythology and/or the exigencies of primitive humans dealing with imagined meanings in their worlds.

This is a discussion that can’t be adequately expressed in this forum. Nor can it be determined (in this forum) whether or not there was an historical human being who we now call Jesus in our present-day culture.

From my experience, study and perspective, your conclusion that Jesus did not exist is a speculative leap (which ignores or is unaware of other solid historical sources) after going through the many aspects of the “Jesus story” that, in themselves, are suspect. You really don’t address the possibility that all (or most of) these suspect items may have been attributed and invented aspects of the base-story of a real human after the fact. (For example, even Christian churches commonly teach the part about Jesus’ birthday having been later attributed to him and associated with the winter solstice.)

Your Part 1 throws the baby out after determining (correctly) that the bathwater is very dirty.

In any case, we all take it in and separate the wheat from the chaff according to our own mental lenses.

From the perspective of the 9/11 Truth activist and the “Patriot Movement” in general, I would love to be able to hand out copies of Part 2 and Part 3 without the particular treatment of religion you make in Part 1. There are many thoughtful people out here who will think less of the entire piece after watching the intro part conclude that Jesus never existed - which, in all truth, you don't know for sure.

Thanks for doing it though – it’s very good work. Where/when can I buy the DVD?

Not quite

"For instance, do you believe that the empirical world is the final reality? If so, you are expressing a belief – not a ‘fact’ – no matter how many humans agree to say so. Such knowledge is not within the realm of the empirical."

Actually such knowledge is ONLY in the realm of the empirical we can only know what we can observe & experiment with thus making it a FACT as far we can possibly prove Scientifically.
Everything else is pure belief.

"From my experience, study and perspective, your conclusion that Jesus did not exist is a speculative leap (which ignores or is unaware of other solid historical sources) "

I will personally write you a check for $1000 for each and every "solid historical source" you can present for the "historical jesus" I assure you there are absolutely ZERO.

Yes, whatever we do lets not blow the cover off of religion.


like "judgement" should be judgment

this statement

"Not to mention you would think a guy who rose from the dead and all the other silly sci-fi crap,
would have made into into thousands of volumes of the historians... not a few paragraphs of dribble. Its pathetic."

is patently ridiculous. No one until 4 centuries later with Constantine's conversion would have any idea of the monumental impact of Christianity. Almost every religious sect has miracles attributed it, it was a requirement 2000 years ago. Doesn't mean that "thousands of volumes" would be written by historians. Give me a break.

News editor at The Watchman Report,, delivering 9/11 truth to the Christian community

Patently ridiculous is the

Patently ridiculous is the lack of foundation of your rebuke. You can blindly put down the info all you want. To think 400 yrs had to go by in order for people to "have any idea of the monumental impact of Christianity" is not the point being addressed. There are many historians living during and within a short period after the life of "Christ"... you think they would just let the "miracles" and "well known" life go for future generations to site? You argument is poor.. I'm sorry.

Show "you are just in denial." by Micahyah


it would those that believe in mythical sun gods in the 21st century are whom are in denial.

instead of being lazy, or just believing

what you see in a video, you should do some research into the roots of religious traditions in that region. They aren't all based on sun gods, and they aren't all from the same root. You have just fallen for a common fallacy promoted by people of new age religious belief systems.

You need to stop with the

"do your research" crap. I HAVE, which is why I know exactly what I am talking about.
I have researched religion probably for longer than you've been alive.

This has zero to do with "new age belief systems", it has to do with well documented archaeological fact & plain common sense.

just to bring this back to the subject of 9/11

why did you omit any mention of Larry Silverstein? Do you think he was an innocent victim of someone's plan to demolish his newly leased buildings? How sinister!


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NEW---> check out our revamped site!


good question. this isnt an

good question. this isnt an attack zeitgeist, i honestly want to know, why no mention of him?

"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Former Director, CIA

Silence is a text easy to misread.

Some other peculiarities I noticed: Talk about controlled mass media -- shows only Rupert Murdoch; Talk about world bankers' interests in WW1 -- omits the Balfour Declaration; Talk about that which shalt not be talketh about -- presents the offical story as gospel. Doesn't require an awful lot of imagination to detect a pattern there, or does it?

Maybe there is an innocent explanation for this -- if so, let's hear it, zeistgeistnyc. And please take note that I wouldn't be that suspicious were it not for the amazing production value of your movie.

interns < internets

The big break for christianity!

"No one until 4 centuries later with Constantine's conversion would have any idea of the monumental impact of Christianity."

Yes, the conversion of Constantine and his overtaking of the Roman Empire. Was the big moment for christianity. Perhaps as few as 2-3 % of the population were christian at the time. So it was basicly a christian coup d'etat. After that, it took a lot of violence to "persuade" the rest of the unbelievers. They destroyed the pagan high culture of antiquity and Europe went into the dark ages.

yes, and that proves my point.

Of the tens of thousands of cults in the first century CE, (thousands of whom were active in the city of Rome itself) who was going to know which of them would not only still be active over four hundred years later, but inexplicably become the state religion of the most powerful empire on earth even when it was only a couple percent of the population even then?

That's why the notion that there should be thousands of books written about a cult leader at the time of the foundation of the cult is ridiculous.

News editor at The Watchman Report,, delivering 9/11 truth to the Christian community


"inexplicably become the state religion of the most powerful empire on earth "

Huh? There is nothing inexplicaple in how christianity became the state religion. As stated in my previous post. They made a coup d'etat. They made their man Constantine Emperor. Created a reign of terror and forced this very alien Jewish religion upon all Romans and later on all Europeans. No one escaped.

It is true that the christians were a small sect among many others. But the point still stands. Jesus is not mentioned in any source outside the bible. You don't seem to find this troubling. But the Christians themselves has found this to be very embarrasing indeed. So embarrasing, that they through the centuries have lent themselves to blatant forgeries. The Josephus testimony is the best known.

It is quite inaccurate

to say that Christians "made a coup d'etat" and made "their man" Constantine Emperor....."created a reing of terror" etc. The truth is that Contantine co-opted Christianity and perverted it and it has never recovered.

The first 300 years after Christ, Christians were strictly non-violent. They did not participate in the military at all. Refusing to "defend" the empire was one of the main reasons they were persecuted by the Romans. Constantine, for the first time, merged Christianity and the state -- and by implication christianity and war.

Since that time, there has been no real Christianity practiced. Read Charles McCarthy (Center for Christian Non Violence), or Jaques Ellull (The Subversion of Christianity et al.). Read Tolstoy's the Kingdom of God is Within You (the book that influenced Ghandi and MLK). Read Adin Bellou's Christian Non-Resistance.

Read SOMETHING because it is apparent that you are very confused about this issue.

The 911 stuff was well done. I'll skip the comments of Christianity because if they are anything like what I'm reading here it will be a complete waste of my time.

they made him?

a small, 2% minority religion just made him convert? A coup d'etat is overthrowing the government buddy. It didn't get overthrown, the ruler converted, changed, and exploited a relative minor religion.

There are a few minor disputed sources.

You seem to not understand that there aren't many sources on just about ANYBODY from 2000 years ago, there aren't many written SOURCES from 2000 years ago. There's a reason why the world was excited about things like the discovery of the dead sea scrolls.

How many great historians today will you find covering a Hatian voodoo leader?

He didn't convert

he was "converted" as he was DYING by unscrupulous priest in order to make themselves more powerful.

There are LOTS of resources from 2000 years ago, ever read about Apollonius of Tyana? Julius Caesar? and so on, there are many volumes of works about MANY historical people from that time period.
There are even reams of material about just everyday life, everything from grocery list to squabbles about land and property, executions, crime, promotions etc.

There aren't "MANY"

written sources from 2000 years ago, geez. When we discover written documents that are 2000 years old, it is a huge discovery.

Or are you now denying the scientific facts of decay?

Also, there was just less written materials 2000 years ago, because all written materials had to be done and copied by hand, maybe you didn't know that. I thought everyone did. As a result of limited writing, most surviving written materials deal with very widespread traditional stories of a culture, or accounts of rulers. Not random cult leaders.

There are many 1000s

As usual your religious upbringing has destroyed what mind you have

hey, hey, what about the ashkenazis??

from what i have been reading, the ashkenazi jews are descended from the easter european khazars who converted to judaism some time in the 8th (?) century, in order to stand apart from the persian empire muslims and the roman empire/costantinian christians! so why do they think they have a claim to land in the middle east????



Constantine was not "Converted"

until he had no choice on his death bed.
Constantine forced the Council of Nicaea to condense & formulate one path for Christianity to follow and then he deified jesus.
Before the 4th century and these canonized gospels Christianity was all over the place with over 55 gospels mostly all Gnostic in origin and the character of jesus was mostly that of a prophet.
Constantine wanted a way to control the masses thus Christianity (Paulianity) was born.

There is not ONE single

contemporary historian that mentions any Jesus of Nazareth.
Don't let your denial of historical fact cloud your judgement.


Wow...Amazing work Zeitgeist !!

where to get the dvd?

IMO this would make a great dvd to hand out


WOW....only 32 minutes too, short but sweet....and full throttle on all cylinders....
Time to revise my Step One Reprogramming Strategy again .....all hands report to the burners!

"All that is necessary for evil to succeed is for good men to do nothing."
- Edmund Burke, 1729 - 1797

Burning Google Videos

Anyone know if you can or how you can burn Google Videos such as this one. I'm trying but can't figure it out. Thanks.

how to "Burn" google videos or any multimedia online

get videodownloader extension for firefox

Burning onto a Blank DVD?

I downloaded it through Google Video Player, but they won't let me burn it to an independent DVD that I could then pass around and pop in DVD players. Does this Videodownloader extension for firefox allow me to do that? Thanks. And appreciate the link as well. Peace.

I don't think you even read what I wrote

If you get the video downloader you can download .flv .avi or .mp4 files right off of the gvid server. I could tell you how you can download avi files just by getting the gvp file, but that's too complicated.

Flash to DVD

Download the Flash video (FLV) from Google or YouTube, then convert to AVI or MPG using another converter program. Now, take that result and burn THAT onto DVDR with your burning program.
Good luck!

This is what I use

It is a standalone product. Paste the web addy of the video and select your output format. I save videos as 320 x 240 AVI, then I use ConvertXtoDVD to build the menu and burn a DVD. I can usually get about 12 - 15 hours of internet quality video on to one DVD, which works great for people who don't have high speed connections, or just can't be bothered learning how to effectively use Google to find videos. If you download torrent files, here are some torrent links to the COnvertXtoDVD software . Hope this helps.

download the gvp

Download the "gvp" file and open it in notepad. Streak the line after the 2nd "http" and paste in the address bar in explorer. This will download the avi.

Excellent tip, thank you!

I did what Bo says, and got down a 711MB AVI file with nice quality 640*360 res. Good for putting on/converting to DVD.

Shortcut for the AVI file here:

Good 9/11 presentation, but why

the Jesus bashing conflated with it? To me, as a Christian, I'm saddened by that. I assume that the Jesus story has been mythologized, but the essential character shines through, not as a figment of imagination, but as a real historical character. A person who his early followers felt it wholly appropriate to think of, as Godsent, and as the son of God. Even if you peel away anything suspect as myth, as Bishop John Shelby Spong for example has done, you still cannot come away from an examination of the Gospels, and the Epistles, without encountering something quite extraordinary, and within Jesus' own historical contextual frame of reference, it's rather difficult to cleave the meaning from the cross, without attempting to obliterate Jesus from the historical record altogether.

So I'm both elated, and disheartened both at the same time with this release.
On the 11th day, of every month.

I understand.

I understand Robert. As a Christian myself I have a hard time believing this stuff. But we've been lied to so much. I believe much of what is in the Bible is symbolic as are a lot of Jesus's teachings, but I have a hard time believing that Jesus himself was symbolic. There have been many prophets alive throughout time. It is hard for me to fully grasp what is symbolic and what is real when it comes to the Bible and Jesus. I keep an open mind and try to make sense of the stuff as I learn it. Anyway good luck as well.

One Theosophical perspective is that....

over 8,000 masters(including the one called Jesus) have walked the earth. Dont underestimate Your potential.

I agree

as someone who spends most of my activism spreading 9/11 truth to Christians, it is unfortunate that this is included, because it renders the full video useless to me. And there are a lot of theories and speculation on the origins of the gospel stories, and the historicity of Jesus, but in no way are things clear as they are in the facts that we know about 9/11. What we know about specific people 2000 years ago is very little, unless they are rulers. Frankly, until the conversion of Constantine over four centuries later, no one would really realize how important the foundation of Christianity really would be. It's just unnecessy and works to decrease the range of people who you are going to reach with this video.

News editor at The Watchman Report,, delivering 9/11 truth to the Christian community

Useless to you? I suggest you do your homework.

The Christian / theistic myth has led the masses into a psychological Zeitgeist to accept other myths, such as 911, on little more than "faith".
Faith is useless.
This work took years to research and the fraud of Christianity if the most important in many ways, as it is the core of the problem from a social awareness standpoint.

Just because you believe something, doesn't means its true and having an open mind to new information while being prepared to
remove even fallacies you have had your whole life, such as religion, is the highest form of self awareness.

I suggest you take time to LEARN about "Jesus"... not from a book (the bible) that had dozens of incongruent Gospels and was re-translated a 100 times,
but from historical sources, while then understanding how religion is rooted in history. It becomes VERY obvious.

Show "I have two things to say" by Robert Rice

I'm not arrogant. I just

I'm not arrogant. I just don't care anymore. I'm tired of the lies.
The truth will be known.
Arrogance is Theism... think about it.
I believe in humanity and the collective consciousness.

And could it be, that the collective

consciousness, widely distributed, within a social-civilized framework, may terminate, at the apex of all consciousness, with a universal controversy involving an issue of authority, and rebellion against authority, and when I say that, I am not restricting the frame of reference, to our world alone..

Could it be, that we live within an acausal, transluminally connected, interdependant, holographic universe, where the distinctions between mind/body, and mind/body/reality are blurred?

"Thy will be done, on earth, as it is in the heavens."

As above, so below..

And an argument could be made, that mind and universe contain a "ghost in the machine" (read Jesus' conversation with "the woman at the well")

Perhaps it is you who assume too much, and think you know, when all the while the realm of knowledge resides within an unknown unknown, or what you didn't even know you didn't know..?

If Jesus WAS real, and his cross meaningul, then relative to the whole of it all, it's significance cannot be understated. "And the first shall be last and the last, first.."

It's a very BIG universe my friend.. and in the quantum realm of all possibility, given enough time, anything, anything at all can and will happen, even the fulfilling of prophecy, and the embodiment, of what was otherwise a myth, when that myth serves, as a valid frame of reference on the ground of all being and becoming, and here I am referring to Jesus' own frame of reference.

Have you read all the alleged words of this mythical figure, and can you be sure that his idiotic followers, a generation or two later were able to cobble the whole thing together from a collection of prior myths? How can you be so certain?
On the 11th day, of every month.

No one is "certain" of

No one is "certain" of anything per se. To know something is to collect the most amount of info available to come to a conclusion.
Sush a conclusion is knowing when it proves to be truth against all other avail. info.
Is gravity real?
Is Jesus real, as the son of Mary/who had 12 dis/ who walked on water/who transformed at the mount/who was crucified and rose from the dead?
... to weigh the possibility of this "character" known as Jesus being real, vs him not being real. There is no contest.
He sits with Santa, the Easter Bunny and the THOUSANDS of other gods/myths that have come and gone for thousands of years.
His source as a fictitious character is traceable to the Stellar/Solar Cults of antiquity, while the entire "story" of his life and his "co-stars" are
contrived as well.

So the Gospels and Paul's writings

they just popped out of nowhere, because the stars were properly aligned? And how precisely, were they able to reference all these other sources, and who among them, played the "voice" of Jesus?
On the 11th day, of every month.

You obviously have done no

You obviously have done no research. But go ahead- have fun with your beliefs.

real ignorance on display

you don't have to believe that Jesus was magical to understand his teachings. The easter bunny and santa claus have never, to the best of my knowledge, very effectively, credibly, and powerfully spoken out against corruption and injustice and on behalf of unity and love among all human beings.


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Neither has a mythological character

One can interpret whatever they wish from the Bible which is why there are more than 33,800 different sects of Christianity.

If you want unity and love among human beings then stick with Buddhism as its based on the teachings of a factual person and is not a religion but a "way of life".
Christianity is just re badged paganism with no basis in factual reality.



No, you're arrogant

To propose that 9/11 is still a myth because of christians is absolutely RETARDED.

Do you not even understand the lynch pin guy you have exposing 9/11 in your video IS a christian? David Ray Griffin? And a lot of the people who have really spearheaded this movement are christian as well?

You should take my advice of segmenting it for whichever group you are trying to reach. I'm sure the "rational" response squad people will love the first secion.

Show "No doubt the guy's" by Robert Rice

what kind of comment is

what kind of comment is this? this is what you choose to post?

Is it true?

I'm sorry, I should have framed it in the form of a question, to you.
On the 11th day, of every month.

about as catholic

as the current pope I'd wager...


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That isn't at all what I

That isn't at all what I said.

It is a psychological disposition... to believe based on faith.

And yes- I am very aware of some 911 truthers as being Christian's.
I am not against people... just lies. I have deep respect for Griffin and everyone else.
But I would be doing a disservice to myself and society
if I wasn't totally honest about my feelings about the world today.

You express yourself and so will I. If we disagree- so be it.
However, I can only hope you have put as much into
your belief system as I have from a RESEARCH standpoint.

Don't expect most to see the big picture.

911 was just so blatant a lie only a damn fool can't see it. I knew intuitively Xtainity was bullshit long before I actually did the research & saw just how blatant a rip off the whole Jesus myth is. No offense intended to anyone, just my opinion based on available facts.

That said, not too bad a film there. Although, I see you still have some research to do yourself regarding other sacred myths your film very briefly touches on near the end. Given your lucid dismantling of the current religious beliefs as the ages old story re-telling that they are, seeing that sacred myth referred to as a undeniable fact smacked slightly of disinfo. No offense, again, just my opinion.

trying to make 9/11 truth

a cause where we have to 'prove' atheism as well is an exercise in folly. Perhaps you should do some study of a concept called 'practicality'.

And nothing in your segment is new info to me, the same rehashed stuff.

I've already exposed your lack of historical knowledge in your point because you lack adequate historical knowledge of the Tanakh and its development. You just practice intellectual laziness to promote your belief system of how things were 2000 years ago that you think explains everything.

this isn't trying to prove

this isn't trying to prove atheism at all. it simply exposes the jesus myth. and in fact has a very strong spiritual thread specifically at the beginning (as viewed from the zeitgeist website) as well as the end. disbelieving the "official story" of christianity in no way negates spirituality or religion per se.

The only thing your exposing, Micahyah....

Is your true ignorance. This discussion, I believe, has nothing to do with atheism. I did consider myself an agnostic once upon a time, when I actually started questioning & researching history in general all the pieces started falling into place. Now I have to admit, I just don't know. There was so much history destroyed & hidden (much of it thanks to your xian crusades & inquisitions.) we may never have an accurate view of ancient cultures & technology. And yes, I believe this is by design.

There is much 'forbidden' history out there, and much more than you think from much further back than your 2000 year xian calendar. You referred to the Dead Sea Scrolls a few posts back, why do you think no one has been allowed to study them?

no one?

has been allowed to study the scrolls? are you sure? what about this new gospel of Judas? I have m suspicions about THAT, never thought to question the scrolls, since they don't seem to add all that much to christianity--aren't they mostly informative about the essene sect of Judaism?


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Well, I didn't study the story very close.

I just find it highly suspect that only very 'interesting' groups were given access at first and they were very reluctant to release anything regarding them at all for a very long time. There also seems to be a lot of different 'translations' & very little consensus, very typical when the PTB seek to obscure & detract from anything we aren't privileged to.

I've done all the research

and looking into history. The smartest thing you said in that post is we may never have an accurate view of ancient cultures.

Keeping things hidden by design? What, like the end of Raiders of the Lost Ark? From your post, it is evident that your belief system contains thoughts that ancient powerful technology has somehow been suppressed by the powers that be over millenia-long conspiracies. That's fine for you to think that, but you must accept that its speculation, not based on fact or practicality.

And plenty of researches have been allowed to study the Dead Sea Scrolls since their discovery.

You probably saw some video CLAIMING that NO ONE has been allowed to study them because it sounds really cool and the video was trying to posit a new age/gnostic belief system. So you took fiction, like the da vinci code/holy grail stuff, or the protocols of zion forgery, and accepted it as true.

I have no problem with you having whatever belief system you want, I do have a problem with you disparaging another belief system and thinking that your belief system isn't a belief system but factual. It's a belief system like any other, positing truth and spirituality.

And stuff like this, "your xian crusades & inquisitions." is just annoying. I had nothing to do with the crusades or the inquisitions. Maybe you should also do more research into how much change was done to the Christian belief system when it was taken over and made into the Roman state religion. If you can't see the Imperial nature to both the crusades and the inquisitions, you might fall for the U.S. being over there in Iraq because there is a clash of civilizations that the terruh-ists started on 9/11.

"not based on fact or practicality." LOL...

That there is pretty ironic considering your defense of a fairy tale. I don't care what you believe & I have no response to your MSM style ad hominem, which seems what every attempt at an honest discussion of religion with an Xian is reduced to. Let's just agree 911 was an inside job & leave it there.

BTW, There's much proof of ancient technology that FAR surpasses that of today, you just have to seek it out.

aww, defensive much?

sorry I hurt your feelings.

"There's much proof of ancient technology that FAR surpasses that of today, you just have to seek it out."

Look who's defending fairy tales? There's speculation, not proof, just like there's speculation of Bigfoot.

What is fact, and not speculation, is that there were hundreds of jewish sects in the turbulent period of a couple centuries in Judea from after the Maccabbeean revolt until the destruction of the second temple and the Roman-caused diaspora. There were various disputes not only over the rule of Judea by the Romans and their allied religious leaders, but also over the weight that the written Torah should be given compared to the now newer developed tradition of the oral Torah (which began with the Babylonian Talmud).

Hurt my feelings? Rarely does ignorance make me feel...

anything but pity for the poor fool spewing their ignorance as fact, as you seem to excel at. Funny thing is your 'indiana jones' & 'bigfoot' detractions have more to do with your fairy tale beliefs than anything I've offered. Please, keep flaunting your ignorance, I never said you had to believe anything I've said. I just figured you might actually check for yourself instead of continuing to "open your mouth & remove all doubt.".

Here's just one example of my 'speculation'. There is much more, but you won't look. What's YOUR proof again?

Saul of Tarsus (turned Paul) might beg to differ..

It should be noted, that he was a contemporary of the older Peter, and the two conflicted greatly over the intended recipients of the Gospel message, whether it was for Jew alone, or for Gentile as well, and by extension the whole world. Paul in his letters, was very clear and consistent, both about his own experience on the road to Damascus, and his legalistic interpretations of the significance and meaning of Jesus, his life, teachings, death and resurrection, which Paul bore witness to in his blinding light experience. I myself have had profound spiritual experiences, which cause me to know, though I don't profess to know a whole lot, that there are indeed powers and principalities not of this world, both of "light" and "darkness" or of good, and evil.

Not only have I attended a talk by John Shelby Spong wherein he rather painfully, stripped away all the mythology surrounding Jesus, but I'm also familiar with the Jesus Seminar people, who have worked diligently to wittle down the actual sayings which may be attributed to Jesus. Together, with this video (and I did find it rather informative and eyeopening), there is, I firmly believe, enough of a historical kernel left, upon which to "know" Jesus, the person, and I still find him, his teachings, and his method of execution, to represent a valid frame of reference for my faith.

C.S. Lewis observed, that sometimes the story, and the reality, intersect, and in his experience, as a student of storytelling, any sufficiently open minded probe of the Gospels, and the ministry of Paul in particular, reveals a level of genious, so unfathonably rich and multifaceted, and so wholly alien to our human conceptions of truth, and justice, that it bore the fingerprints of none other than God, and that by extension Jesus was who he claimed to be.

There's still enough left over, reading between even the few lines that remain, to discern a meaning and a significance, of unparalled dimension. It is still just as meaningful, and informative, provided that Jesus actually lived and died in accordance with the story, and from his own perspective, I do believe that Jesus was himself well aware, as an accomplished "craftsman" and philosopher or "metaphysician", in his own right, to have discerned his own heritage, and unique calling, as the personification of the myth, framed, at least in part, (+OT influences) by the prior helliocentric worldview informing his culture with it's rich symbolism and architype.

But if Jesus and his teachings, and his death and resurrection (testified to by Paul) is not true, then I must say that it's rather difficult to explain the spiritual and psychological efficacy of such a myth, and at the very least, as I mentioned to a minister I used to talk to, who would himself express his doubt about it all (he was a Mason as well), it's a "God approved mythology" in so far as it works, it really does, and without it, I'd have no way to explain the very subtle and gentle pats on the head I occasionally recieve, when I speak or think about God and spiritual matters. Maybe I should check for lice or something..?

When I testify as to him, God in turn testifies to me.
On the 11th day, of every month.


was a full blown delusional psychotic that suffered from Temporal Lobe Epilepsy, physical deformity, and the last 20 years of his life he thought each and every day was his last.
and how can this complete loon testify about a person he clearly never met?


yes, I too, Robert.

regarding funding, no mention of Dov Zakheim and the missing trillions...

By the way, i stood alone on my street with my sign last night:
"Remember + Reopen 9/"

"Today's mighty oak is just yesterday's nut,

that held its ground." ~ Unknown

Good work "kate of the kiosk" (I've always loved your handle, it's cute)
On the 11th day, of every month.

you're worried about trillions?

Kate, the Patsystanis wired $100,000 to MOSSADMED ATTA. Who CARES how many trillions in weapons systems disappeared from the Pentagon--and Dov Zakheim? What does his involvement as comptroller of the Pentagon AND role in a company that develops remote navigation systems for planes have to do with 9/11?? Hee hee. Good job hitting the streets. I spent about half an hour holding a sign this morning before work. It's actions like those that will win this, believe it!


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no man, that would be racist. :-) i was actually called a bigot here yesterday, but not for the reason your probably thinking, haha.

"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Former Director, CIA

Telling the FACTS

about Christianity is not "bashing". Its just telling the facts.

Same with 9/11, telling the truth about 9/11 is not a crazy conspiracy theory, or bashing the 9/11 families, or unpatriotic, or un-American etc. Its just the facts anyone that thinks otherwise is merely in denial of those facts.

I think they should scrub

I think they should scrub the Kevin Cosgrove ending. It's an obvious fake. You can hear other people screaming etc. and no explosions......

There are some contradictions in the story about him too it seems. He was apparently talking to an operator but according to this Newsday story he was talked to his brother last.

Also in the full audio clip he is in the middle of a supposedly raging inferno and starts being sarcastic about the operator being in an air conditioned building ... that seems strange.... and "tell god to blow the wind from the west" another strange statement.
Since when does a 47 year old man with 7 kids say "we're young men , were not ready to die. Does this guy look liike a young man?

John Ostaru might be a fictitous person . I can't find anything out about the guy . He's not on any victims lists etc...

Seems fishy and too convenient.

why would ik be fake ?

it makes no sense, such a call is well within the realm of possibilities, probably more people were on cell phones when it happened,
hearing no explosions ?

I think he said "oh my good" when the building started moving and the explosion on that floor destructed the phone immidiately so that couldn't of course be heard

other ideas ?

Not sure if I like it.

There is a lot of good info in this 3 part film. But its style is too hysterical and propagandalike. Just like the "war on terror" hoax, it seems to be based on creating and manipulating fear (the third part). It also contains some facts that I sure would like to check.

I liked the first part best. Exposing xtianity for the fraud that it is, is always a good thing.

go ahead

check your facts, if you can - the whole thing's absolutely intruiging - great job, zeitgist - where in the world did you get all that footage - is it all licensed? - if so, must have cost a fortune - hope you get a ton of screeings - would love to see it in full definition - did you send it to Brave New Films? Are you offering it for small-venue screenings?

Great Film.

Absolute brilliant flow to this film. And tons of incredible information. Last time I felt this way about a movie was when I saw WKJO - Who Killed John O'neill. I appreciate the time and artistry you put into this film. Peace bro.


that's one vid i have not seen...but know the story.

Grand Slam!!!!!!

Couldn't stop watching. Best movie I've seen in quite some time.

Homework for Jesus(TM)

Was Constantine "converted," or did Constantine fabricate a grand new religion at Nicaea, like a gaggle of Hollywood producers banging out a new "hit?"

If you can, debunk this:

The Forged Origins of The New Testament

In the fourth century, the Roman Emperor Constantine united all religious factions under one composite deity, and ordered the compilation of new and old writings into a uniform collection that became the New Testament.

70 Disturbing Facts About 9/11

John Doraemi publishes Crimes of the State Blog

johndoraemi --at--

They cant johndoraemi

as it is well documented fact.
All they can do is deny the facts, same as a Young Earth Creationist can look you straight in the face and flaty deny the Earth in more than 10,000 years old even with all the absolutely overwhelming evidence. Its called Cognitive Dissonance leading to delusional psychosis.
Religious insanity.

The Corporation.

911 and religion

Why has 911 blogger now become a forum for religious proseltyzing ?

Religious detox.

"religious proseltyzing ?" ?

I would rather call it religious detoxification or de-programming of the mind.


People need to be deprogrammed to stop accepting mythology & faith as fact.
In order to believe Christianity one has to completely divorce themselves from factual reality.

hmmm let's see...

A very well made documentary out of new york city that mentions ISI wire transfer several times and Larry Silverstein zero times. Does not mention Israel. Does not mention Mossad. Includes Uncle Fetzer and David Shayler, by now known by everyone to be frauds.

To top it off, it is part of a series that includes an attack on the veracity of the Jesus story. Because, the maker says, he's tired of the lies. Well, how about the "holocaust"? You can go back 2000 years to point out that there isn't any evidence of Jesus having existed but you can't go back 60 years to point out that there is no evidence of mass gassings or huge crematoria or 6 million dead? How... selective of the maker of this vid that doesn't mention Israel or Larry Silverstein or the Dancing Mossad agents "documenting" the event.

While I may not be able to prove that Jesus existed, and while I do not personally believe he was the son of god any more than we all are, I know from what I read of what are supposed to be his teachings that his ideas are not just profound, they are still relevant today. Jesus condemned the corruption of the religious authorities of his time, and their collaboration with an imperial power. My god what a timely message that is even today. And one that, given that modern day Judaism is more and more defined by corrupt Zionism, and Christianity by corrupt wolves in sheep's clothing, is such a threat to the folks who brought us 9/11--the cabal of Bush-appointed Israel-first neocons and Zionist gangsters.

Well done zeitgeist, but not well enough--some of us can see right through this as easily as we can see through Alex Jones' paleoconservatism being used to prepare the ground for the day when DEMOCRATS become the keepers of the sacred lie of 9/11. Remember the last time we had a democrat president and the "terrorists" were McVeigh and the right wing Christian militias? Just wait until Hillary steals the next election and 9/11 truth is then portrayed as a right wing nut preoccupation. Don't worry about whether global warming is real or not, the whole idea of AJ denouncing it is again to set up 9/11 truth as being against "progressive" values. Didn't I just also see a picture of some Waco type dud with a gun stuffed in his pants posing with the great Rudkowski? Who now works for AJ along with Jason Bermas? Oh yeah, clear as frikkin day.

So through all this noise, the truth just becomes clearer and clearer. Not everyone is deceived though, or afraid to call out the self-proclaimed "heroes" of the truth movement. We're just getting started and we will expose the wolves in sheep's clothing. The first SHALL be last, and the truth will win in the end. Count on it.


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I agree

btw, global warming seems to be real but not caused by humans, also unstoppable by humans so taxing us more (for CO2) will not cool the world but fill the pockets of certain people just some more...

besides that it is a beautifully done documentary (with some errors)

true enough

I can see both sides of the global warming debate and I lean towards it just being part of the long term variation of the earth's temperature--to think it would be static is irrational. Is pollution a problem generally? Of course, but frankly I'm more concerned about toxins being dumped in water than about co2 levels. Or the use of depleted uranium. To me the whole focus on co2 is precisely because it can be credibly argued both ways and as such is a perfect tool to divide people. As is god. As is the issue of handguns. That is precisely why a tool of the controlled truth movement like Alex Jones makes them all mainstays of his propaganda.

This film here is indeed quite well made, which says to me that it was done by a professional. Professional WHAT is my question... :) When a really tight piece of propaganda is made that very conspicuously leads us away from some very important issues and towards some distracting issue, I think the obvious conclusion is that the perps are getting into the movement with all of their experience in making slick pieces of disinfo.


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You make some GREAT points here, and elsewhere in this thread.

Just look at what this video has done to this discussion.

BEWARE the dividers.

Global warming

and mans role in it is about as proven today as is Evolutionary Theory. In other words rock solid.

Anyone that thinks this has to to with race, such as the Jews...

"Real Truther" is a delusional moron. Or, he is clearly CENTOM infiltrating this blog to try to disgrace the power of this film. What a sad sad sad day that people try to pin 9/11 on some sort of jewish plot - or equally as delusional, a Zionist plot. This isn't Harry Potter, this isn't Lord of The Rings, this isn't The Wizard of Oz - this is real, and what Zeitgeist is sharing with us is real... our "Real Truther" claiming that the holocaust was a fraud is a delusional embarrassment. 9/11 was an inside job, but not by some 'race' of humans. If greed is a race then call it that, but don't start blaming the jews like some delusional lunatic. Likewise, while Larry S. did say he 'pulled' the building, that will never ever ever hold in court. Let it go. Everyone fighting it will say "he was talking about the firefighters" - whether it's true or not.... let it go. We have plenty more to go on. Plenty more blatent evidence to go on. "Real Truther" is a real bigot, and a real moron. "Real Truther" is a real disgrace to this movement. Go back to sleep "Real Truther". Let reason deal with this event. You have no business here. I can't believe that this person actually said that the holocuast was a fraud. Did you watch PART 3 "Real Truther"?

where's Lazlo Toth?

When we need him?

let's see... 10 hours registered and you already sussed me out!

congratulations, Mr. Last Person to Sign Up!

You'll have to do better than "Real Truther is a real moron". Here's a tip--when you come in with guns blazing like this, you may want to understand your target audience. Denying Zionist involvement in 9/11 is like denying Diebold involvement in election fraud. Nowhere did I mention Jews. All I did (which is all anyone ever does to invite this kind of transparent rant) is mention names of a few criminals who happen to be Jewish. Uh oh! Everyone KNOWS Jews are VICTIMS, NOT CRIMINALS!! Criminals are black, or hispanic like RT. Or German. Or arab. Or muslim. Now if I were like some other people, I would accuse Diamonds of being an anti-hispanic bigot, but since I actually have truth on my side I don't need to stoop to that. Also, there is no powerful hispanic lobby to back me up so I'd be wasting my time!

So, Mr. just signed up--are you really new here or are you an existing user who has created a new identity to attack RT with? Are you actually Larry Silverstein here because no one is willing to risk their freedom for a shrivelled old gangster who will go down in history as worse than Hitler, who was in fact just a pawn of the Zionists who wanted their little imperial enclave in the middle east and knew that a massacre of their fellow Jews would do the trick? Or haven't you read the 51 Documents of Zionist Collaboration With Nazis by Lenni Brenner? You, Zionist, are the Jew-hater. YOU, Zionist, are the freedom hater. YOU Zionist, are an arab and muslim hater. YOU, Zionist, know that Israel is not going to be an exclusively Jewish state for long. YOU Zionist, are trying to exonerate your Zionist friends and pin the blame on Americans for the murder of their own. YOU, Zionist, are scared of people like me who are not afraid to say anything. YOU, Zionist, will have to do better than this to silence me. I DARE you, Zionist scum. Bring it on! Start something you will never be able to finish and that will hasten your downfall. DO IT!!


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Wow, this is why we are seen as kooks.

I hope everyone reads "Real Truther"'s entries. He/she represents everything we stand against. Notice his/her taunting aggressive rants. Notice the instability in the delivery. Notice the utter delusion and blatent sabotage. If anyone from the press or related is reading this blog today, please note that this treasonous provacateur is not one of us. If you want to rant and rave about Jews and Zionists, grab your white outfit and white hat and march in the outskirts of Mississipi or Alabama or any of the other parts of the world where civilization remains thumbless... where people fall for your bigoted lunacy.

Real Truther: Watch part 3 of Zeitgeist. Pay close attention to the last 5 minutes, it might serve you well.

look mr just signed up to comment...

I'm Puerto Rican and have black blood as most PR people do. So take your klever KKK reference back to the southern poverty law center to scare a few more black people into the cold embrace of the democratic plantation mommies. To tell you the truth I'm getting tired of being sensitive to people's feelings when it's clear that all that does is encourage people like you. I will not, however, fall into the trap you like so many to fall in which is to make people either genuinely dislike Jews or seem to. That trick is by now so transparent that it is plain to see. You WANT Jews to think that no Jews are guilty of 9/11 crimes so that you can tell them that people like me say so because we hate Jews. Except that in my case I do not. I feel solidarity with Jews who have been used and abused throughout history, most recently by the wolves in sheep's clothing who assure the Jews of the world that they are their champions and defenders when in fact they are the source of the most violence against Jews there has ever been. 9/11 has taught us that leaders and the powerful lie so grandiosely that the little guy never realizes it. Too bad that won't work anymore after 9/11. I don't know the entire truth about WW2 but I do know that Zionists collaborated with Hitler because Hitler's anti-Jewish rhetoric was just what the doctor ordered for their imperialist project of land theft in Palestine. Innocent Jews were attacked by Zionists to get them to flee to Palestine (or rather to fight the innocents there so as to take their land for the Zionists.) As an American who was attacked on 9/11 with the help of corrupt factions of our own government I can sympathize with anyone, especially Jews, who are victims of such a protection racket. Hey, we didn't hurt you but we know who did, and unless you pledge unquestioning allegiance to us it will happen again. SO obvious. SO frikkin obvious. All history is written by the powerful for their benefit. I now know to question. Soon so will every Jew in the world, and they will elarn who their real enemy has been all along. And I will welcome those Jewish brothers and sisters with open arms and lots of love. You make me sick, you know that? This crap has gone on long enough and I say to you right now that I will have to a cold corpse before I stop fighting your lies. And when I'm gone others will continue to fight for a future not ruined by your lies, fake history, and divide and conquer tactics that thrive on hate and ignorance. Much love to eevryone out there who speaks the truth no matter how lonely you feel I'm with you and I know you're with me. We are the victors and from now on we will wirte the history.


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all history is written...

by the powerful..
wow, i am reading Michael Parenti's Julius Caesar - a people's history right now! so true, so true.

um, I watched the last five minutes

And I suppose you think that because it's all about love and how we are all one, then we can't possibly doubt the motives of whoever made it huh? You know, it may not be a coincidence that Bill Clinton gave a graduation talk recently and mentioned how genetically humans are 99.9% the same. Oh yeah, absolutely, and I've made this point before to many people. That doesn't mean he actually thinks that based on that similarity people should be good to one another, does it? Because if there has been a president as corrupt as Dubya (or more) it was BJ. How nice when our oppressors tell us to love one another! Why, I think I'll denounce Hitler next! And then praise flowers for being pretty and smelling so nice! Uh huh, like I said, great documentary, but also a greatly deceptive one. Yes we should all love one another, and yes we are all part of one big happy organism. That is precisely why we need to remove cancers like Larry Silverstein from society. What I find interesting is how clearly zeitgeistnyc sees the events of 2000 years ago but how clouded his judgement is by blind faith when it comes to something as recent as 60 years ago. Where is the bold skeptic then? Oh, you know.... toeing the baseless mainstream narrative. Ha!


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diamonds are the best

if you like shiny things that in reality are worth nothing more than toothpaste. oh yeah, diamonds are also the best if you support slave labor, murder, child labor, etc..
awesome name, newcomer!

Take a deep breath...

Take a deep breath. We don't need a fuzzy thesis here folks- so regroup and get back on track.

I'm done

and breathing nicely, thank you!


Real Truther a.k.a. Verdadero Verdadero - Harvard Task Force

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Don't look at the Zionists behind the curtain!

The media and disinfo artists purposefully confuses the Zionist issue with the Judaism thing in order to program people to react emotionally whenever anybody wants to point out the DOCUMENTED extent of Zionist influence in the US. So, your nonsense about "anti-Semite holocaust denying kooks" is simply your programmed reaction at work, exactly how they want you to think.

Just consider a simple fact: 12 of 14 top Neocons in the Bush Administration are Zionists. Google it! Several of them even have DUEL ISRAELI CITIZENSHIP:

Paul Wolfowitz
Elliot Abrams
David Wurmser
Lewis Libby
Richard Perle

And ALL the other Neocons have important ties and involvement in Zionism. For example,
Douglas Feith - Managing Attorney for Feith & Zell, P.C. (a merger with an Israeli law firm who now deals with reconstruction contracts coming out of Iraq) Absolute Zionist. Feith and Zell was Douglas Feith and Marc Zell a man who moved his family to an Israel settlement Alon Shevut in the West Bank. I don't even have time to list all the other Zionist connections to the Neocons. Research it yourself, if you really want to know what's going on. Unless you would rather not know. In that case, there is s term for that - Intentional Ignorance

And we're barely getting started! You have a lot to learn about Zionism. Do some more homework. And, PLEASE STOP CONFUSING JEWS WITH ZIONISTS.

Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon: "I don't care what the American people think, we own congress."

During an argument between the Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon and Foreign Minister Shimon Peres, Peres said that Isralis' policies of continued violence might "turn the US against us". To this Sharon retorted: "EVERY TIME WE DO SOMETHING, YOU TELL ME AMERICANS WILL DO THIS AND WILL DO THAT. I WANT TO TELL YOU SOMETHING VERY CLEAR: DON'T WORRY ABOUT AMERICAN PRESSURE ON ISRAEL; WE, THE JEWISH PEOPLE, CONTROL AMERICA. AND THE AMERICANS KNOW IT." -- Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon October 3, 2001 (IAP News)

Letter from James Abourezk, former US Senator from South Dakota on the Israel Lobby dated December 2006

""I can tell you from personal experience that, at least in the Congress, the support Israel has in that body is based completely on political fear—fear of defeat by anyone who does not do what Israel wants done. I can also tell you that very few members of Congress—at least when I served there—have any affection for Israel or for its Lobby. What they have is contempt, but it is silenced by fear of being found out exactly how they feel. I’ve heard too many cloakroom conversations in which members of the Senate will voice their bitter feelings about how they’re pushed around by the Lobby to think otherwise. In private one hears the dislike of Israel and the tactics of the Lobby, but not one of them is willing to risk the Lobby’s animosity by making their feelings public."

Watch this video
Not so cool facts about Israel

Listen to this:
Christopher Jon Bjerknes Interviews Jim Condit, Jr.
May 23, 2007

More important history of Zionism:

The Hidden History of Zionism
By Ralph Schoenman

Timeline of Zionist Terror from
The UN Report Prepared for Ralphe Bunche from a UN committee 01 October 1948

9/11 must be viewed within this wider context of the Zionist program in order to really understand its significance. If you want to read a book on 9/11 that puts it in this fuller context, get "9/11 The Ultimate Truth"by Laura Knight-Jadczyk, Joe Quinn

The ultimate plan of the Zionists:

In his Complete Diaries, Vol.II, Page 711, Theodor Herzl, the founder of Zionism, says that the area of the Jewish state stretches: "From the Brook of Egypt to the Euphrates".

Rabbi Fischmann, member of the Jewish Agency for Palestine, declared in his testimony to the U.N. Special Committee of Enquiry on July 9, 1947:

"The Promised Land extends from the River of Egypt to the Euphrates. It includes parts of Syria and Lebanon."

Have you heard any politician in any office in the United States actually oppose Israel or defend Palestinian rights? Let alone call for the dismantling of the State of Israel? Many elected officials opposed the apartheid state of South Africa, why don't any oppose Israel? Think about it. The way that Israel controls politicians and public opinion in the U.S. has been extensively documented.

I suggest you read two articles, one short, one long, from two sources who would appear to know of what they speak:

The first:

"The Israel Lobby"

John Mearsheimer and Stephen Walt

The second:

"War Launched to Protect Israel - Bush Adviser"

In fact, in this second short one, a quote suffices:

"Why would Iraq attack America or use nuclear weapons against us? I'll tell you what I think the real threat (is) and actually has been since 1990 -- it's the threat against Israel," Zelikow told a crowd at the University of Virginia on Sep. 10, 2002, speaking on a panel of foreign policy experts assessing the impact of 9/11 and the future of the war on the al-Qaeda terrorist organisation.

Also, FYI, Zelikow is no ordinary "advisor" to Bush because, as Executive Director of the 9/11 Commission, he was given the task of carrying off the greatest White Wash in political history, and his bio would seem to justify it:

Prof. Zelikow's area of academic expertise is the creation and maintenance of, in his words, "public myths" or "public presumptions." In his academic work and elsewhere he has taken a special interest in what he has called "'searing' or 'molding' events [that] take on 'transcendent' importance and, therefore, retain their power even as the experiencing generation passes from the scene

Think about Zelikow, himself a Zionist, and his "creation and maintenance of public myths" and the fact that he has stated that the Iraq invasion was by the USA, FOR Israel, and it only happened because 9/11 happened, the official story about which is clearly a "public myth".

Then, if you really want to see what all this fuss is about Zionist influence of world events, here's some deep history to research. I guarantee that if you take the time to actualy research this, it will blow your mind at just how deep this Zionist conspiracy of world events actually goes.

The Controversy of Zion by DOUGLAS REED

The above is a big read. If you want to start with a more condensed version, a shorter read, have a look at this:
The Myth of Tiny, Little Israel: Zionist Tentacles Everywhere

WHOA, Keenan!!

What are you DOING?? An anti-Zionist post without links to David Duke and the KKK? How dare you! People are going to think that normal everyday non-haters actually think ill of poor little Israel! People are going to think Zionist means "land-grabbing imperialist european liar" instead of "Jew". I bet you don't even OWN a copy of the Protocols of the Elders of Zion... dude, are you like, getting all GENUINE on us??


Real Truther a.k.a. Verdadero Verdadero - Harvard Task Force

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Shhhhhh...You'll blow my cover!

Hey, shhhhh you're forgetting the plan! First we pretend to be reasonable, non-haters to trick people into reading all these insignificant facts of history. Then, after we fool them into thinking that we actually have some genuine history to point to, that's when we bust out the David Duke stuff, White Power posters, swastikas, and confederate flags, put on our KKK robes, and run around shouting racist epithats. And then we recruit them to our neo-nazi club.

Say, when is our next neo-nazi meeting? I wrote down 4:20 (for Hitler's birthday 4/20, ya know, ha ha ha) on Friday, is that right?

Hey, gotta go now, gotta lynch another Jew...see ya at the neo-nazi meeting...

Oh, and don't mention to anyone at the meeting that my girlfriend is Jewish (Hebrew) and that I have other Jewish friends - it might confuse people.

oh ok sorry!

and a big ol' sieg heiladoodledo to you too brother! btw please don't tell the other klansmen that I too have "known" Jewish women, or that I'm puerto rican and have dark skinned relatives! while it's true I'm a self-hater they may not believe me! ok back to the nice-guy anti zionist act!


Real Truther a.k.a. Verdadero Verdadero - Harvard Task Force

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Wow. Total lololololllooloollll! Great! guys!

Thanks for the laughts!

You can't hide a lie for long. Truth shall come out.



Dov Zakheim

Please do not omit this man.

Dov Zakheim

For those of you unfamiliar with this man, please do the research.

Here's a start:

Another dual citizen responsible for stealing approx. $3 Trillion (yes Trillion with a "T") (give or take a few hundred billion) over the course of his illustrious Pentagon career.

The public announcement of over $1Trillion unaccounted for Pentagon dollars was made on Sept. 10, 2001. Then something happened to sidetrack this huge story of fraud. I guess nobody is worried about that money anymore.

Astonishing times, indeed.

2.3 trillion I think

But not all gone missing under Zakheim is it? I could be wrong but I think the 2.3 T figure is cumulative, not just during his tenure. No doubt he needs to be scrutinized, though, and the silence is deafening...


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From the article I linked....

"Again, during Zakheim’s tenure as Pentagon controller from May 4, 2001, to March 10, 2004, over $3 trillion dollars were unaccounted for." A trillion a year.......a very productive fellow, indeed!

This dual citizen has been intimitely involved in US policy since the Regan administration. Something tells me $3 Trillion does not even begin to cover it.

Just let that sink in for a moment........

The really scary thing is that we are seeing only the beginning stages of their long term plans.

Make no mistake about it, these people will not be satisfied until America is bled white and its potential to ever become a threat to their plans is extinguished once and for all.


I'm curious how these numbers are arrived at, given our entire defense budget is more like half a trillion per year, and less back then...


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Surely you are not suggesting

that the Pentagon gets x amount of dollars per year based on a "budget" and then spends all those funds in during that year and then gets x amount of dollars more when the next budget is passed? That is not how it works.

I don't know the writer's source because I did not write the article, but to think that theft from the Pentagon would be limited to the published defense budget for a particular year is just silly.

oh ok

sorry, i didn't realize your quote was from the article you linked to before--i'll check it out!


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Interesting stuff.

I haven't done much research on the Zionist angle yet, but it is obvious that this is part of the story. The neocon roll-call speaks volumes. Also I can see that this might be phase two of their long term strategy.

Phase one: Create universal sympathy for the jews by getting Hitler to slaughter millions. Create Israel.
Phase two: Create universal hatred for Muslims by framing them for 9/11. Use the ensuing chaos to deepen Anglo-American-Israeli hegemony in the middle east.

However, I don't think we should try to single out zionists as the "real" culprits. It is obvious that this is a quest for world domination, and as such it is a collaboration between Zionists, Fake Americans who are really collectivists, Brittania, and some of the factions within "old Europe". I'm trying to get a handle on China and Russia too. I can't tell whether they are genuinley opposed to what is going on, or if they are just being set up to play the next "bad guy". Being that our current leaders definitely seem to be totalitarian collectivists, I can't see them having any genuine beef with China.
"Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without." - Buddha
"What you do will be insignificant, but it is very important that you do it." - Gandhi
"The Sun never shined on a cause of greater worth." - Thomas Paine

don't be afraid--history is more complex than the schoolbooks

as we all now know full well... It's not as simple as saying Zionists are an evil death cult. Just like it's more complicated than an Islamofascist death cult or an NWO death cult. FACTS people, that's what this is about. Not identifying someone you disagree with and trying to pin everything in the world on them... People always accuse anyone who points out Zionist wrongdoing of hating Jews when it's obvious Zionists are guilty as hell first and foremost of stealing land, and plenty more before and after. Does that mean Zionists invented crime, or AIDS, or anything else? Of course not and only those making simplistic smear accusations would even pretend to think that's what we mean.

Do we sound strident and combative? Hells yeah! How else should one respond to the crimes of AIPAC and the neocons in America? Does it matter that some of them are Jews, some Christians, and some just plain criminal opportunists? NO! It maters that they think anyone had a right to declare a new country on someone else's land! And people who would do that, I'm open to considering that they did worse. Was it world Jewry conspiring? What a joke! Zionists represented maybe .001% of the world's Jews. The Zionists did not poll the world's Jews, they moved in upper class circles amidst aristocrats and bankers! They cut deals with these swine, and yes, were all too happy to collaborate with Hitler, whose views on racial purity and segregation they supported! Really you all should read Lenni Brenner's book (yes he's Jewish) and understand the dynamics of pre war Germany. Also listen to the talk by Benjamin Freedman about what Zionists were doing to hurt Germany even before Hitler came to power--the motive? To help Britain in WW1 in exchange for Palestine which Britain ruled over at the time. It is the history of ALL of us and incriminates Zionists and a number of other, non-Jewish elites--in fact some of the heores in the real history ARE Jews!

Ask questions, demand answers, and if youé NOT a hater, don't let them call you one or even make you feel like on for having doubts in the face of such persistent fabrications from the elites. Trust nothing but your own sense and senses! Be especially wary of people who don't want certain things even mentioned! Use 9/11 as a lens to take another look at everything you think you believe--THAT is the road to understanding in this case...


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Well said! The real division is between psychopaths and normal..

The real division within humanity is not between ethnic, religious, cultural, racial, left/right or any other false divisions that has been programmed into the masses. The most crucial division to understand is between PSYCHOPATHS and normal people with counsciences. 2-4% of the population are essential/genetic psychopaths. They are in EVERY culture, religion, and race. We only hear about the stupid psychopaths who get themselves arrested. The intelligent ones gravitate to positions of power in politics, business, religion, etc., and form secret fascist societies where they can manipulate people by the millions, and kill and slaughter by the millions, and then be made heroes over it!

It just so happens that one of the more dominant groups of psychopths currently and for the last 100 years are ZIONISTS, or ZIONIAZIS. Perhaps one reason is because of the perfect dove tail that the Judaic Talmud philosphy provides - operating under the cover of a VICTIM RELIGION full of manufactured MYTHS to rally the group around and justify genocidal behavior towards others, as well as a RACIAL SUPERIORITY RELIGION - God's chosen people vs GOYIM. Remember, before the manufactured HOLOCAUST MYTH (partial myth because lots of Jews WERE killed, and remember, HOLOCAUST is a JEWISH WORD THAT MEANS SACRIFICE - think about that for a minute), there was a previous myth about the Jews escaping Egyptian slavery. In fact, the whole JEWS HELD AS SLAVES IN EGYPT MYTH NEVER HAPPENED.

But these psychopaths could just have well used a different religion or ideology, to infiltrate. Communism, Capitalism, you name it-ism, most ideologies and religions have worked quite well throughout history, thank you very much.

Because the 96% or so of normal people have consciences, they usually can't imagine that some humans don't have a coonscience. THAT CRUCIAL FACT, THE LACK OF PSYCHOLOGICAL KNOWLEDGE AMONG NORMAL PEOPLE, is what allows the conscienceless Psychopaths to get away with all they are doing - nobody wants to believe it is possible that there are a certain group of humans among us who are missing that one thing that makes humans really human - the normal human conscience, and therfore can kill their own grandmother or torture and slaughter millions of humans without even a pin prick of guilt.

THE PSYCHOPATH - The Mask of Sanity

Special Research Project of the Quantum Future Group

Imagine - if you can - not having a conscience, none at all, no feelings of guilt or remorse no matter what you do, no limiting sense of concern for the well-being of strangers, friends, or even family members. Imagine no struggles with shame, not a single one in your whole life, no matter what kind of selfish, lazy, harmful, or immoral action you had taken.

And pretend that the concept of responsibility is unknown to you, except as a burden others seem to accept without question, like gullible fools.

Now add to this strange fantasy the ability to conceal from other people that your psychological makeup is radically different from theirs. Since everyone simply assumes that conscience is universal among human beings, hiding the fact that you are conscience-free is nearly effortless.

You are not held back from any of your desires by guilt or shame, and you are never confronted by others for your cold-bloodedness. The ice water in your veins is so bizarre, so completely outside of their personal experience, that they seldom even guess at your condition.

In other words, you are completely free of internal restraints, and your unhampered liberty to do just as you please, with no pangs of conscience, is conveniently invisible to the world.

You can do anything at all, and still your strange advantage over the majority of people, who are kept in line by their consciences will most likely remain undiscovered.

How will you live your life?

What will you do with your huge and secret advantage, and with the corresponding handicap of other people (conscience)?

The answer will depend largely on just what your desires happen to be, because people are not all the same. Even the profoundly unscrupulous are not all the same. Some people - whether they have a conscience or not - favor the ease of inertia, while others are filled with dreams and wild ambitions. Some human beings are brilliant and talented, some are dull-witted, and most, conscience or not, are somewhere in between. There are violent people and nonviolent ones, individuals who are motivated by blood lust and those who have no such appetites. [...]

Provided you are not forcibly stopped, you can do anything at all.

If you are born at the right time, with some access to family fortune, and you have a special talent for whipping up other people's hatred and sense of deprivation, you can arrange to kill large numbers of unsuspecting people. With enough money, you can accomplish this from far away, and you can sit back safely and watch in satisfaction. [...]

Crazy and frightening - and real, in about 4 percent of the population....

The prevalence rate for anorexic eating disorders is estimated a 3.43 percent, deemed to be nearly epidemic, and yet this figure is a fraction lower than the rate for antisocial personality. The high-profile disorders classed as schizophrenia occur in only about 1 percent of [the population] - a mere quarter of the rate of antisocial personality - and the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention say that the rate of colon cancer in the United States, considered "alarmingly high," is about 40 per 100,000 - one hundred times lower than the rate of antisocial personality.

The high incidence of sociopathy in human society has a profound effect on the rest of us who must live on this planet, too, even those of us who have not been clinically traumatized. The individuals who constitute this 4 percent drain our relationships, our bank accounts, our accomplishments, our self-esteem, our very peace on earth.

Yet surprisingly, many people know nothing about this disorder, or if they do, they think only in terms of violent psychopathy - murderers, serial killers, mass murderers - people who have conspicuously broken the law many times over, and who, if caught, will be imprisoned, maybe even put to death by our legal system.

We are not commonly aware of, nor do we usually identify, the larger number of nonviolent sociopaths among us, people who often are not blatant lawbreakers, and against whom our formal legal system provides little defense.

Most of us would not imagine any correspondence between conceiving an ethnic genocide and, say, guiltlessly lying to one's boss about a coworker. But the psychological correspondence is not only there; it is chilling. Simple and profound, the link is the absence of the inner mechanism that beats up on us, emotionally speaking, when we make a choice we view as immoral, unethical, neglectful, or selfish.

Most of us feel mildly guilty if we eat the last piece of cake in the kitchen, let alone what we would feel if we intentionally and methodically set about to hurt another person.

Those who have no conscience at all are a group unto themselves, whether they be homicidal tyrants or merely ruthless social snipers.

The presence or absence of conscience is a deep human division, arguably more significant than intelligence, race, or even gender.

What differentiates a sociopath who lives off the labors of others from one who occasionally robs convenience stores, or from one who is a contemporary robber baron - or what makes the difference betwen an ordinary bully and a sociopathic murderer - is nothing more than social status, drive, intellect, blood lust, or simple opportunity.

What distinguishes all of these people from the rest of us is an utterly empty hole in the psyche, where there should be the most evolved of all humanizing functions. [Martha Stout, Ph.D., The Sociopath Next Door] (highly recommended)

Look up:
Political Ponerology: A Science on The Nature of Evil adjusted for Political Purposes by Andrew M. Lobaczewski

Lobaczewski said:

Pathocracy is a disease of great social movements followed by entire societies, nations, and empires. In the course of human history, it has affected social, political, and religious movements as well as the accompanying ideologies and turned them into caricatures of themselves. This occurred as a result of the participation of pathological agents in a pathodynamically similar process. That explains why all the pathocracies of the world are, and have been, so similar in their essential properties. Identifying these phenomena through history and properly qualifying them according to their true nature and contents - not according to the ideology in question, which succumbed to the process of caricaturization - is a job for historians. […]

The actions of [pathocracy] affect an entire society, starting with the leaders and infiltrating every town, business, and institution. The pathological social structure gradually covers the entire country creating a “new class” within that nation. This privileged class [of pathocrats] feels permanently threatened by the “others”, i.e. by the majority of normal people. Neither do the pathocrats entertain any illusions about their personal fate should there be a return to the system of normal man. [Andrew M. Lobaczewski, Ph.D. (psychology)

Of course, this psychopath layer of deception is not the final level to get to. After that, there is another layer of deception to look at as far as the "man behind the curtain", but lets just do one step at a time.

ack hold on...

interesting and valid points on sociopaths and psycopaths.... BUT

holocaust=greek for complete + burn

Shoah is the Hebrew term and I have no idea what it means except that some people say there's no business like shoah business when talking about the holocaust industry. :)

As far as the Jewish "genocide tradition" goes a good example is the story of Esther, where Esther prevents a planned genocide of the Jews in Persia after which the Jews massacre the Persians instead. Needless to say this isn't actual history, but interestingly enough Jewish religious tradition insists that Jews are always being persecuted--no doubt this is a way to maintain group solidarity that is time honored and kept up to date...


Real Truther a.k.a. Verdadero Verdadero - Harvard Task Force

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"burnt offering to God" is the actual definition

"HOLOCAUST (Heb., sho'ah). The word "holocaust" is derived from the Greek holokauston, which originally meant a sacrifice totally burned by fire; it was used in the translation of I Samuel 7:9, "a burnt offering to God." In the course of time it came to be used to describe slaughter on a general or large scale, and, especially, various forms of the destruction of masses of human beings. In the 1950s the term came to be applied primarily to the destruction of the Jews of Europe under the Nazi regime..."

Holocaust (Shoah) is kind of a strange word to use for the alleged genocide of Jews, unless certain people (Zionists) who chose the term saw the Jewish slaughter as a sacrifice to further their nefarius agenda. Knowing what we know about the callusion between Zionists and Hitler, it kinda speaks volumes doesn't it?

See, this is why I think you're a smart person.

Sound reasoning here. I'll look into this Brenner guy. (It's safe 'cause he's a jew criticizing jews! ;) ) The time of the sacred cows is over. Time to stop conflating Zionism with Judaism.
"Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without." - Buddha
"What you do will be insignificant, but it is very important that you do it." - Gandhi
"The Sun never shined on a cause of greater worth." - Thomas Paine

all you need to see

is the SHIT list (self-hating Israel threatening) to understand the value of Jews who criticize Jews. It's a HUGE list accusing every Jew who has ever pointed out anything wrong ever done by Israel of being enemies of all other Jews. It is frightening--see it at

Norman Finkelstein, Lenni Brenner, Gilad Atzmon--SO many truly brilliant and morally upright Jewish people, not all of them even anti-Zionist, smeared for one reason alone--daring to criticize the sacred cow. very telling, kind of like, Silverstein's business partner's site.


a motto for change!



Real Truther a.k.a. Verdadero Verdadero - Harvard Task Force

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Brenner, et al.

Another, lesser-known work which may be of interest is 'Radicals, Rabbis and Peacemakers: Conversations with Jewish Critics of Israel' by Seth Farber (Common Courage Press, 2005).

Incidentally, when I saw Brenner speak once a few years ago, I was amused by his comment on the charge he often faces of being a 'self-hating Jew': 'Ask any woman I've ever been involved with--I'm sure each would tell you that the problem with Lenni Brenner is the only person he could ever truly love is himself!'

oh and don't miss Israel Shahak's Jewish History Jewish Religion

Book by an Israeli Jewish critic of Judaism itself, as opposed to the religious Jewish critics of Israel. All very fascinating and mostly unknown to Americans, Jewish or otherwise...

edit: I forgot, Shahak was also interned at Bergen Belsen...


Real Truther a.k.a. Verdadero Verdadero - Harvard Task Force

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Thanks - is a great website

...with a huge archive of excellent articles and videos, and the reader comments are some of the best I have enjoyed online.

A great video to check out is "Peace, Propaganda and the Promised Land"

This great film is also very relevant to the challenge in spreading 911 truth, because it explains and illustrates how the mainstream media is controlled and filtered from the top down.
I often use this video as a good introduction to the problem we have with zionism, before I then try to explain the zionist aspects behind 911. (As a practical consideration to spreading 911 Truth to skeptics, I usually hold off on the Dov Zakheim/Clean Break stuff until someone has made it safely down the first rabbit hole accepting that 911 was an inside job).

"All that is necessary for evil to succeed is for good men to do nothing."
- Edmund Burke, 1729 - 1797

how's this for a list..

Robert, Frederick, Donald Kagan
Ken Feinberg
Normon Podhoretz
Dan Senor
Michael Ledeen and Simone
Ari Fleischer, MIchael Fleischer
Of course, Silverstein, Lowy and Eisenberg
Carl Levin
Dov Zakheim
Philip Zelikow
Eric Edelman
John Hamels
Bernard Lewis
Elliot Abrams
Douglas Feith
David Wurmser
Meyrav Wurmser
Abram Shulsky
Martin Indyle
Elliot Engle
John Hannah
K. Adelman
Joshua Bolten
Chertoffs/ Ben, Mike
Elliot Cohen

there can't possibly be more can there? how come there are so few Muslim folk involved in our government?

Diamond, the 16 hour member

Your trying to call out RT as a shill? you are probably one of this zeitgeists lackeys. He's dead on about that, david shayler and jim fetzer, could you put two bigger shills in a single film.

I'd like to see you make an

I'd like to see you make an half hour film on 911 and include ALL the evidence. Furthermore, look at the approach that is taken: taking apart the official myth point by point with quick bullet-point arguments. Getting into Silverstein is important but too much of a tangent from the flow of the argument.

Your AJ comments make no sense. Are you suggesting that he would defend the 911 myth or Democrats in ANY way. If so, you're way off in Andromeda.

Interesting thoughts on AJ, Verdadero.

I'll have to take that angle into consideration. I'm not ready to turn my back on him yet, but he is skating onto some thin ice lately. Those comments about Bruce Willis and JFK's killers still being in power... I read the actual Vanity Fair article. He does say that stuff, but Alex neglected to mention that in the next paragraph he goes on AT LENGTH about supporting the war, or killing terrorists or something. (I skimmed the article...) Also, in one of the articles on Infowars about this Adam Gadahn freak, they say he wrote something a few years back denouncing muslims as "bloodthirsty" something or other. But I read another article about Gadahn where it said he wrote that they WERE NOT the "bloodthirsty terrorists" everyone thought they were. I would have to research deeper to know which quote is accurate, but let's just say I've been discovering some discrepancies in AJ and Infowars reporting.

He does shit on the Nascar, Faux News crowd a lot though. I don't think he could be that easily classified as a "right wing" nut. He has been just as vocal in his Bush bashing as in his liberal bashing.
"Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without." - Buddha
"What you do will be insignificant, but it is very important that you do it." - Gandhi
"The Sun never shined on a cause of greater worth." - Thomas Paine

keep an eye on the Nation

I got an inside tip that they are going to run a hit piece conflating 9/11 truth with right wingers...


Real Truther a.k.a. Verdadero Verdadero - Harvard Task Force

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That would be typical

Oh so typical.

6 million dead?

RE: ...but you can't go back 60 years to point out that there is no evidence of mass gassings or huge crematoria or 6 million dead?

?????????? since they're still finding mass graves in Ukraine, who knows what the final count will ever be...certainly not an accurate one, though the Nazis were fanatical record keepers and there are plenty. As for the crematoria, the memory of the odor still lingers so intensely that cremation is virtually nonexistent (by choice) in Poland.

Anyway, I guess I'm missing the point here...please help me connect the dots from the phantom crematoria to 9/11.

do please elaborate!

Might not mass graves in Ukraine have had something to do with Stalin? How were the dead in these mass graves identified? And since the Nazis were fanatical record keepers, could you link to an example of a genuine Nazi document that vouches for the millions gassed and/or cremated in huge crematoria? A picture of a huge crematorium? A picture of an actual gas chamber used for mass murder? I'm sorry but before 9/11 I would not have been so picky to have extraordinary claims backed up by extraordinary evidence. So 6 million murdered. That's pretty extraordinary. Where's the extraordinary evidence?

Mind you I'm not saying that Nazis did NOT round up Jews and send them to labor camps--they did, and that is a crime on par with the Americans doing the same to their "Japs". Included in these labor camps were children, the elderly, and even sick people who were given medical care. Were they meant to die in the camps? Maybe. Were they meant to be deported to Palestine if Germany won? Quite possibly. Were they meant to all be exterminated? Clearly not, or else why would anyone have been left alive when the Germans knew they had lost the war? Why was their health taken care of? Why was so much Zyklon B gas used in delousing chambers so as to stop the spread of typhus and other diseases? Why are there none of the same telltale blue stains in the alleged gassing chambers as tehre are in the acknowledged delousing chambers?

Sorry pal, but after the monstrous 9/11 lie, why should anyone be shocked that 9/11 was not the first time history has been embellished and/or just plain made up? I would be surprised if 9/11 was the only or the biggest historical distortion of our ruling classes! War is always a tragedy for civilians, just ask the residents of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Oh it was a "just war" alright! It was very just the way everyone except the wealthy backers of both sides (the same people of course) got to suffer equally. 6 million is a symbolic number that has been used even after the official mainstream accepted number killed at Auschwitz was reduced from 4 million to 1 million. Everything you want people to think about those who question the official holocaust narrative is in fact true of those who helped to cause and have since manipulated, misrepresented, and profited from genuine suffering of Jewish people during WW2. The lies and gross exaggerations of Zionists were just atrocity propaganda sanctioned by the victors of the war and used to justify the theft of Palestinian land conveniently near the world's oil fields so that european imperialists could hide behind the seemingly noble cause of restitution to Jewish victims of German war crimes.

For those shocked to read such things, be sure to look up the work of Jewish holocaust revisionist David Cole, and see what ended up happening to him for daring to question the official history. 9/11 Truthers should learn from his experience trying to bring the truth to people who don't want to hear it!


Real Truther a.k.a. Verdadero Verdadero - Harvard Task Force

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Everything I want?

RE: "Everything you want people to think about those who question the official holocaust narrative is in fact true of those who helped to cause and have since manipulated, misrepresented, and profited from genuine suffering of Jewish people during WW2. "

+++++++ there's nothing I want from this discussion - I posed a simple question in the spirit of discussion not argument, but it seems everyone who isn't your fan is your enemy, "pal?"...don't sweat it, I'm out of here...and since being "the last to sign up" is clear grounds for derision, have at me: I'm "the last to leave"...your gratuitous invective come back will play only to your fans and yourself...don't forget to vote it up as soon as you post it

oh so you were agreeing with me

I see, my bad. and here I was thinking you had thin skin or something. and dude, I don't have fans, I have people here who sometimes grudgingly agree with me, as I sometimes grudgingly do with them. this is not a playpen, clubhouse, or fanboy hangout. maybe you were thinking of the Loose Change forum--those dreamy boys have LOTS of fans!


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You haven't added to this discussion.

But, like the uninformed / disinfo agents usually do, you feign indignant then run away. I do not agree with many of RT's opinions but I've never caught him being intentionally intellectually dishonest. I can't say the same for many other posters.


If I'm really being so hateful and irrational I wish someone would help me see the light by answering some of these questions--it was after all a Jew, David Cole, who put them in my head. If he is indeed a self-hating Jew and made everything up to offend himself and spite his fellow Jews, can't someone show this to be the case so that I can stop making an ass of myself? Or is that the point? To trick me into believing lies and letting me wallow in them?


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When you look at what was done to David Cole...

Historian David Irving and many others who only search for truth you will know that the we're in the "violently opposed" stage of Holocaust discussion. Prof. Tony Martin is another example of someone, who merely questioned the Jewish role in the trans-Atlantic slave trade (and no more so than any other European race), and was attacked & threatened mercilessly.

It's the information age folks, put it to use.

Where did you see this?

'Didn't I just also see a picture of some Waco type dud with a gun stuffed in his pants posing with the great Rudkowski? '

Did you? Can this be viewed somewhere? I'd be curious to see that myself.


down towards the middle. just imagine what the Nation could do with that pic...


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yeah, The Nation is pretty

yeah, The Nation is pretty scary huh? do you really think they have the power and reach to make it look like the 9/11 truth movement is a bunch of crazy rightwingers? correct me if im wrong, but when they had CIA agent Baer completely rip DRG's first 9/11 book it didnt exactly seem to slow us down much did it? fuck The Nation, i think even most partisan democrat hacks see through their bullshit at this point. and anyway, The Nation, despite being a total rag with no balls still has a pretty hard time making it into mainstream discussion and onto the MSM(ABC throws Katrina V. a bone about once a month). so how many people are really gonna read The Nations attempts at making it look like the 9/11 movement is a rightwing movement? im not worried.

"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Former Director, CIA

in many circles

The Nation is like a bible. My roommate subscribes, even though he knows about 9/11 and is on board with us. It's more popular than Amy Goodman if that says anything. I agree that we can take solace in the fact that many many people are waking up to the fake paradigm BS but at the same time there's no sense in being complacent--if this is their strategy, we need a counterstrategy, or at least awareness of what is happening so that we can explain it to those who still don't know to be skeptical of EVERYthing. There are many people just now getting an inkling--people who have not been exposed at all to the truth, whose first impressions are currently being formed. Let's nip this tactic in the bud!


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good point about not being

good point about not being complacent, but i just think that it shows a real desperation on The Nation's(and other gatekeepers like Cockburn etc.) part to be trying to paint this as some fringe movement or even somehow a rightwing movement. outlets like The Nation are losing more and more readers every cycle in large part because people are waking up and seeing them and others for what they are. part of the problem. im an extremely cynical person but even i think we are clearly winning now. and dont worry, like everyone else i ALWAYS stress how this isnt about politics or ideology when spreading 9/11 truth. i tell people that i have conservative and liberal views on various issues and that the 9/11 truth movement consists of both conservatives and liberals since labels seem to mean so much to people nowadays. The Nation aint gonna slow us down just like the snipes from the right havent. the media cowards are becoming more fearful and desperate every day as more people wake up.

"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Former Director, CIA

i agree with you

just remember, as Parappa the Rappa's master (the one with the onion head) taught him "Don't get cocky, it's gonna get rocky!"

I think it IS desperation on their part--that means they're down, which means we should now be kicking them HARD to once and for all put them OUT!


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RT, please tell me...

Are you are referring to Ed Brown?

"Didn't I just also see a picture of some Waco type dud with a gun stuffed in his pants posing with the great Rudkowski?"

What is "some Waco type dud with a gun stuffed in his pants"?

Do you believe the OTC regarding Waco, despite the eye witness testimony and physical and video testimony to the contrary?

Gun ownership is an UNALIENABLE Right. There can never be anything wrong in exercising an UNALIENABLE Right. The site of someone other than an "official" possessing a gun should make you very happy.

What is wrong with having a gun in your pants, especially if you are in your own home which is under siege by mercenary criminal thugs masquerading as federal agents?

If you are not paying attention to what is happening to Ed and Elaine Brown in New Hampshire, you are doing yourself and your country a grave diservice.

"But truthfully, I don't really know. We've had trouble getting a handle on Building No. 7."
~~ Dr. Shyam Sunder - Acting Director Building and Fire Research Laboratory (NIST)

Thanks RT

I always appreciate your posts, and this one made me see now how in my initial enthusiasm for the very effective and concise short list used in this video - (it may have been a bit too short) - I may have let my eye off the ball for a moment.

I did not watch Parts I and III, but from the comments on this thread, it sounds like zeitgeist is maybe not too fond of religion?! :-) …. So I have this question for zeitgeist now:

If you believe strongly that religion(s) are a terrible fraud that take a terrible toll on mankind - why not seize the opportunity to mention how the excuse of religion has been used by Zionist for a political goal, and who at the least helped with, or at worst devised the attacks on 911? If there ever was an example of religion messing up things for everybody – believers and non-believers alike - it was the driving ideology/people behind “A Clean Break” who benefited the most from the 911 aftermath… as Netanyahu even points out in his comment about how “911 was a good thing…..well for Israel anyway…”

All the Zionist links to 911 – make for the perfect setup to really scream about how religion can sometimes be used as a rationale for the most diabolical and evil behaviors….right?
Wouldn’t suggesting or explaining how 911 was the result of misguided Zionist religious extremism make a great case for the rest of your film? Let’s face it….even before PNAC, there was A Clean Break, right?

"All that is necessary for evil to succeed is for good men to do nothing."
- Edmund Burke, 1729 - 1797

Good 30 mins

The 30 minutes about 9/11 are really good. Amazing so much information they manage to squeeze into half an hour, without even getting a rushed feel to it. An excellent introduction that hopefully will get a lot of people interested in learning more.

I haven't watched the rest yet, but I think it's a bad idea to mix in other subjects like criticism of Christianity. 9/11 truth should be for everyone, and it's a bad idea to mix in other messages like religion or political bias. It just gives a lot of people an easy excuse of being turned off before they even start to learn the truth about 9/11.

Btw, isn't it a bit ironic that so many of the people's work they have used are Christians (Alex Jones, Steven Jones, David Ray Griffin, etc.)

Frankly, I don't understand the attack on Christianity either...

It seems like an attempt to undermine the truth offered or make it completeley unpaletable to 80% of the United States.

It's like saying "I have indisputable evidence that the 2000 and 2004 elections were stolen but first, I will prove to you that your grandmother was the town whore."


More than unwise, imo.


So funny.
Excellent point!

It's like saying that factions of our own government brought down the towers....WITH SPACE BEAMS!!!!!

We can't afford to have something that claims to help the movement divide the movement's members.
Whether intentional or not, it comes across as disinformational bullshit.

It's hard enough convincing people that something like an "inside job" was possible. I really can't afford to trash their faith on top of that.

The film is not about 9/11

The film is not about 9/11 per se; it is about our ZEITGEIST. That is, the intellectual and cultural climate of our times. All three sections of the film are integral PARTS of our Zeitgeist.


accepting mythology as fact (Christianity & religion in general) and absolute total denial of cold hard fact (9/11 truth) as mythology is WHY we are in this freaking mess to begin with.

I think the WHOLE movie all parts does a great job of proving this.

At face value... this video is incredible...!!!!

It packed in a lot during its 30 minute duration. So what if it did not include:

"The Five Dancing Israelis"
George Bush's paralysis when hearing that the 2nd tower was hit
The record-breaking put options on American, United and Morgan Stanley

This 30 minute video packs more punch than the 90+ minute LooseChange video. And that is important. It is much easier to get a doubtful potential "9/11 Truther" to watch a 30 minute video than the Loose Change video.

The author of the video has the right to provide his views of Jesus. My opinion is that Jesus did exist, was more enlightened than others, but certainly was not conceived by the Virgin Mary and the son of God. Duh.

My best to the producer of this video... I will spread it as far and wide as I can.

P.S. Let's all keep in mind the tens of millions that Dan Brown's book "The DaVinci Code" and the subsequent movie made. There are a lot of open-minded people out there. Those that had the open-mind to read/watch "The DaVinci Code" are prime targets for the 9/11 movement. The idea of the DaVinci Code is much more of a conspiracy theory than the events of 9/11.

"...the high office of the President has been used to foment a plot to destroy the American's freedom, and before I leave office, I must inform the citizens of this plight." -John F. Kennedy (November 12, 1963, Columbia U, 10 days before his assassination

you know the daVinci code is fiction right?

just checking! there are plenty of people who think it is real hidden history, and as such comparisons between daVinci code fanatics and 9/11 truthers are probably not going to help the cause!


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Nor is saying that millions

Nor is saying that millions of Jews were not slaughtered during the Holocaust. BIG no-no.

i disagree

the daVinci code is fiction and so is much of the official holocaust narrative. see, it's not simply about offending people, it's about being right. and you're misrepresenting what I've said. It may well be that 2 million Jews were killed or otherwise died (from disease, hunger, etc.) during ww2. the questions are how was the official 6 million figure arrived at, where is the proof of mass gassings, where is the proof of mass cremations, where is the proof of a plan to exterminate all Jews, and of course, who actually helped Hitler achieve and flex his power? if these questions are so obviously unnecessary, why can no one ever answer them?


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because they can't.

You brought up the reduction of the Auschwitz number (and other camps have reduced their numbers as well). That alone shows that the '6 million' is just kept up for a symbolic, traditional meaning, it isn't truth or factual. The total population of Jews, post WWII compared with pre WWII, shows that this number is impossible anyway. Also the fact that it was our (the Allies) policy to starve Germany into submission. People were starving at the camps becuase we bombed every railroad and bridge we could find in Germany. We bombed the country until it shut down. So whatever trickled through, it wasn't enough for the people in the camps. And then decisions have to be made about who gets the little amount of food and who doesn't. It was horrific for just about everyone involved in the last 2 years of WWII in Europe. Millions upon millions starved to death in the Eastern Front of the war between Germany and Russia.

News editor at The Watchman Report,, delivering 9/11 truth to the Christian community

thanks for pointing this out

it was a human tragedy of an unimaginable scale and those affected came not from a single ethnic group but I suspect mainly from the lower classes--as always the poor bearing the brunt of the cockups of the rich. in the case of the holocaust you have one element of the rich who did indeed help both sides perpetrate the crime against humanity that is war pretend to champion the cause of one of the affected groups, but only to further use them as cannon fodder in their global plans. THIS is why we must question the holocaust narrative--not to take away from the meaning of Jewish suffering but to liberate it from the lies of the elites who brought the suffering on the Jews and others in the first place. That many of those elites were Zionists should give Jewish people today pause, as they are once again being set up, this time alongside Americans, for a disaster they are not meant to understand. those who call this jew-hatred or anti-semitism, I beg you, if you're sincere, to try to see beyond your own comfort zone to what others already know. don't perpetuate the effects of the elites' divide and conquer tactics--we are all in this together or not at all.


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Controversial, informative,

Controversial, informative, well researched...interesting parallels between ancient astrology and various religions. Sort of underscores man's need to look to the heavens to find guidance from a power that must be greater than himself. I like the idea that that power is actually us all as cells or molecules if you will, in a great organism, the Earth. War is cancer along with any number of other atrocities commited by men against others. Good to see the link between how all the pieces necessary to control the masses fit together. Still raises the question of how do we escape the destiny that the tyrants want for us. I am very impressed by your film, thank you for taking the time to create such a stirring work of art.


Bishop John Shelby Spong

The highly controversial Anglican Minister, had an interesting spin on the virgin birth story. His point was this.

What was it about this person Jesus, that caused his followers, to attempt to move his divinity all the way back to his birth, and even earlier, to his very conception, and make him only half human in the process?

IMO, there was something controversial about Jesus life, and family framework (perhaps, even dare I say it, rape), which prompted him to become, psychologically and therefore spiritually, a nothing unto himself, while filled to the brim and overflowing with the spirit of the universe, and driven to the cross in order to atone as a victimless victim of circumstance, for the sins of the many, taking the punishment for all evil upon himself.

I say that on the one hand, he appears to have been a neurotic, taking on too much responsibility for the sins of the world, and on the other, a person of perfect mental health in accurately discerning and then faithfully serving, his unique fated calling in accordance with the higher will, which comes to serve and not to be served.

Jesus is to me a model of authentic leadership which flies in the face of the present day "evil system" of "governance".
On the 11th day, of every month.

accept for one tiny factor

Jesus is a MYTH, a character that never existed and was made up whole cloth from various mythological pagan sun gods.


Thank you sooo much, you have reconciliated my christian and pantheist side!

No credits is great too!

May I ask where is the music from ... or is that cheating?


The music is all original

The music is original and tailored specifically to the film.


I saw the whole movie, all three parts on Google video and I must say it is very well done. It covers the BIG picture so to speak and 9/11 is just another chapter in it. Where can we get the DVD?

A couple of things...

One, the photo of the WTC box column that's cut at an angle, I thought it had been determined the cut was made during cleanup. The photo is a crop of a larger photo which I saw once, and might even have a copy of somewhere.

Two, no mention is made of Daniel Hopsicker's research into the lives of the alleged hijackers just previous to 9/11, and in fact I've seen very little mention of his work anywhere, except on his site and in his videos and books. If his research is valid it adds volumes to the suspiciousness of the official conspiracy theory. What's the deal?

Three, there's been lots of talk about heat from fire and the fire floors in the WTC being "infernos" but what about the ventilation factor? The morning of 9/11 was cool and windy, especially aloft, and the holes made by the aircraft were rather large. Wouldn't these factors should contribute in some way to reducing temperatures inside the WTC towers? Fire up the barbie on a windy day, without putting the hood down, and it'll take longer to cook. Here's one of my photos, notice how the smoke is blowing almost horizontally:


Step out of the small circle . . .

Sorry, but any video that metamorphs the "boom, boom, boom" of the impacts (vaporizing real bodies of living breathing humans doing nothing but showing up for work) into "boom, boom, hip and cool soundtrack" isn't really interested in the reality of the situation or the world, only how it can manipulated for a purpose.

Why does exposing truth have to turn us into robots about murder (no matter who committed it)?

Imagine how revolting this must be for the families to see this stuff.

Here's a hip site -

No big soundtrack though, so I guess most on here won't think it's so cool. But you won't see the plane impacts over and over to music.

Step out of the small circle you are in people . . . real people died. Murder isn't cool and for a soundtrack or you can expect to see a lot more in the near future. When we idolize acts of violent aggression in these subtle ways, we spread a reverence for them.

Yes, it's good to package things for a youth audience, but murder? There's a lot of things you can set to amazing music without stooping this low.

hear HEAR

what a great point.


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Re: Jesus and the Sun

If the sun, as the center and souce of life on earth, may be likened to God the father, then Jesus is more like the moon, as a reflection of the sun's light chasing away the darkness of night.

I do think Jesus was informed and inspired by the Old Testament as much as anything, and was surely aware of the helliocentric origins of Judaism ie: 12 tribes of Israel and the like. And although the three days in the tomb aspect has it's parallel with the winter solstice death and resurrection, on a few occasions, JC referred to the "sign of Jona" as his inspiration.

Anyway, the entirety of the sayings of Jesus in the Gospels when viewed from a textual critical perspective, would indicate that he was a real figure, and it's hard to fathom how his early followers were prepared to go to their DEATHS for the sake of a cooked up myth with no basis in fact or reality. As Jews, most of them, it hardly makes sense that they would be prepared to break with tradition and adopt this new interpretation compliments of Paul the lawyer and tentmaker.

A historical examination of Paul would be interesting.. He was a contemporary of Peter, who was with Jesus in person. Was Paul too a "made up figure", his letters, a forgery..? That defies rational belief!

Time for me to re-read the New Testament..
On the 11th day, of every month.

again you "assume"

that jesus was real and that the few verses in the bible was actually written or spoken by him.
as hard as it is to fathom how delusional people go to their deaths because of delusional beliefs Christianity is not the only case of this phenomena.

How many Muslims have strapped on bombs in the name of "their particular sun god" and gone to their deaths?
What about the Aztecs sacrificing 100s of 1000s in the name of their particular sun gods?
What about Heavens Gate? I can go on & on with this lunacy.

None of these have any basis in reality at all now do they?

Some of Saul/Pauls writing are indeed pseudonymous just like ALL of the so called Gospels are, however Saul/Paul was a real historical figure.
A very sad, completely delusional historical figure that suffered from Temporal Lobe Epilepsy and disfigurement, a complete nut that for the last 20 years of his miserable life thought that each and everyday was his last.
What defies rational belief is believing the writings of a delusional psychotic from 2000 years ago.

If Paul was a real figure

and he was comtemporary to Peter, then, taken together within a contextual framework with the meaning and purpose of the Jewish law, what I understand, makes much more sense than what you are proposing. Paul was hardly a psychotic. Have you READ the New Tesament lately?
On the 11th day, of every month.

Paul was real

Peter was not, nor was Jesus. and Paul was without any question suffering from Temporal Lobe Epilepsy.
I have read the NT enough, though the only time it make a lick of sense was the 4th & final time after I learned of the astrological origins of the story.
The NT is an astrological drama, anyone not brain dead & or completely deluded by religious insanity can see this very clearly.

thoughts and meditation

i have not viewed the last part yet, but pertaining to the first, it was very interesting. Had read about some of this. Could Jesus not have been part of the messiah returning on an "eon" basis? perhaps by 2500 the next will return. the repeating pattern does nothing to dissuade my believe in the mystery and impact of his persona and teachings. have these myth/stories been used by men for the sake of control throughout time? of course. true believers know the treasure is within the purity and simplicity...the oneness thread of all faiths: to strive for truth and justice with a compassionate heart.


I was on board for a bit

I was on board for a bit there right up until the renunciation of Jesus' very existence itself. The historical figure known as Jesus did exist, well, at least, that's the school of thought I subscribe to. However, I do believe he was mere mortal and imbued with the false traits of astronomical god-hood. I think he was the sage of his time who's actuality as a person got completely twisted and distorted towards the popular myths of the age in order to make him a god in the eyes of the people.

Pretty hard to account for

the birth of Christianity itself with Jesus never having even existed! Looks like a slick historical disinfo campaign against the person behind the myth, based on extreme bias and prejudice. There's no mistaking the utter contempt of the narrator throughout the presentation, nor his joy in making Jesus "disappear" completely. Pretty sad if you ask me.

I'm with C.S. Lewis on the Jesus question, that if it's even partly true, and the nature of the self-sacrifice meaningful, then the extent to which it may have been layered with mythology matters not one iota. Personally, I think that Jesus was well aware of the role he was playing, and set out intentionally to fulfill prophecy, and he was therefore, either an insane meglomaniac, or a human servent with the utmost humility, where humility may be defined as knowing one's self fully as you really are, and being entirely true to self. And the few extra-Biblical historical references confirm the trial and crucifixion, and how is it that the Gospels themselves, and the letters of Paul are completely excluded as historical documentation? There's probably more early documents regarding Jesus Christ, than any other historical event from ancient times. It "bifurcated" like wildfire, right out of the gate, so to speak.

Also, the Gospels were not written to be a historical biography in the first place. They're "apocrypha" or "apocolyptic" styled writings, in spite of what the Christian fundy literalists would have us believe..

I find it highly unfortunate that 9/11 truth would be conflated with this very selective interpretation, and used as a point of leverage to grind an axe born of personal religious prejudice and an almost seething contempt for it, dripping from the narration.

At the most fundamental level, it's a vain attempt at another crucifixion of Jesus. We wanted him gone then, and we still to this day want him gone.. for the pride of man, he and everything he represents, is the most offensive thing, but, sometimes the best defence, is a good offence..! ;-)
On the 11th day, of every month.


But ALL other religions all though out history were created even though obviously none of those various gods existed. DOH!

What about belief in Zeus, Mithra, Zoroaster, Krishna, Dionysus and on & on? any of these gods exist in reality? Then according to you none of them could have possibly existed as a religion...LOL

You just need to face the facts, you will "believe" in Christianity regardless of the facts because you are so obsessed with this belief that facts mean nothing to you. Your cognitive dissonance will not allow you to get past the fact that there is no evidence whatsoever that any such person ever existed.
There is nothing anyone can say that will ever change a mind that refuses to accept evidence.


Interesting response..
On the 11th day, of every month.

There really isn't much more to say

to someone to brainwashed by religious dogma.
Its like what can you say to some lunatic that flatly refuses to accept factual reality? What can you say to a Young Earth Creationist that will look you straight in the face and deny the Earth is more than 10,000 years old? About all that is left is just to laugh in your face..ROTFL.

Good stuff

I enjoyed it. Nice work.
Minor point and may have been mentioned here but "bin ladin" is spelled wrong. It should be bin laden.

"Our country's founders cherished liberty, not democracy."
-Ron Paul


Everyone is clammoring around PARTS 1 (religion) and 2 (9/11) but not a peep about PART 3. I urge you to see it. The last 5 minutes particularly.
People need to understand the relationship with Jesus and religion in general. They are both man made fictional entities created to control society. No one should take offense that it is pointed out that Jesus didn't exist - becase he didn't. And if he did he certainly didn't walk on water and such - unless he was a David Blaine or magician of the time, which is unlikely. Wake up. Religion serves to seperate our race, just like race, class and other arbitrary dividing ideas itself. It's fascinating to watch people understand that 9/11 was not what we are asked to think it was (which is huge progress), yet we think invisible people live in the sky that created earth in 7 days. C'mon people. Part 1 clearly explains the myth of religion in clear, concise and reasonable terms. Watch PART 3.

but diamonds...

Why not also look at the problems with Judaism? Are you aware of some of the absurd teachings by Rabbis in the Talmud? And how these serve to foment radicalism and xenophobia and intolerance among Jews in Israel and beyond? Why focus on Christianity, which at least came to be as a reform movement against the corrupt ruling priest-classes?


Real Truther a.k.a. Verdadero Verdadero - Harvard Task Force

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RT, do you really believe in

RT, do you really believe in god?

Show "ALL RELIGIONS RT - ALL OF THEM RT." by Diamondsarethebest

oh, rt isnt that

oh, rt isnt that bad.

is there a jewish race??? i think that rt has been pretty clear about what he thinks.


Come back when you learn how to read.

Any religion...

All organized religion is another form of seperatism. Judiasm, Christianity, all of them. If American wasn't run by deluional christians, maybe they'd of picked another one to dissect.

and Zionism is a religion too

And uses the holocaust myth as an article of faith. you have to believe it even though most of the claims are unprovable (after only 60 years!)

And call me a hater all you want, it changes nothing about me OR the facts.


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I find it hard to believe

that so many are agreeing with a holocaust denier.
The numbers may or may not have been exactly 6 million, however many millions there were is moot and Hitler was a devout Christian.

Well, do the facts matter, or don't they?

If the number of jews killed in the holocaust was off by several multiples - like between 3 and 6 times - then wouldn't you agree that is a significant fabrication of historical facts?

If the official death count of the WTC attack was multiplied to 18,000 rather than 3,000, would you have a problem with that, or would you just say to someone who brings up this problem, HEY, SHUT UP YOU 9/11 DENIER! WHAT ARE YOU TRYING TO DO? DISTURB THE SENSIBILITIES OF THE 9/11 SURVIVORS?

Why did Zionist's chose the word Holocaust (Shoah in Hebrew), which means sacrifice, or "burnt offering to God", to describe the alleged genocide of jewish people. Don't you think that is a little odd? Do you think it might have something to do with the FACT that Zionists were calluding with Hitler in order to further their nefarius agenda of colonizing Palistine?

Why should jewish people be given special consideration of putting their supposed sensibilities before historical fact, and make this topic off-limits to historical revisionism when information becomes available that contradicts the official narrative?

No it doesn't

It doesn't matter that much to me that it was less than 6 million, FACT is that is was one hell of a lot of innocent people murdered because of religious insanity.
You may deny this all you wish, you can have your own opinion but you cant have your own FACTS.
I think its disgusting there are so many holocaust deniers on this site, pretty sad.

Quoting you, Nunyabiz.

"I think Part one is a good precursor to 9/11 truth because it shows exactly how ignorant myths become fact in the minds of the delusional."

Yet, here you are defending the greatest unfounded myth since Jesus Christ. Uninformed or just delusional?

Refute this...

Whether you like it or not,...

I haven't heard it said any better than this.

WTF are you talking about Big D?

I am not defending any myth. I merely said the "numbers" may be off and really nobody knows how many millions were murdered.
But anyone that states that no or at least very few people were murdered in camps is a complete phucking idiot.
I personally don't give a shit if is was 6 million or 1 million or 700,000, fact is it happened.

I assume you aren't trying to spew that virtually no one was killed right? It makes a difference to you that it was less than 6 million? fine, to me it doesn't.

Show "Read much?" by Diamondsarethebest


Clearly you didn't read what this lunatic holocaust denier was saying earlier - like most, you drop in uninformed and make assumptions.

Submitted by Diamondsarethebest on Thu, 06/14/2007 - 11:39am.

what is a "Holocaust denier'? is it someone who questions what really took place during ww2???

are we all " 911 deniers ' because we question what happened on 911??

Very good documentary

I liked all three parts (as an agnostic I don't have a problem with part 1)..

and as an Atheist

I found Part 1 to tie in nicely with the other 2.
There are also A LOT more Atheist/Agnostics in the US than the BS pew polls lead you to believe. We are currently at least 15-20% Atheist/Agnostic in this country and going by current rates of attrition since 1990 Atheist/Agnostics will out number Christians by the year 2040.
We need to start reaching the sane & rational part of our society not the delusional, most of them are totally unreachable any way. Facts mean nothing to them.
Once you base your life on faith in a myth then you have divorced yourself from factual reality and facts become meaningless.

I thought the movie was nothing short of amazing

As an agnostic, I learned a ton from part 1. The movie said what desperately needed to be said. Nice work on this film zeitgeist!

"Our country's founders cherished liberty, not democracy."
-Ron Paul

who wrote the music?

Don't know if zeitgeistnyc is gone, but I'd really like to know what the music is in the background, very cool.

Also, who is the narrator?

and any web sites for further research/reading?

Show "This is nothing new" by Joshua

rejection of the truth or of

rejection of the truth or of your truth? im not here to bash religion but none of you religious folks can prove a goddamn thing so stop acting like you can. can you prove Jesus rose from the dead like a zombie? no? your religion isnt "the truth" anymore than anyone else's is.

"The Central Intelligence Agency owns everyone of any significance in the major media." ~ William Colby, Former Director, CIA


Christianity IS based on paganism of Babylon, the video in part 1 is 100% correct and also 100% provable by archaeological fact.
The only "foundation of lies, 1/2 truths, and historical inaccuracies" is found in that vile book of hatred you call the bible.

I reject stupidity, I accept archaeological fact.

errors found, suggestions, other comments

first of all I have to say I find this movie to be VERY good. Not perfect. Everyone expects perfection and then manifests a dichotomy of good if perfect and 'sucks' based off of a few errors/flaws despite the majority of content being factual and having good effect.
So overall I find this movie to be very good, despite it's flaws, ommissions, styles that I didn't agree with here and there.
For a better movie out of 2 hours depicting the 'big picture' there's not a hell of a lot more you can ask for.

Anyways, a couple of errors found

in part 3 where income tax is said not to be ratified nor a law, this sounds convincing by many income tax protestors, but a quick search on debunking this yields some answers. I'm not defending the income tax at all, I'm just saying the data to say it's not exactly voluntary is out there.

when DRG is speaking of the videos that were confiscated and not released, (Sheraton, Citgo)...they have been released...for a while now, except they show nothing. This should be replaced with the fact that there are a multitude of other cameras that have yet to be released unless we are to believe each Wal-Mart has more security cameras than the pentagon.

At 16:44, Steven Jones is talking about enormous dust clouds...then ridiculously the video zooms in on the massive plume (that was created from the pulverized dust falling down from where it was in the building) as if it has anything to do with the aluminum oxide dust coming from thermite.

at 20:25 it states Cheney was given control of NORAD orders 3 months prior. I thought it was Rumsfeld.

Also, in the 9/11 segment, I think they should include the recently zoomed-in footage (from 9/11 explosive reality) that points out the dozens of flashes going off on WTC1, and the rapid fire dozens of flashes going off in WTC2 as it collapses...right after the patient says 'it was like gunfire, bang bang bang bang' and then show that clip.

along with the firefighters at the payphone hearing the massive ba-bang. and the other with workers walking away from wtc7 hearing an explosion, turning their heads asking 'ya hear that? that building's coming down soon'

As far as the pentagon, I don't think going into the 'no plane theory' is productive, except to point out the odd maneuver, Hanjours skills (lack thereof, and Cheney's 'orders still stand' Mineta testimony and it not being included in the report.

On Shanksville, the fact the debris was spread over several miles should be the main point.

Of course the 9/11 segment is only 30 minutes, so people getting all alarmed and screaming 'disinfo' because certain information wasn't contained is pretty unreasonable.

As far as labeling this peice some type of 'slick disinfo' because it happens to be nicely produced is rather unreasonable as well. You guys sound like black metal fans whining when you hear a black metal band that doesn't have shitty production for once, claiming they sold out and aren't 'TRUE'. It's this 'must look home-made and underground' before it becomes assumed as some type of disinfo delusion that I'm really tired of. Apparently it's lost on you guys that some people who are/have connections with graphic design/video professionals can be truthers too. Purposely not doing that to save face in front of the paranoid people who want shitty production is pretty stupid when you're trying to spread a message to people who haven't heard it yet, instead of aiming only to preach to the choir.
As far as Shayler, Fetzer being included; Fetzer was never provided more than a voice nor given a caption of his name, Shayler was simply included to illustrate a point, and was never featured exclusively.

Anyways the music was very good. I particularly liked Part 1's music with the vaguely Egyptian style rhythm and the music in part 2 that's reminiscent of Silent Hill. The narration is decent however at times the "duh" gravitas on pointing out a couple things is a bit much.

The biggest gripe, however not answered much anywhere else and hard to address anyway, is that while this film deconstructs the systems of control around us...there's very little as far as suggesting what to do about it as well as what life would be like without all of this in place.
It would be no different than the freeing of the slaves, they had no idea where to go and what to do and arguably haven't totally overcome this ever since.
It is then a wonder that, are these control systems, power monopolies, deception etc a part of our nature? If that's all we know as reality, how do you create a new one without elements of the former? I mean if you really get rid of all of this, how is anybody going to start 'a new age' without it going back into the downward spiral as before? Is it just an inevitable, repeating process? I would be elated if the people would 'awaken', rise up, and start over...but have very little faith in it staying that way for very long before the same process of shit happened over again throughout the subsequent years...then a crescendo of the same awakening happens over time, repeat.

Still work in progress

so you should email the maker your points. Contact adress at

Zeitgeist maker just put up a statement:

Well Done

What I don't understand is do so many people get offended by Part 1if you disagree fine who cares. No one is holding a gun to your head, and anyone who watches a movie, reads an article or listens to a radio\podcast and and doesn't question what they are being told is a fool. If you think he is full of shit then say so but you will "NEVER" win if you argue the point especially over the internet.

I've just watched this video

I've just watched this video and I want to know how the producer could have the shear arrogance and contempt to include David Ray Griffin and Dr Steven Jones, religious men, after stating "Jesus did not exist"? I'm sick of the way people will jump all over a video like this just because it's slick, the shear level of divisive garbage in this film is tremendous and I'm shocked it was put on the blogger's front page. Dz is a Christian also correct? Forget the Roman records of Jesus, lets go with the "no planes hit the Twin Towers" version of the Da Vinci Code, Jesus was a Hologram everybody!

What got John Lennon into trouble? Saying the Beatles were “more popular” than who? I wonder what the reaction would have been if he just denied Jesus' existence instead of merely stating that his band was quite popular and using taken out of context metaphors? Can anyone spell “very bad news for this garbage to be associated with 9/11 Truth”?

OK yes lets "Forget the Roman records of Jesus"

because THERE AREN"T ANY!!!! DOH! so easy to forget something that doesn't exist.
I will write a $1000 check right now today for every single contemporary Roman record about any so called Jesus of Nazareth.
Go ahead make some easy money.

Ok, if I'm going to be

Ok, if I'm going to be honest after watching the whole thing, not just part 1, I actually like about 80% of this documentary and think it's very powerful. What I find most ridiculous about it though is what's best summed up by the ending, because quotes like the one from Jimmy Hendrix - "when the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace" and all the galvanising, positive and moralistic sentiment at the end of this film is all so frustratingly ironic because that is what the true essence of Christianity and most of the world's major religions are about. I know religion is used by men with power to manipulate the public, but how Christian, Jewish or Muslim etc for example are those men when they break and violate, in the most extreme ways imaginable, what those religions are meant to stand for. It's not the fault of religion, it's the perversion of what religion is by men with power who wish to use it to manipulate the masses etc.

David Ray Griffin, Dr Steven Jones and Alex Jones all appreciate what Christianity is really about and they are featured heavily in this documentary, Martin Luther King Jr was also motivated by the true message of Christianity to do what he did. It's not some bizarre dogmatic delusion to align yourself with the positive and to try to commit to being good and do what is right etc. It doesn’t matter though what route people take to align themselves with the positive, it doesn’t matter if they do it through entirely non-religious means, what matters is that people do strive to achieve their potential through positive development, to be good to others and to stand up for what it right etc. Those are the sane virtues that hold society together, all most religions and Christianity are meant to be about is helping to promote those values and institutionalise them. I know this is a complicated issue but total misunderstandings of what true Christianity is about I find very frustrating, especially when there are people calling themselves Christians who help to fuel these false negative perceptions.

The usual xtian excuses.

"I know religion is used by men with power to manipulate the public, but how Christian, Jewish or Muslim etc for example are those men when they break and violate, in the most extreme ways imaginable, what those religions are meant to stand for. It's not the fault of religion, it's the perversion of what religion is by men with power who wish to use it to manipulate the masses etc."

When you point out all the evil religion has caused in history. The xtian reply with: Yes, but that is not real christianity, that's a false perverted christianity.

I say, why take the risk of being manipulated again and again by "men with power".

So true Pagan

I get so sick and tired of that usual Christian excuse.

Religion has been the leading cause of most Wars, Millions upon Millions of deaths, civil unrest, mass relocation, entire civilizations wiped out, sexism, racism, and Genocide than ANY other factor in all of human history.
It is WAY past time for sane human beings to grow past the pre dark ages and start living in the 21st century.

In reality the fact that DRG and Alex Jones etc are so religious is the only thing that worries me, I find myself questioning someone very closely that is so overtly religious.
Anyone that accepts religious dogma as fact based solely on faith alone has divorced themselves from reality thus everything they say to me is suspect.
Basically like all religious individuals they are somewhat like serial killers, they are able to "compartmentalize" the craziness within, the insane thoughts, while seeming otherwise normal and able to function in society.

Take Ken Ham, or Pat Robertson, James Dobson etc, these people are stark raving insane, yet they are allowed in society because religious insanity is protected, instead of being institutionalized and medicated so they can get psychiatric care they are listened to and followed by like minded fools in the very same fashion as the Heavens Gate bunch followed Marshall Applewhite.
This simply can not be good for society to have so many delusional psychotics walking the streets and in positions of authority.