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BBC's "The Third Tower"

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Here is my rebuttal.

Damn good Jon !

WAIT !.... Maybe someone slammed a door too hard? Or maybe it was built on a earthquake fault, and the ground opened up and let it drop at free fall speed?
Hell that sounds better the a few small fires. Come on NIST ! Do you really think were that f**king dumb?

Bush Worshippers Are.

I guess they (NIST) didn't get the Memo from the Department of Common Sense.

Stating Patriots love their Country and the President who is meant to be a Servant of the People.

They pulled a Bait and Swich with a "dumb" CINC and a snake cunning Vice-POTUS.

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The CONSTITUTION is NOT going to "collapse" into pulverized dust no matter how much thermate/explosives or planes they throw at it

Insult

"snake cunning Vice-POTUS."
That's an insult to snakes.

How stupid do they think we are?? Oh never mind.

BBC is the Conspiracy

BBC has underestimated and insulted their audience. MSM is in decline and BBC is just more proof.

WEBSITE: http://gators911truth.org
YOUTUBE: http://youtube.com/gators911truth
YOUTUBE: http://youtube.com/Hsaive

Not A Bad Documentary Actually

Most of our best cards were played. The first 30 minutes reflected very well on our side of the argument.

The alternative explanations for the iron spheres were very uncoordinated (torches for example, were not utilized 20 minutes after the tower collapses, when one dust sample was collected.)

The NIST explanations about WTC 7 are based on pure speculation. They allege structural failure without producing one piece of evidence. Other arguments were simply emotional in nature. The eroded steel may not be the smoking gun once thought. However, the molten metal and microspheres are.

FACT: Certain energetic materials (thermite, thermate) will destroy steel in seconds.

FACT: Destroyed structural steel is why buildings can fall in seconds.

FACT: Thermitic reactions do not necessarily involve the massive, window shattering explosions cited by Mr. Lezeaux.

Barry Jenning's LTW interview presents a major problem for the official story. (People being stepped over are generally dead or unconcious. Are there any accounts of the removal of unconcious casualties from WTC 7?)

And Dylan Avery was right: All of this ultimately boils down to money, control and power.

Fire Safety Systems

I used to operate a Simplex fire safety system in a 52 story high-rise building years ago. If I'm not mistaken, the BBC doc alleged that any alarm activations during the WTC 7 system "hold" or bypass condition did not provide the location of such an activation. This seems unlikely. In the case of the fire safety system I operated, locations of activations were indicated in order to allow personnel to investigate. The "hold" condition simply did not provide automatic notifications of the fire department. "Hold" conditions were routine and generally occurred during construction periods when dust would activate the sensors.

RE: Not A Bad Documentary, Actually

To a trained truther's eye, BBC presented substantial evidence to reinforce the facts. But the evidence was smothered by half-truths and innuendo where, for example, "conspiracy theories" was blabbed about as if it were a racial epithet. We know that BBC is capable of better journalism. Their tainted presentation reveals they were under regal pressure to bias the documentary - not only against the hard evidence - but against the character of the 9/11 truth movers.

BBC's Third Tower is just another "INSIDE JOB"

WEBSITE: http://gators911truth.org
YOUTUBE: http://youtube.com/gators911truth
YOUTUBE: http://youtube.com/Hsaive

I Was Surprised At How Much Was Presented

- Iron spheres.
- NASA thermal images.
- Jones' thermite analysis.
- Dylan Avery's video device playback of BJ.
- Comments from AE911 specialists.
- Previous building fires not resulting in collapses.

The "official story" arguments were speculative, emotional and provided by people with obvious conflicts of interest.

Agreed

I was surprised how little ammunition the OCTs brought. On one or two questions I thought BBC suckered Richard Gage into baseless speculation (which he identified as such), and that probably led to their strongest retorts. But on the matters of substance the OCTs had little to say.

The only way the general public could see this as a win for OCT is if they take speculative arguments on faith. The part where they admitted no steel from WTC7 remained to be tested, and a computer model was necessary, should have convinced the attentive viewer that NIST has nothing.

No steel from 7 was tested is a lie

expose that, please!

Sample 1 (WTC 7)

http://wtc.nist.gov/media/AppendixC-fema403_apc.pdf

Later:

Although no steel was recovered from WTC 7...

http://wtc.nist.gov/oct05NCSTAR1-3index.htm

Here are additions to my rebuttal...

1) The archives to my site which contains information on the following:

Pakistan And 9/11, Sibel Edmonds, The Project For The New American Century, Professor Steven E. Jones, Dr. David Ray Griffin, The Moussaoui Trial, The Iraq War, Halliburton, The 9/11 Families, Iran, Able Danger, The National Energy Policy Development Group - Energy Task Force, Family Steering Committee Testimony, Israel, Afghanistan, Dick Cheney, Cynthia McKinney, Military Exercises, Or Wargames, Related To 9/11, 9/11 Truth C-SPAN Appearances, What Qualifies As Suspicious Behavior?, A Section On Who Was Blocked From Doing Their Job, And Who Was Promoted, The Warnings, The Environmental Impact Of 9/11, July 10th, 2001, More About The Environmental Impact Of 9/11, The Destruction Of CIA Interrogation Tapes, More About The Environmental Impact Of 9/11, and The Guantanamo 9/11 Detainee Military Tribunals.

2) A link to my extensive "Who Is? Archives" which is based on the information at www.cooperativeresearch.org. 9/11 Family Member Lorie Van Auken, 9/11 First Responder John Feal, and cooperativeresearch.org contributor, Kevin Fenton have contributed to this collection.

3) Here is a documentary entitled, "9/11: Press For Truth."

4) Here is a documentary entitled, "In Their Own Words, The Untold Stories Of The 9/11 Families."

Here's what I have to say about the ending of "The Third Tower."


Now that you've created a documentary concerning one problem with regards to the 9/11 attacks, why don't you do your job, and force a new investigation for the 1000's of other problems with the 9/11 attacks?


Do these people deserve to know how and why their loved ones were murdered? Do we deserve to know how and why 9/11 happened?

Not bloody likely.

"Now that you've created a documentary concerning one problem with regards to the 9/11 attacks, why don't you do your job, and force a new investigation for the 1000's of other problems with the 9/11 attacks?"

Their next stop is 7/7, where they will continue in the same trajectory.

I know...

And you know what else? The information posted above is a FRACTION of the information that I have. I'm sure it's a FRACTION of the total information that exists concerning the 9/11 attacks... but noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo... the media wants to paint us as the movement that think the buildings were brought down by Controlled Demolition, and a missile hit the Pentagon, and the "debunkers" are MORE THAN HAPPY to help them out. Where was the media before Loose Change? Where? The movement existed LONG BEFORE the inception of Loose Change. No offense to Dylan & Co.




Do these people deserve to know how and why their loved ones were murdered? Do we deserve to know how and why 9/11 happened?

I have always said

WTC 7 isn't just a smoking gun, it is absolute proof that 9/11 was an inside job. It was a controlled demolition. There is no way to debunk it. That is why the 911 Commission didn't mention it in their report. Personally, I didn't even know about that building coming down until two years after the fact. They never showed it on TV except when it happened and that was it. I happened to stumble across it two years later on the internet. Quite a few people still don't know about it. Amazing!

The lid on WTC 7 has been

The lid on WTC 7 has been blown off.

Jennings

...........You know what? Maybe they said they were going to skin you're family alive in front of you? You know what happened Barry.
If i knew the truth i would go down swinging ! The truth is coming Barry. MAN UP!

Barry Jennings Uncut

The earlier unedited interview with Louder than Words was released:
http://www.911blogger.com/node/16573

Linked here for posterity - I'm sure most of you have already seen this. But I had to look it up after hearing Barry Jennings has a completely new and different story in this documentary. I'd give the earlier, unedited version of his story much more weight.

My favorite comment: "I'd

My favorite comment:

"I'd make a good terrorist."

Mark Loizeaux

Sounds like a story ?

..............Let's cut through the Bullsh**t ,and lay the cards on the table !

Off-topic, but did anyone

Off-topic, but did anyone notice there is a pro-McCain ad running on the blogads column to the left? That's pretty awful to see on here.

It's auto-generated by a text bot

that scans content on the blog.

McCain's a twat.

Glad the site is making some revenue from him

its not like he's going to find any converts here . . . this is a Cynthia McKinney supporting blog!

Not terrible, could be much better

At the end of the show, Lieutenant Frank Papalia said

"I think they have no respect for all the friends of mine that I lost, for all the people that died that day, it's like a slap in their face."

However, I don't believe any firemen were lost in WTC 7, so this quote seems to be cherry-picked in order to cast aspersions on WTC7 conspiracy claimants. (To be sure, all of these will be 911 Conspiracy claimants, but the show's focus is about WTC 7.) I don't think that's showing respect for Lieutenant Papalia, even if he feels that way, personally. Besides the cherry-picking aspect, I can't help wonder about the placement of this segment at the very end of the show. Is that because this is what we are supposed to remember, above all else? Is this simply a propaganda ploy?

Furthermore, although I thought the program was balanced, if I was an honest investigative journalist I would have certainly re-interviewed Jowenko, showed him the clips of Loizeaux, and then asked for a response. An EXPERT response. Why didn't BBC do this?

The question of the sound and window-shattering effects of CD explosives is raised. But, unfortunately, the question of the sound associated with various formulations of nano-thermite detonations, of different intensities, is not discussed in the program. This is a technical question, but one which the BBC, which obviously had some kind of budget, could have pursued. Apparently, they either didn't think of it, didn't try, or tried and failed. I can't tell from watching the program, can you?

I also have questions as how many firemen were even in the building, since, as the program showed, the collapses caused failures in the water system. Are firemen in the habit of rambling through a building, with either no water-supplied firehoses, or else an insufficient amount of them? I should think not. Therefore, a serious investigative reporter would have asked such rather obvious questions, and tried to quantifiy the amount of water that was applied to the building, especially from the inside, vs. what was necessary. That would have provided some type of cross-check as to how many firemen were inside the building, or at least how many would have made sense to be inside the building. The question of how many firemen were inside the building is non-trivial, since if the building was jury-rigged quickly on 9/11 for CD, large numbers of them might well have seen CD artifacts. The NIST guy, Dr. Shyam Sunder, gave what I thought was a rather disingenous argument, when he pointed out that a column which has lost structural integrity can fail quickly.

Duh.

The question is, how could ENOUGH of the columns fail so quickly that a symmetrical collapse is produced. There's a large time span, so perhaps some kind of argument could be made that sequential losses of columns' structural integrity occurred relatively slowly, but that a critical number was attained only over a brief time span. Why was the BBC not astute enough to ask a rather obvious question of Dr. Sunder? Especially since they interview ae911truth's Kamal Obeid, a structural engineer, who expresses doubt that simultaneous collapse of all columns is possible, even if local failures of one or two are not. Instead, they have incorporated a non-explanation explanation into their show.

If we had wanted that, we could have just asked the government - they're just full of non-explanations!

Perhaps the best example of how non-critical the BBC program was is when they showed Dr. Gene Corley. Dr. Gene Corley tells us that evidence for controlled demolition was looked for, but no details are provided. Oh, heck, why would the BBC want to bother Dr. Corley for such details, just because they're doing a show on WTC 7 CD claims?

In sum, the BBC program was balanced, but of questionable fairness, as it was unquestionably non-critical. (In fairness, I note that it could have been more critical of the CD proponents, also.)

http://www.pdamerica.org
http://www.change-congress.org

Agreed

Could have been better, but it was far better than the last one they did on 9/11. In this one, the BBC reported most of the CD evidence that I wanted to see reported.

I only had to take one break to go throw up when they interviewed Mark Roberts as some kind of expert on the issue. Instead of putting "WTC7 LIES" in the caption under his name, they should have said "Tour Guide". Other than that, though, it was pretty balanced. We could not expect them to favor (sorry, favour) our side. All I expected was that most of the CD evidence was presented, and it was.

Always remember that they can never take people away from our side. That is impossible. The only possible impact they can have is to add to our numbers. How many remains to be seen.

Propaganda

"I think they have no respect for all the friends of mine that I lost, for all the people that died that day, it's like a slap in their face."

It's the built-up of an emotional resictance to think- or propaganda
.
No matter if one firefighter does think so, they'll never tell us about the other 300 who casts doubts on the events and the thousands who'll die due to "the air is safe to breathe."

http://z15.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=1563&...

My play by play...

But how pissed is this video going to make me???

Should I go empty my stomach and bowels first??
------------

Ok...

Edit #1--- ok 6 minutes in... and I am not upset yet...

Edit #2-- 12:33 --- Direct hit my ass!!... What a LOAD... Ok I am getting my barf bucket..

Edit #3--- Who told Barry Jennings family that he was dead???? --- And who in the fuck has ever said that the NYC FIRE DEPARTMENT "planned the destruction of Building 7" as the narrator smoothly implies????

Edit #4--- Uh .. who has ever implied that the peons in the fire dept were involved in the conspiracy??-- I am 25 minutes in.. and the disinformation chaff is flying thick now..

Edit #5--- I was puking ... so I must of missed the coherent explanation regarding BBC reporting BLDG 7 falling 20 mins before hand..

Edit #6--- Oh yeah .. good source.. Control Demo Inc.. .. ..

Edit #7--- What does an Explosion sound like??... Obviously not like an explosion... probably more like a butterfly fart...

Edit #8--- Thermite would not blow out windows... or leave det cord or blast caps ... but it would certainly leave molten pits at 700C 16 weeks later...

Edit #9--- the spheres are from cutting torches... you think a Ceramic housing could contain thermite to cut beams??.. naturally.. yes I have puked again #3... 36 min in..

Edit #10--- CDI did the demo job on 911??... yeah I am so sure he is the only one that could.. ... and oh goody.. now getting into the fire bringing it down..

Edit #11--- Ahh... Reuters did it... to the BBC..

Edit #12--- .... ... "I stepped on the bodies... but I did not SEE them"...

Ok the bullshit gets really thick at the end...

Edit #13--- Ok so now NORMAL building fires caused it... because it burned for SOOOO long... ......I need dialysis to clean the filth out of my bloodstream now...

Edit # 14--- Mark Price... you expect me to take you seriously that you can see reality? You can't even see the gigantic WART on your cheek... so we already know you delude yourself.. get that crap snipped.

Edit #15--- Yeah Government is incompetent... and they can't keep any secrets...

Excellent Play By Play

I am with you all the way through. Thanks tryptamine! Great job! And Hilarious!!!

Tryptamine 2.0

The original tryptamine died in his sleep last night due to his body getting septic from viewing said documentary... hence the cessation of updates.

This is the new and improved version wishes to rely the thanks of the first one posthumously, spreading laughter was and is the primary goal to this abomination we are in.

Due to what happened to the original .. I will not be able to view it again... I is too scared!

:D

Let's build a JUGGERNAUT. [Build ae911truth.org]

JUGGERNAUT: "a force regarded as unstoppable, that will crush all in its path."

Can you imagine 1,000 architects and engineers supporting the fact that explosives were used? Come on...Who can fight that?...what is the opposition gonna say?...Are debunkers and the media gonna say that one thousand architects and engineers are liers?

One thousand architects is a JUGGERNAUT. One thousand architects and engineers is a JUGGERNAUT that will roll right over the few dozen government sponsored experts and make them squashed baloney.

Less than 2 minutes.


If WTC-7 collapsed due to fires, how come I don't see any flames

venting from any of the thousands of windows AS THE BUILDING FELL DOWN!?

If there were an inferno inside Building 7, I'd expect to see an abundance of flames/fireballs shooting out as it caves in! Yet, I don't see any flames/fireballs being expelled in the videos of WTC-7 during its collapse!?

Seems to me that Dr. Steven Jones is correct--thermate was used as a powerful incendiary to melt/cut the beams.

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